USFS Cleveland National Forest using P25 digital?

[inigo88]

Hey guys,

It has been brought to my attention that a user in Orange county has noticed that the Cleveland National Forest Law Net on 168.025 MHz is now digital.

Can anyone in the vicinity of San Diego take a listen on 168.025 MHz and confirm this?

Originally Posted by Exsmokey

I have yet to hear (and most likely not have forgotten) of a USFS or BLM system using digital. All the handhelds and mobiles have to be equipped with it, but I've not heard of it is being used. When all the base/repeater equipment were replaced to comply with narrow band standards I would imagine it had to be digital capable as well, but I don't know that for sure.

Fred, do you think they read your post?

Regards,

Inigo

[Mick]

The Law Enforcement officers like to use it from time to time even though dispatch answers in analog.

[inigo88]

Good to know, thanks Mick!

Have you ever been able to catch a NAC?

[brandon]

They are both, so far I only hear occasional digital being used in the Santa Ana mountains. I have no idea how it works down south.
168.0250 - 103.5 - Cleveland National Forest - Law Net Analog
168.0250 - $40B - Cleveland National Forest - Law Net Digital

[ssd]

usfs want to go full p25 this year. i read. they are now carring bk digital radio dphx5102x i know cuz i have 1 in my hand.

[Exsmokey]

Originally Posted by inigo88

Hey guys,

It has been brought to my attention that a user in Orange county has noticed that the Cleveland National Forest Law Net on 168.025 MHz is now digital.

Can anyone in the vicinity of San Diego take a listen on 168.025 MHz and confirm this?



Fred, do you think they read your post?

Regards,










Inigo

The reason I purchased a PRO-96 was because I heard a Forest Service LEO testing the digital mode on his mobiles and handhelds. This on both 168.025 and 166.125. That was in 2005 and it is likely that there won't be any other digital employed in my area for quite some time.

For several years every USFS mobile and portable radio purchased must be digital capable. The guidance for the use of the four "Intra-crew" frequencies encourage crews to use digital with NAC's rather than analog with CTCSS. This in an attempt to lessen cross communication with other crews.

As far as I know the use of digital, as explained above, has been limited to simplex or tactical use.

I would imagine this directive to have mobiles/handhelds digital capable applies to bases and repeaters as well, but I haven't seen that in writing yet. A little searching may find this.

Some of the USFS radio techs I've been in contact with predict that digital use will cause coverage problems greater than those caused by narrow banding. The growth in the number of repeaters on each National Forest since 2005 is notable.

I think that Sequoia-Kings Canyon National Park is using digital on its backcountry net. I have a UHF link frequency I can hear in Mammoth that down links this net off Silver Peak and I recently have only heard noise. This means the remote base is not digital even if the repeaters on the net are. This remote base is used for the BLM Bishop Field Office net and for some reason it also receives the backcountry net of Seq/Kings.

My observations are a mixed bag right now and things are changing quickly. I would love to hear of other people's observations. I don't travel as much as I used to due to limited funds.

[monitor142]

That OC guy would be me. I caught the P25 traffic while doing a fed band search a few months ago. At that time I had all my P25 capable radios and scanners in PL decode for all the Cleveland channels. As Brandon stated, the output NAC is 40B. They do reference using Tone 2 when calling Cleveland dispatch in digital.

They do a mix of digital and analog on the Law Net channel. From what I can tell it's the repeater on Santiago Peak which I live under. I do not know if any of the other Law Net repeaters in the CNF area are P25 as of yet.

Regards.
M142

[wayne_h]

There's a LawNet repeater on 166.125 set up for P25 in NorCal. I think it's for the El Dorado NF area. I've never heard anyone talking on it though. NAC 40B.

And somewhat unrelated but I've caught Yosemite NP Law channel 172.6500 ("Crane") operating in P25 mode.

[inigo88]

Thanks a bunch guys. The USFS California page has been updated to reflect the change. Now... if only we knew the input frequency to CNF's law net repeaters?

Regards,

Inigo

[Exsmokey]

Originally Posted by wayne_h

There's a LawNet repeater on 166.125 set up for P25 in NorCal. I think it's for the El Dorado NF area. I've never heard anyone talking on it though. NAC 40B.

And somewhat unrelated but I've caught Yosemite NP Law channel 172.6500 ("Crane") operating in P25 mode.

Wayne, Yosemite's 172.650 is actually the park's "Park Net." Law enforcement away from the Yosemite Valley is done on this net. It appears, but not confirmed, that law enforcement in the Valley is done on their new law net. I looks like they have LE Net repeaters at the same locations they have "Valley Net" repeaters, those being Turtleback Dome and Sentinel Dome. The frequency had been listed in the database for some time, then removed the last time the Yosemite listing was revised. I know what the frequency is, but can't relate it due to the manner in which I found out about it.

If you know the frequency it is up to you whether to list it or not, however, if I was making the decision I would not list it.

[Exsmokey]

Originally Posted by inigo88

Thanks a bunch guys. The USFS California page has been updated to reflect the change. Now... if only we knew the input frequency to CNF's law net repeaters?

Regards,

Inigo

When updating Forest Service frequency information keep in mind that 168.025 has been designated "National Law Enforcement Tactical." Its intended nationwide use is for simplex. The 166.125 frequency is, I believe, a Region 5 law enforcement frequency. The demarcation of north and south in the use of this frequency for the repeater output vs. 168.025 is not the same as the line between North Ops and South Ops. The Sierra National Forest and I believe the Sequoia National Forest uses 166.125 as their law enforcement net, both Forests being in "South Zone."

The use of 168.025 as a repeater output might just include the four southern California National Forests, Cleveland, San Bernardino, Angeles and Los Padres.

[dirt992]

try 168.625 for input for CNF law net

[Exsmokey]

Originally Posted by dirt992

try 168.625 for input for CNF law net

168.625 is National Air Guard. At one time there were some air guard repeaters, a situation that no longer exists. 168.025 was the repeater input for these air guard repeaters.

168.625 is still national air guard and remote bases are used rather than repeaters. Most National Forests only need one of these and it is usually located at a forest's hub radio site.

[dirt992]

Exsmokey I got my info from a fed radio tec. how ever i did find this site National Incident Radio Support Cache page down to forest service law enforcement frequency and see what you think?

[northzone]

Originally Posted by wayne_h

There's a LawNet repeater on 166.125 set up for P25 in NorCal. I think it's for the El Dorado NF area. I've never heard anyone talking on it though. NAC 40B.

Wayne, I heard 2 forest service LE units talking on 166.125 in P25 mode. I am not sure, but from a location given I thought it was most likely Tahoe National Forest. I will keep a listen.

[Exsmokey]

Originally Posted by dirt992

Exsmokey I got my info from a fed radio tec. how ever i did find this site National Incident Radio Support Cache page down to forest service law enforcement frequency and see what you think?

I've looked at that site for years. The discussion relative to 168.025 is correct. The rest of the site is very out of date. Many changes to the NIFC large incident frequencies have occurred, some of them about 10 years ago.

[wayne_h]

Originally Posted by northzone

Wayne, I heard 2 forest service LE units talking on 166.125 in P25 mode. I am not sure, but from a location given I thought it was most likely Tahoe National Forest. I will keep a listen.

It could be; I can hear up toward Reno with my listening post. I took it out of my recording list as the constant beacon-like P25 burps kept making the receiver open up.

Originally Posted by exsmokey

If you know the frequency it is up to you whether to list it or not, however, if I was making the decision I would not list it.

I have no idea. What I've heard on 172.6500 has been one person calling another. No one ever answers. IIRC it was someone LE related. I'll make better note next time.

[inigo88]

Not to get too off topic, but Yosemite National Park appears to occur twice in the database right now. Once in the National Park Service regional page, and once in the Yosemite National Park regional page. The YNP entry in NPS does not list a law net, but the Yosemite National Park page lists something that could be it:

It's titled "L.E Operations" in the description.

[Exsmokey]

Originally Posted by inigo88

Not to get too off topic, but Yosemite National Park appears to occur twice in the database right now. Once in the National Park Service regional page, and once in the Yosemite National Park regional page. The YNP entry in NPS does not list a law net, but the Yosemite National Park page lists something that could be it:

It's titled "L.E Operations" in the description.

Not off topic at all. Yosemite doesn't need a separate listing or header in the database. The information presented in the separate header should be removed. It is this type of information that gets this hobby into trouble and results in the use of encryption.

Thanks for pointing this out. I did not find my information about this frequency on this site and cannot, and will not, share it. There is more than meets the eye here and this is more of a sensitive issue than many may realize.

[judas12]

Hello guys
On L.A. County Fire, do you have to listen to Blue 8, Blue 1 South and here everything being broadcasted or is their a way just to hear a specific station like Cerritos Station 35 or the stations in Norwalk and Pico ?

Thanks