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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 04-21-2013, 12:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blantonl View Post
With that said - CAP is going to learn all about the Streisand Effect

Streisand effect - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Yes, a quick Google search allowed me to see 2 CAP documents, one dated June 3, 2010 and a more detailed one dated December 26, 2012. Not sure which one was the source of the letter, but it was a waste of time as they are readily available across the net and as you correctly pointed out they will likely grow. A stupid action on their part.

Also, after reading the legal counsel's letter I am assuming grammar isn't a pre-requisite for law school?
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old 04-21-2013, 12:19 PM
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Default Re: RadioReference receives a Cease and Desist Demand from the Civil Air Patrol

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Originally Posted by dfbailey View Post
Also, after reading the legal counsel's letter I am assuming grammar isn't a pre-requisite for law school?
I though the same thing. That is the worst written law brief, ever.



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  #43 (permalink)  
Old 04-21-2013, 12:41 PM
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Just added my thoughts to my Bailey Tactical link below. Don't want to get RR in trouble. :-)
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  #44 (permalink)  
Old 04-21-2013, 7:34 PM
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^ Awesome, David!
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  #45 (permalink)  
Old 04-21-2013, 7:43 PM
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Default Somebody needs a chill pill....

I would at least think that if I was going to send an official somewhat threatening letter, I would atleast use the damn grammar/spell check button. Makes them look even more like a fool with the grammar mistakes.

HAHAHAHA... I stand behind radioreference and its members 100%!!!
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  #46 (permalink)  
Old 04-21-2013, 10:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Confuzzled View Post
Try as you might to make them sound 'official', I see them as a social or fraternal organization somewhere between the Boy Scouts and the ROTC, but certainly not as any kind of authority.

For that matter, I wasn't even sure they still existed. At one time, they were looked on as sort of the 'R.E.A.C.T.' of the air, if you're familiar with them.
I didn't try to make anything "sound official," just presented a few facts. Some CAP squadrons are all about cadets and are similar to scouts, JROTC, or Explorer programs. Others are more involved in emergency services and SAR. That's not trying to sound official, we just work hard to help where we can. The realities can vary widely due to location, state laws, and CAP relationship with the public

I've personally participated in relief efforts after tornados and wildfires, aerial fire watch missions during our devastating fire season last year, and recent missions to find missing aircraft. My friends have made saves of survivors from plane crashes in remote areas and have located missing hikers for local SAR ground teams. That's rewarding.

It's true some losers find their way into CAP. Unfortunately the goober stories sometimes get more traction than the success stories.

At any rate, there is more to CAP than has met some eyes.
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  #47 (permalink)  
Old 04-22-2013, 8:18 AM
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The Civil Air Patrol is pretty official. It is the civilian auxiliary to the United States Air Force.

They are bound by whatever policies USAF tells them to follow.

However, I doubt the "officialness" of the letter. It should not have come from a civilian attorney who happens to belong to CAP. It should have come from the Pentagon. Anything less is just somebody trying to throw their weight around. The lower in the chain they are, the heavier they will try to appear.
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  #48 (permalink)  
Old 04-22-2013, 10:14 AM
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According to the posted letter head from CAP Hqs which is in fact at Maxwell AFB the letter is from the General Counsel of CAP, his contact info is an email addresse which ends in ".gov" a domain reserved for government officials. What about it makes you doubt it is an "official" letter or that it "should have come from the Pentagon"?
If you are actuallly experienced in Federal governmental affairs you would know that is not a valid remark.
This is certainly not the first rodeo for rr.com, they had similar go-arounds some years ago and adopted a policy on what the Letter had to contain and the auhtority of the signer in order to have info removed.
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  #49 (permalink)  
Old 04-22-2013, 10:56 AM
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A couple of things, NEVER trust a ".gov" e-mail unless you have initiated contact OR they government official has contacted you by other means, i.e. phone, snail mail, even fax. I am sure we have all gotten e-mails from "Robert Muller FBI Director or somebody in the Department of State concern millions of dollars either we owe or is owed to us. Ok no matter what you think of the government, they will NEVER e-mail you out of the blue.. With all that being said this IS an official letter because Lindsay has a direct link back to the gentleman who wrote it
I also agree with lep, it DOESN'T have to come from Washington to be official. I was contacted by the FAA out of Denver about a flight I once took from Des Moines to Chicago. ALL government agencies have field offices in most major cities or near by. Just as a general rule of thumb, the shorter the distance the letter travelled, the more seriously I would take it. I actually pay MORE attention to a letter coming from Maxwell AFB than a letter claiming to be originating out of the Pentagon


Quote:
Originally Posted by lep View Post
According to the posted letter head from CAP Hqs which is in fact at Maxwell AFB the letter is from the General Counsel of CAP, his contact info is an email addresse which ends in ".gov" a domain reserved for government officials. What about it makes you doubt it is an "official" letter or that it "should have come from the Pentagon"?
If you are actuallly experienced in Federal governmental affairs you would know that is not a valid remark.
This is certainly not the first rodeo for rr.com, they had similar go-arounds some years ago and adopted a policy on what the Letter had to contain and the auhtority of the signer in order to have info removed.
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  #50 (permalink)  
Old 04-22-2013, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by searingxheretic View Post
I though the same thing. That is the worst written law brief, ever.



Sent from my cm_tenderloin

While it is poorly written, just as a point, it is NOT a brief.

It is a demand letter. Most certainly not a legal brief.

Written by someone who has not yet mastered spell check.
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  #51 (permalink)  
Old 04-22-2013, 11:28 AM
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Default Now you guys have gone and done it!

Wait a minute. If we get in "bad" with the CAP who is going to tell us where to park when
we go to hamfests? In my area the CAP performs this valuable service, since none of us
would know where to park unless they directed us.

And, just to avoid misunderstanding, the above remark is intended as a joke.
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  #52 (permalink)  
Old 04-22-2013, 12:12 PM
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We are all getting pretty far from the subject but, never one to quit myself, I have a final comment about the kind of disparaging remark about a "civilian attorney." An acquantance of mine was the General Counsel of the US Department of Defense and he was a civilian, not a uniformed member of the military.
[he was treated by the military as an equivalent to a 2-star general officer]. He was in senior civilian ranks not protected by Civil Service rules so when the Administration changed, he was out of a job.
AFAK, the General Counsel of the US Airforce is also a civilian.

I assume the parking helpers are Cadets, not CAP officers
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  #53 (permalink)  
Old 04-23-2013, 8:21 AM
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What I meant by "civilian attorney" is "attorney not hired by the government to represent them." Perhaps I should have used different phrasing.

My response to such a letter would be that I want to hear from a military official, not some guy who happens to be an attorney who also just happens to be a CAP member who has already been complaining. If he truly has the authority to issue such a demand, then why does it look like a mere escalation to throwing some weight around? He should have said so in the first place.
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  #54 (permalink)  
Old 04-25-2013, 8:06 PM
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Funny, it's on scribd now also.
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  #55 (permalink)  
Old 04-25-2013, 9:49 PM
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Default Re: RadioReference receives a Cease and Desist Demand from the Civil Air Patrol

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Originally Posted by texasemt13 View Post
Funny, it's on scribd now also.
I think that's where it came from originally.
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  #56 (permalink)  
Old 04-25-2013, 11:29 PM
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I don't understand how M Keyser would ever expect that problems would ever arise from people monitoring the comm plan freqs for CAP? I understand not wanting to jeopardize frequencies allocated to your organization, but how would posting a comm plan that is already public knowledge on a scanner user message board jeopardize that in any way? After reading his email I am just left saying to my self, WTH is he talking about???

And as for the letter from the AFB, seems a little like a "boy you gonna listen to me now....hear this!" kind of letter, but I think the basis of that letter was solely that someone had posted an ORIGINAL document which they claim is "copyright" CAP and that was all that was about, nothing about losing frequencies allocation because of some mysterious happening that M Keyser was referring to in that email but never gave any valid example or explanation of/for....

Being a ham, and an avid listener, I think it's all just ridiculous. If they are P25, and they really don't want anyone listening, just use the encryption, easy solution. Why they would not want anyone listening to CAP? Who knows. Maybe that original document contained information that would enable TX'ing or the possibility of causing interference using some info in the original document and that's why they were worried, I don't know haven't seen it, but all I can say in the end is "whatever" rolling my eyes... CAP Smap pfffft
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  #57 (permalink)  
Old 04-25-2013, 11:31 PM
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BTW: I was a CAP member when I was 15. It was a great, wonderful experience.
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  #58 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2013, 3:02 AM
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Wow, I didn't know CAP was top secret squirrel stuff. BTW- We need a secret squirrel emoticon.
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  #59 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2013, 5:40 AM
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or Morocco Mole
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Originally Posted by poltergeisty View Post
Wow, I didn't know CAP was top secret squirrel stuff. BTW- We need a secret squirrel emoticon.
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