RadioReference on Facebook   RadioReference on Twitter   RadioReference Blog
 

Go Back   The RadioReference.com Forums > Announcements and News > Community Announcements and News

Community Announcements and News Announcements and News of interest to the RadioReference.com Community. All new threads posted here will be moderated by the administrators. Members are encouraged to post news and information here for the community.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2011, 9:22 AM
Temporarily Banned
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 1,043
Question Naples, FL - Officers to share radios?

Naples leaders bristle at cost of new police radios, suggest officers share - POLL Naples Daily News
Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2011, 6:56 PM
wuzafuzz's Avatar
Member
  Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Posts: 161
Default

We shared radios all the time when I worked as a cop. They worked fine. The arguments made in the article are unpersuasive. I like radios as much as the next guy, probably more, but a very expensive radio for each officer is wasteful IMHO. Stock up on spare batteries and have some spare radios, but giving everyone their own plus having spares is a want, not a need.
__________________
Eric Wuz Here
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2011, 7:13 PM
Member
   
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 124
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wuzafuzz View Post
We shared radios all the time when I worked as a cop. They worked fine. The arguments made in the article are unpersuasive. I like radios as much as the next guy, probably more, but a very expensive radio for each officer is wasteful IMHO. Stock up on spare batteries and have some spare radios, but giving everyone their own plus having spares is a want, not a need.
I agree with this to an extent but in smaller departments it's possible to have at least 75% of the entire department working at a given time for special events. In that case you basically need a radio for each person. A better alternative might be to not have radios in the vehicles and let the officers use their mobiles for all communications (this is done by most NYPD units for example).
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2011, 7:24 PM
Ishmole's Avatar
Member
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Walden, NY
Posts: 86
Default

Wuzz a Fuzz is right. We share them at my agency. Most PD's do. If you turn out 20 officers on a shift, you get 30 radios and extra batteries. The extras make up for radios that are out for repair, or needed for special details, overtime, etc. We lease the entire system and change out everyting after 5 years..The lease includes all service and replacements. The municipality then knows what to budget well in advance.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2011, 7:50 PM
Member
   
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 232
Default

I respectfully disagree. I believe every officer should have a portable radio, just like every officer should have a firearm. Its a life saving devise just as important. I would rather drive a cruiser with a magnetic bubble that plugged into a 12v outlet than be without my radio and rely on my partner. You just never know what will happen out in the field. A portable radio is a lifeline for every single person out there. If it costs too much money for a dept to outfit every person with a radio than i would spend the remaining money at the end of budget time to figure out the flaw.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2011, 8:37 PM
Ishmole's Avatar
Member
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Walden, NY
Posts: 86
Default

Ideally, it (everyone with their own radio) is better. I would love to outfit each officer with his own radio and tablet/laptop with mesh connectivity, but it would be cost prohibitive now. Maybe in a few years! I guess the radio thing is a regional/legacy type of thing. A lot of departments equip each officer, but none here in the NE that I know of. Maybe because the departments were around before radio!
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2011, 12:21 AM
Member
   
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Packetpeeker
Posts: 35
Cool radios for each officer

Philadelphia outfits every officer with his/her own radio as well as most deleware county and Bucks county PD's, also i know phila does not equip firefighters with radios except for the line officers unless that has recently changed, deleware county on the other hand i believe that 1 out of every two firefighters especially inside a premiss fire is equiped with a radio and every firepolice officer is equiped.

As was previously stated this device is a LIFELINE and with additional federal funding pushing interoperability every fire or police officer should be outfitted with a dependable radio.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2011, 7:04 AM
wuzafuzz's Avatar
Member
  Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Posts: 161
Default

It is absolutely correct that radios are a lifeline. However there is NO reason shared radios can't be dependable. I've lived it. It works. If personnel are trashing shared equipment then there are more serious problems with the dept.

As long as the radios used by ON-DUTY coppers are setup for mutual aid channels Interoperability does not suffer because they are shared. Again, as long as on-duty officers have radios all is well. Seriously, how often is every member of a large dept on duty at once? Even in disasters they have to rotate in and out. Msradell was right though, smaller depts need a higher percentage of radios. I worked in a tiny dept for a while and most had radios (but still not all).
__________________
Eric Wuz Here
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2011, 7:24 AM
Member
  Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Lower Hudson Valley New York
Posts: 1,661
Default

When radios were under 1K dollars, I agree that each officer should have his own, but since radios now run between 2.5k and 5K!!!, there is no reason why each officer should have his own when they will only sit in their lockers. BTW NYPD for the most part does not have radios installed in their sector RMP's. All officers pick up a radio at role call and get batteries from behind the front desk, there are 3 charger banks, one for each shift. For major incident radios are provided at the scene. At least that's how it was when I worked on a 911 ambulance back in the 70-80's.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2011, 8:17 AM
Member
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 32
Default

All of our officers have their own portables, and I'm fairly certain that is the norm around here.

Between details, court, special assignments, and the regular shifts it is just easier. With out that, every officer would have to come to the station before a detail or court or what have you which would be a major hassle.

But in my mind the main issue is the MDC ID. Our dispatch consoles show the officers name when they are on their portable. That is a whole lot quicker than having to cross reference a list of who has what.
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2011, 8:37 AM
Ishmole's Avatar
Member
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Walden, NY
Posts: 86
Default

Again, it would be ideal for each to have his own radio. However, shared radios work well and are just as safe and in these days of tight budgets, it can rightly be seen as a way to save money.
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2011, 8:56 AM
Member
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 32
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishmole View Post
Again, it would be ideal for each to have his own radio. However, shared radios work well and are just as safe and in these days of tight budgets, it can rightly be seen as a way to save money.
Well lets just put it this way for our city. We have to pay each officer when they go to court, currently they are only paid while they are at court. If we were to require them to come to the station to pick up a portable, and return to drop it off we would need to add an additional hour to their pay. So playing out those numbers (rounded and hypothetical assuming an officer's court rate is $45 and hour and goes to court 30 times a year) you'd get a extra cost of $1,350 per year. Issuing them their own portable pays for itself in less than 2 years. That's not including the cost of the same requirement for detail officers, and keep in mind there the contractors will only pay for time officers are on site leaving the city with this hour to pay.
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2011, 12:06 PM
Member
   
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Manatee/Sarasota FL
Posts: 80
Default

thumbs up to Naples Fl for trying to save the taxpayers some money. I think sharing radios is a great idea,it provides the needed communication to on duty officers without the radio just sitting on the charger at the officers house collecting dust when that officer isnt working. i think also if certain officers are hell bent on having their own radio their department should say ok but if you want your own radio the cost of that radio is coming out of your paycheck. that way the officers who want to have their own radio and think its worth spending $3000 to $5000 can and the ones who dont mind sharing radios can save themselves a few thousand dollars . i also think it would be a great idea for more departments here in fl to put an end to take home squad cars and share those as well. take home cars are a total waste of tax dollars and have no benefits that i can see. i live in sarasota and almost any neighborhood or apartment complex you drive through you see Sheriff or city police cars just parked in a driveways not being used ,what a waste of my tax dollars.i think sharing of radios and squad cars is a great idea and makes alot of sense in this economic climate.
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2011, 12:34 PM
Member
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hernando County, FL
Posts: 405
Default

Hey they can always call for help on their personal cell phones if they get separated from their partner with the radio. Insert eye roll here.
__________________
Steve
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2011, 1:27 PM
Ishmole's Avatar
Member
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Walden, NY
Posts: 86
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FLA2760 View Post
Hey they can always call for help on their personal cell phones if they get separated from their partner with the radio. Insert eye roll here.
...or call him/her on their radio. With "sharing" each on duty officer takes out a radio when they turn out for duty. Two working officers, even if they are partners, each take a radio.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2011, 9:53 PM
wuzafuzz's Avatar
Member
  Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Posts: 161
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nsradio View Post
Well lets just put it this way for our city. We have to pay each officer when they go to court, currently they are only paid while they are at court. If we were to require them to come to the station to pick up a portable, and return to drop it off we would need to add an additional hour to their pay. So playing out those numbers (rounded and hypothetical assuming an officer's court rate is $45 and hour and goes to court 30 times a year) you'd get a extra cost of $1,350 per year. Issuing them their own portable pays for itself in less than 2 years. That's not including the cost of the same requirement for detail officers, and keep in mind there the contractors will only pay for time officers are on site leaving the city with this hour to pay.
Why do they need radios in court? Aren't there on-duty bailiffs who are responsible for court security? Most cops I knew didn't even wear uniforms to court, they wore suits. Plus the courthouse was a pretty safe place, with metal detectors at all entrances.
__________________
Eric Wuz Here
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 06-30-2011, 8:40 AM
Member
   
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Carolinas
Posts: 4
Default I disagree.

Whereas I was an Agency Head in SW Florida having retired after 32 years, I would like to say, I agree with the shared radio concept. It is a hard core sell even at todays GSA pricing schedules for any budget justification in these times when we cannot even provide a COLA increase to employees, nevermind a pay or parity adjustment.

However in the vehicle area, I disagree. I worked in both areas of admins where both plans were utilized. One was shared vehicles, that ran 24/7. They never stopped. These vehicles wore out in less that a year, had no resale value, and maintenance was higher. Say what you will but officers do not take care of a non issued vehicle. I know I know, inspections, sign outs, yada yada yada. It doesnt work. On the other hand when the vehicles were issued, they were well kept, clean, and lasted at least Five years. The problems I do see with such a program is that the line drawn as to WHOM gets a take home vehicle was ill administered. I do not think administrators should be issued a vehicle UNLESS they respond to emergencies and callouts which some do and are bound by responsibilities to do. Civilian personnel do not need assigned vehicles, unless the criteria above applies.

I did not have an assigned vehicle. I was compensated for fuel and maintenance under a statute in Florida which allows agency heads to do. Desk jobs, 8 to 5vers etc do not need a vehicle. I kept two or three "admin pool" cars for when there was a need temporarily. But there were several times we had incidents (wildfires, hostage, large groups, warrant service) where we had to call out a lot of off duty officers. Had they needed to go get a vehicle, etc we would have been in big problems. And no they cannot just do like TV and throw a blue light on top of their POV's and haul.

So anyway I agree with the radio concept. Also a sidenote to a few whom said issue portables only no mobiles, we could not get away with that where I was nor I know a few more counties who could not either as our infrastructure did not have enough sites for portable to portable coverage. The County did not want to pay for the 16 sites Simulcast or Multicast that the vendors originally proposed. SO we needed a mobile to guarantee some sort of communications.

Another thing that irks me is the "KINGS CASTLE" ideaology. There is no problem with shared systems and each agency does not need to have their own infrastructure or system just to say they run it or own it. With todays technology and ability to segregate them, it is a non argument.






Quote:
Originally Posted by bradpradio7420 View Post
thumbs up to Naples Fl for trying to save the taxpayers some money. I think sharing radios is a great idea,it provides the needed communication to on duty officers without the radio just sitting on the charger at the officers house collecting dust when that officer isnt working. i think also if certain officers are hell bent on having their own radio their department should say ok but if you want your own radio the cost of that radio is coming out of your paycheck. that way the officers who want to have their own radio and think its worth spending $3000 to $5000 can and the ones who dont mind sharing radios can save themselves a few thousand dollars . i also think it would be a great idea for more departments here in fl to put an end to take home squad cars and share those as well. take home cars are a total waste of tax dollars and have no benefits that i can see. i live in sarasota and almost any neighborhood or apartment complex you drive through you see Sheriff or city police cars just parked in a driveways not being used ,what a waste of my tax dollars.i think sharing of radios and squad cars is a great idea and makes alot of sense in this economic climate.
Reply With Quote
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 06-30-2011, 11:12 AM
Member
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 32
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wuzafuzz View Post
Why do they need radios in court? Aren't there on-duty bailiffs who are responsible for court security? Most cops I knew didn't even wear uniforms to court, they wore suits. Plus the courthouse was a pretty safe place, with metal detectors at all entrances.
Officers in court are considered on duty at the request of the court, and required to carry their duty weapon, badge, and a set of cuffs even if they are not in uniform. Bailiffs are great, but have no power of arrest and the majority are not armed. And the Sheriff's deputies assigned to prisoners do not have power of arrest either. Even with metal detectors we have had many incidents with weapons in the 4 courts in my city, including 2 armed stand offs in recent years. So yeah, lets let them carry a gun but not be able to tell anyone where they are...
Reply With Quote
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 06-30-2011, 8:48 PM
Member
   
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 232
Default

3-5K for a portable radio. Now that makes my eyes roll. Absolutely ridiculous, no need of it.. But it is what it is. Just think if they were between 600-900, you could have a spare for every officer. But again its all on where you are and what type of system. Its a shame. I guess maybe thats part of the reason NXDN and IDAS systems are popping up everywhere.
Reply With Quote
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 07-01-2011, 10:10 PM
RodStrong's Avatar
Member
  Shack Photos
Shack photos
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,031
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bradpradio7420 View Post
i also think it would be a great idea for more departments here in fl to put an end to take home squad cars and share those as well. take home cars are a total waste of tax dollars and have no benefits that i can see. i live in sarasota and almost any neighborhood or apartment complex you drive through you see Sheriff or city police cars just parked in a driveways not being used ,what a waste of my tax dollars.i think sharing of radios and squad cars is a great idea and makes alot of sense in this economic climate.
Talk to any Fleet manager of a decent sized agency with take home rigs and pool cars, and you'll quickly learn a lot about how take home cars clearly save taxpayers money in several ways, last much, much longer, and have many other benefits you can't put a price tag on.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 7:17 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
All information here is Copyright 2012 by RadioReference.com LLC and Lindsay C. Blanton III.Ad Management by RedTyger
Copyright 2011 by RadioReference.com LLC Privacy Policy  |  Terms and Conditions