RadioReference on Facebook   RadioReference on Twitter   RadioReference Blog
 

Go Back   The RadioReference.com Forums > U.S. Regional Radio Discussion Forums > Connecticut Radio Discussion Forum

Connecticut Radio Discussion Forum Forum for discussing Radio Information in the State of Connecticut.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 07-13-2012, 9:11 PM
Lynch_Christopher's Avatar
Member
  RadioReference Database Admininstrator
Database Admin
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Syosset, New York
Posts: 691
Default Ridgefield, CT Town's aging radio systems: A failure to communicate?

From the July 13th eddition of the Ridgefield Press talking about the need for a new radio system.

Quote:
To update and coordinate the town’s aging mix-and-match radio systems, the selectmen have formed a communications task force charged with delivering a “master plan” for inclusion in the 2013-14 budget.
“Currently, between departments, it’s very difficult to talk to one another,” Fire Chief Heather Burford said last week.
“Police can’t hear the Fire Department. The highway does work off low band, so it’s a little easier for us to talk to the Highway Department. We do not have the ability to talk to the police, nor can we talk directly to the school buses.
“Communication is the most important piece of responding to an incident,” Chief Burford said. “When we can and do talk to one another, we respond better as agencies.”
The cost of revamping the radio system could run into the millions, and the effort is envisioned as taking place over the next three to five years.
Chief Burford and Dick Aarons, the town’s deputy director of emergency management, appeared before the Board of Selectmen on Wednesday, June 27, to discuss upgrading radio communications among town departments.
Link from website:
http://www.acorn-online.com/joomla15...mmunicate.html
__________________
Christopher Lynch
RadioReference.com Database Administrator for CT,MA,NH
Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 07-13-2012, 9:11 PM
Lynch_Christopher's Avatar
Member
  RadioReference Database Admininstrator
Database Admin
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Syosset, New York
Posts: 691
Default

Duplicate Post
__________________
Christopher Lynch
RadioReference.com Database Administrator for CT,MA,NH
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 07-13-2012, 9:44 PM
Lynch_Christopher's Avatar
Member
  RadioReference Database Admininstrator
Database Admin
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Syosset, New York
Posts: 691
Default

Just throwing this idea out there if all the town agencies want a new radio system could they build a new system off of the new Fairfield county overlay 700 MHz Interopability system??
__________________
Christopher Lynch
RadioReference.com Database Administrator for CT,MA,NH
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 07-14-2012, 11:31 AM
Member
  Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Washington DC
Posts: 1,935
Default

Take a look at the current Ridgefield frequency assignments, which number about twelve in all and are a mix of VHF and UHF, with maybe one lowband channel. Anyone with half a brain could renovate their current setup into something a bit more workable with a little bit of planning, and it would not have to include trunking. As it now stands their fire and police dispatch on the same channel, so I would bet that the frequency is not all that busy most of the time. Let's keep an eye on their planning and see if some hotshot sales person doesn't come along and oversell the hell out of the town's imagined "problems" and propose something far beyond the town's needs. Should be interesting.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2012, 8:26 PM
Lynch_Christopher's Avatar
Member
  RadioReference Database Admininstrator
Database Admin
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Syosset, New York
Posts: 691
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by W2NJS View Post
Take a look at the current Ridgefield frequency assignments, which number about twelve in all and are a mix of VHF and UHF, with maybe one lowband channel. Anyone with half a brain could renovate their current setup into something a bit more workable with a little bit of planning, and it would not have to include trunking. As it now stands their fire and police dispatch on the same channel, so I would bet that the frequency is not all that busy most of the time. Let's keep an eye on their planning and see if some hotshot sales person doesn't come along and oversell the hell out of the town's imagined "problems" and propose something far beyond the town's needs. Should be interesting.
Yeah it would make sense for the Ridgefield FD to ditch the lowband and go with the VHF Fire Police frequencies.I can't imagine that the Fire Police frequencies are that busy except for maybe storms.
__________________
Christopher Lynch
RadioReference.com Database Administrator for CT,MA,NH
Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 07-16-2012, 3:32 PM
Member
   
Join Date: May 2008
Location: New England
Posts: 105
Default

Just saying....... UHF P25 Trunking Simulcast........ If Weston, Westport, Wilton, Fairfield and others pooled their UHF frequencies. So many departments are running UHF portables already. In theory it would be awesome. Most departments have brand new portables but aging infrastructure.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 07-17-2012, 5:19 AM
Member
   
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 265
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lynch_Christopher View Post
Just throwing this idea out there if all the town agencies want a new radio system could they build a new system off of the new Fairfield county overlay 700 MHz Interopability system??
Thank you for the laugh so early in the AM.

You are correct, the smart thing for anyone planning a new system is to jump on any one of the new 700 systems going in (MTA, DOT, UASI) .
BUT we live in a me me me mine mine mine state and everyone wants their own thing no matter the cost!

Also the state is paying lip service to “Come on our system” but when it gets down to talks some departments are finding to many road blocks and overall control by the state.
__________________
Advanced System Key Master
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 07-28-2012, 9:40 PM
Member
   
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 40
Default

One of the problems in Fairfield County is the "One Inch porn star" syndrome. Connecticut really needs to get its county government back, set up comm agencies that are run by communication professionals (not some cop who was given communications duty because his/her agency wanted him off the street), set some comm standards, and get the local agencies to toe the line.

CTS runs a good TRS system, and the people responsible for it have a clue. Locals who need comms on a budget would do well with it, but unless it gets a good system expansion it'll be a repeat of MSP's disaster out on the Cape with all the local agencies getting on it and overloading the system.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 08-17-2012, 7:18 PM
MTACOP's Avatar
Member
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 144
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by APX7500X2 View Post
Thank you for the laugh so early in the AM.

You are correct, the smart thing for anyone planning a new system is to jump on any one of the new 700 systems going in (MTA, DOT, UASI) .

BUT we live in a me me me mine mine mine state and everyone wants their own thing no matter the cost!

Also the state is paying lip service to “Come on our system” but when it gets down to talks some departments are finding to many road blocks and overall control by the state.
Sad but oh so true....
Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 08-17-2012, 7:27 PM
MTACOP's Avatar
Member
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 144
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by COMINT_NE View Post
One of the problems in Fairfield County is the "One Inch porn star" syndrome.
The key people on the UASI planning were all knowledgeable from across several fields (PD,FD,EMS, amateur radio ops, and commercial vendors/engineers) . They know it's a good start and needs to grow as the users do.
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 08-18-2012, 10:01 AM
Member
   
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 40
Default

On a state level, Connecticut has its act together. The people at CTS (and there are a few on here), know their stuff. The problems occur more at the local level. It is also fortunate that the primary LMR contractor for CTS has a some competent people in their employ. (Despite the fact that "equal opportunity" (J/J) was a big factor in them getting the gig.)
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 08-18-2012, 1:23 PM
cg cg is offline
Member
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 1,949
Default

Any statewide system would need to have better coverage than the existing CSP system. That was designed for 95% mobile coverage with no % for portable coverage. Coverage in the non CSP areas would also need to be improved. The big benefit of the newer versions of Motorola Trunking and the P25 switch is the capacity. They probably could add all the Motorola systems in the state onboard and still have room. Mass SP has added several municipal systems into the Statewide system just recently.

They had done a great job with the original simulcast system but post rebanding, the signal quality has gone downhill.

chris
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 01-06-2013, 10:30 AM
Member
   
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 12
Default Thomaston CT - proposed motorola comm system - overbuilt?

Quote:
Originally Posted by W2NJS View Post
Take a look at the current Ridgefield frequency assignments, which number about twelve in all and are a mix of VHF and UHF, with maybe one lowband channel. Anyone with half a brain could renovate their current setup into something a bit more workable with a little bit of planning, and it would not have to include trunking. As it now stands their fire and police dispatch on the same channel, so I would bet that the frequency is not all that busy most of the time. Let's keep an eye on their planning and see if some hotshot sales person doesn't come along and oversell the hell out of the town's imagined "problems" and propose something far beyond the town's needs. Should be interesting.
Found this forum based on a search, and the above situtation seems very similar to the situation in my town (I apologize in advance for any missteps related to my post).

Thomaston CT has a 35 yr old system that is poor/unreliable, and is in the process of looking for an upgrade. In our case, officials are really trying to push things through quickly because of safety concerns (they actually only got 1 bid because of the urgency). The cost is estimated at just below $4 million, and it does have some good potential for being overbuilt. New Milford recently built a system for just about $4 million (and they are about 5x bigger area-wise).

Any assistance/advice that you can provide to help determine if the system is indeed being overbuilt? Budget has been approved, and the town is currently in the Zoning stages.

Thanks in advance!
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 01-06-2013, 10:29 PM
Member
   
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 40
Default

Only one bid? There are at least three radio shops that could service Thomaston, and only one bid? Sounds like someone is playing games and rigging things. Thomaston was mostly serviced by Futility Communications, although Norcom did some work for the FD (not surprising since a Norcom employee is also a volunteer there.) WPCS is still a MSS, and need to replace their losses since they've been having problems keeping customers after taking over New England Communications. Bruce Marcus never passes up an opportunity to get one in on his competition. I'd expect at least four bids to come in for the new system.
__________________
---
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 01-07-2013, 7:25 AM
cg cg is offline
Member
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 1,949
Default

First you would need to get the bid and read that. Ask for a copy or use FOI.
Then figure out what they intend to cover in terms of services. A radio system for just one agency should be considerably less than PD, FD, DPW, town hall, & Board of Ed.
Next, you have to look at other factors such as changing frequencies, replacing dispatch center equipment (or even a new facility), and can any existing equipment be reused.
Finally, I would look at the deadline (if any). Some municipalities will wait until the equipment fails then want everything delivered and installed within a month. You pay extra for shorter deadlines.
Often bids can be written to exclude certain manufacturers/dealers. CT DOT had a bid several years ago that listed mandatory tower sites. They happened to be the same as Marcus's tower sites. The radio specs fit the capabilities of Passport radios. But neither was mentioned in the bid.
You could ask who prepared the bid and if they used any vendors to assist. Often times "consultants" have past employment with certain shops/manufacturers and may be biased for or against certain ones.

A brief search online shows that they are replacing everything plus adding two new tower sites to the existing two. I would say that it would not be too hard to hit $4 million.

Since the funding and the Motorola winning bid have already been approved, it seems a bit late to be looking into how much is too much.

chris
Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
        
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 01-07-2013, 8:44 AM
Member
   
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 12
Default

Hi Chris,

Thanks for the info. A friend of mine in town is near one of the proposed tower sites (the 2 proposed towers are both in residential areas with many residents). So if there is some potential for doing away with one or both of the proposed towers (or perhaps potential to use two existing towers close to those locations just outside of town), that would be very welcome news.

As far as it being a bit late -- yeah...pipe dream I guess to hope for a way to adjust the proposed system to potentially save $, and/or have less impact on our friends and neighbors in town.
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 01-07-2013, 1:24 PM
cg cg is offline
Member
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 1,949
Default

Eliminating one tower would likely result in a cost savings and less coverage than expected. Using existing towers might work but commercial sites are there to make money. Many will allow a single Public Safety repeater at a site for free but to put multiple repeaters, antennas, etc, will likely result in a substantial monthly cost.

chris
Reply With Quote
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 01-07-2013, 9:26 PM
Member
   
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 12
Default

Thanks Chris and COMINT_NE. I really appreciate the excellent information. I may follow up more as I get more information on the town project.
Reply With Quote
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 01-08-2013, 12:55 PM
Lynch_Christopher's Avatar
Member
  RadioReference Database Admininstrator
Database Admin
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Syosset, New York
Posts: 691
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rgur View Post
Hi Chris,

Thanks for the info. A friend of mine in town is near one of the proposed tower sites (the 2 proposed towers are both in residential areas with many residents). So if there is some potential for doing away with one or both of the proposed towers (or perhaps potential to use two existing towers close to those locations just outside of town), that would be very welcome news.

As far as it being a bit late -- yeah...pipe dream I guess to hope for a way to adjust the proposed system to potentially save $, and/or have less impact on our friends and neighbors in town.
Thanks for the info. Since it has been a view months since the article was posted have their been any updates as to the type of system they want to go to? Speaking of using towers outside of town I wonder if they would consider using the CSP tower off of Mountain Road in Redding since that is at a pretty high eleveation or even the Meadow Ridge facility in Georgetown.
__________________
Christopher Lynch
RadioReference.com Database Administrator for CT,MA,NH
Reply With Quote
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 01-08-2013, 2:46 PM
Member
   
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 265
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by COMINT_NE View Post
CTS runs a good TRS system, and the people responsible for it have a clue.
The Clue part had me LOL for hours.

There is a Motorola Rep and 4 Motorola technicians assigned to the state police system 24/7/365…Sorry what do the CTS guys do except use tax money and gas?

Ridgefield needs a 3 or 4 site, 4 channel VHF simulcast system. With everything about 4mil.
__________________
Advanced System Key Master
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:49 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
All information here is Copyright 2012 by RadioReference.com LLC and Lindsay C. Blanton III.Ad Management by RedTyger
Copyright 2011 by RadioReference.com LLC Privacy Policy  |  Terms and Conditions