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Old 10-24-2012, 1:36 PM
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Cool Pro-197 Regretful Purchase!

I don't know what exactly got into my head yesterday that made me go get a Pro-197 to monitor the CSP system. I had NO idea how much more needlessly difficult it is to program the CSP trunked system into this scanner. With Uniden made scanners like my 396XT, it is a straight foward approach. You create a system and put in all your frequencies in along with the other parameters and settings. GRE based scanners limit you to 32 control frequencies per ssystem. This forces you to create a duplicate system to enter the remaining frequencies. Once all is said and done, my 396XT was dancing circles around the 197. Even though both radios had matching antennas, were side by side, and had full signal strength, clear audio, The 197 was missing about 1/2 of what the Uniden was pulling in. I checked and double checked all the settings on the 197,( attenuator,weather priority,regular priority, etc.) still nothing. I enlisted the help of a friend on here ( JoeTMedic) who has had his 197 for quite some time and we could NOT figure out how to properly set this scanner up so it matches the performance of the 396XT. Another thing that bugs the heck out of me, Uniden allows you to set up the trunking freqs. to all digital, the 197 does not. I was getting Long Island analog reception on some of the CSP car to car channels. Other than locking them out, there is no way to stop this from happening. Needless to say, the scanner is going back to the store. Uniden had me spoiled! I'm going with a 996XT and cloning it with my excellent performing 396XT portable! I'm done!

Manny
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Old 10-24-2012, 2:11 PM
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So, Manny, I'm guessing the 197 was a heckuva price and that's what made you get it? Knowing that you're a Uniden fan makes that the only possible explanation, IMHO. The difference in how each brand of scanner sets up (banks and channels vs. system, groups) makes the Uniden the winner here. Hope you can return it and get your money back.

Russell


P.S. I see a new 996XT on fleabay $404.99 w/free shipping - now that's a deal, no?
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Old 10-24-2012, 2:47 PM
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Uhh, give it one more chance after reading the manual

You only need to enter the control channels. CSP has 15 per the RRDB, not more than 32.
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Old 10-24-2012, 3:39 PM
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I wonder if someone else in your area is using a PRO-197, PRO-106, PSR-500 or PSR-600 and can share their programming file with you. Certainly if you don't program these things correctly, they don't work well. But I'd rather have the flexibility to set things up as needed.

I agree about the silly limitations like 32 cc freqs though. And the fact some Unidens have 100 lists where the typical GRE only has 10 or 20. GRE could easily have 100 if they just forget the whole single key list selection approach (it takes 2 keys anyway for lists about 10).
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Old 10-24-2012, 3:55 PM
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Originally Posted by rdale View Post
Uhh, give it one more chance after reading the manual

You only need to enter the control channels. CSP has 15 per the RRDB, not more than 32.
Manny is plenty familiar with GRE/RS scanners, he doesn't need to "read the manual".

I don't know where you learned how to count, but there are far more than 15 control channels for the CSP system. 34 by my count, and it looks like there are some that were never flagged, so there are likely a few more than that. Either way, it's already 2 over the maximum allowed.
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Old 10-24-2012, 4:53 PM
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Unless my color recognition has left me, there are 15 red lettered frequencies. And maybe I'm assuming too much, but I can't imagine that he is receiving all of them at once in his location, even if you count alternates.
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Old 10-24-2012, 5:22 PM
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Originally Posted by rdale View Post
Unless my color recognition has left me, there are 15 red lettered frequencies. And maybe I'm assuming too much, but I can't imagine that he is receiving all of them at once in his location, even if you count alternates.
In some systems, the alternates are just as important as the primaries, as they tend to rotate regularly. In some cases the flagging of primary/alternate is totally misleading, as they will rotate often enough that it's unfair to characterize any one frequency as the primary control channel. So unless you expect him to potentially miss out on tracking a site half of the time, then yeah I guess let's just ignore the alts.

As far as receiving them all from his location...is he not allowed to travel around the state with his handheld scanner?
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Old 10-24-2012, 5:35 PM
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Default pro197

The best way to set up a pro197 is by software such as Arc500 or Win500. With this software it is very sinple to program. If you are using a P25 system you only need the control channels and they must be put in the order that they are showing. You do not need anything else. You can also set up the priority channel through the software. Another thing I like about this scanner you can put the S.A.M.E on priority and still scann. The Alert tone will go off then go right back to scanning. Now if I had to program this by hand I would be pulling my hair out. What I suggest is buy the RR program and buy the Win500 software then upload the frequencies into your scanner from RR , Very simple to do and it only takes a few mins to do.
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Old 10-24-2012, 6:16 PM
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Originally Posted by N1SQB View Post
Another thing that bugs the heck out of me, Uniden allows you to set up the trunking freqs. to all digital, the 197 does not. I was getting Long Island analog reception on some of the CSP car to car channels. Other than locking them out, there is no way to stop this from happening. Needless to say, the scanner is going back to the store. Uniden had me spoiled! I'm going with a 996XT and cloning it with my excellent performing 396XT portable! I'm done!

Manny
Try entering the NAC code for the CSP car to car frequencies. Voila the LI analog freqs disappear.
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Old 10-24-2012, 7:20 PM
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Originally Posted by russellmaher View Post
So, Manny, I'm guessing the 197 was a heckuva price and that's what made you get it? Knowing that you're a Uniden fan makes that the only possible explanation, IMHO. The difference in how each brand of scanner sets up (banks and channels vs. system, groups) makes the Uniden the winner here. Hope you can return it and get your money back.
Russell

P.S. I see a new 996XT on fleabay $404.99 w/free shipping - now that's a deal, no?
Yes Russell! It was the price that drew me in! I have always taken pride in that I am fair with my choices in scanners. I have owned both GRE and Uniden in the past 30 plus years I have been scanning. Heck, I still have my ridiculously modified Pro-2006 which as everyone knows is made by GRE. I love my 396XT portable and was looking for a base model for the home strictly to monitor the CSP. I never imagined the differences in programing between Uniden and GRE for trunking were so different. I was able to return it. 996XT coming soon! and yes, $404.09 is a heck of deal.

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Uhh, give it one more chance after reading the manual
You only need to enter the control channels. CSP has 15 per the RRDB, not more than 32.
I Tried that and while theoretically it makes sense, it does not work well in reality.
I DID read the manual. In fact, I downloaded the "easier to read" version found on line as well.

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Originally Posted by gmclam View Post
I wonder if someone else in your area is using a PRO-197, PRO-106, PSR-500 or PSR-600 and can share their programming file with you. Certainly if you don't program these things correctly, they don't work well. But I'd rather have the flexibility to set things up as needed.

I agree about the silly limitations like 32 cc freqs though. And the fact some Unidens have 100 lists where the typical GRE only has 10 or 20. GRE could easily have 100 if they just forget the whole single key list selection approach (it takes 2 keys anyway for lists about 10).
I worked with a friend of mine who has one and listens to the same CSP system until after midnight trying to get this worked out,nothing! I never had this problem with Uniden trunking scanners.

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Originally Posted by Chauffeur6 View Post
Manny is plenty familiar with GRE/RS scanners, he doesn't need to "read the manual".
We don't need no stinkin manuals!

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Originally Posted by rdale View Post
Unless my color recognition has left me, there are 15 red lettered frequencies. And maybe I'm assuming too much, but I can't imagine that he is receiving all of them at once in his location, even if you count alternates.
Besides the 16 red primary channels there are the 18 blue secondary channels that are just as important to this system. One thing we discovered was that some of the frequencies here on RR database for the CSP are not up to date. I found updated frequencies on Scanning New England. I'm not criticizing or anything, just pointing out what we discovered during this ordeal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chauffeur6 View Post
In some systems, the alternates are just as important as the primaries, as they tend to rotate regularly. In some cases the flagging of primary/alternate is totally misleading, as they will rotate often enough that it's unfair to characterize any one frequency as the primary control channel. So unless you expect him to potentially miss out on tracking a site half of the time, then yeah I guess let's just ignore the alts.

As far as receiving them all from his location...is he not allowed to travel around the state with his handheld scanner?
That is exactly what was happening! I was missing out on half the stuff that the Uniden 396XT was picking up. I am 450FT. above sea level. I also live withing a nautical mile of a major tower, so reception with back of the set 800 mhz. antennas is NEVER a problem. As I pointed out in my OP, both units have the same antenna and were right next to each other.


Quote:
Originally Posted by thomasbillman1 View Post
The best way to set up a pro197 is by software such as Arc500 or Win500. With this software it is very sinple to program. If you are using a P25 system you only need the control channels and they must be put in the order that they are showing. You do not need anything else. You can also set up the priority channel through the software. Another thing I like about this scanner you can put the S.A.M.E on priority and still scann. The Alert tone will go off then go right back to scanning. Now if I had to program this by hand I would be pulling my hair out. What I suggest is buy the RR program and buy the Win500 software then upload the frequencies into your scanner from RR , Very simple to do and it only takes a few mins to do.
I already own win500 software and it is up to date. Believe me, I would not try this manually!

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Originally Posted by oilmillcharlie View Post
Try entering the NAC code for the CSP car to car frequencies. Voila the LI analog freqs disappear.
Excellent suggestion, I never thought about the NAC. Well, it's gone now, to be replaced by a brand new 996XT soon. The funny thing is that after all this trouble, I won't have to do anything but clone it with my 396XT and that's that! LOL..

Thanks for all your responses guys!

Manny
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Last edited by N1SQB; 10-24-2012 at 7:33 PM..
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Old 10-24-2012, 7:47 PM
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Originally Posted by N1SQB View Post
One thing we discovered was that some of the frequencies here on RR database for the CSP are not up to date. I found updated frequencies on Scanning New England. I'm not criticizing or anything, just pointing out what we discovered during this ordeal.
I hope you guys submitted the corrections
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Old 10-25-2012, 1:14 AM
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i wish i had read this thread earlier, im in Middletown and could have sent you my file to give it a try. I have the pro 197 too and it works just fine on the CSP system. Idk, never had any problems with mine, although i do have to say, when it comes to features, i like the Uniden better. I like the FTO and how you can change the color of the backlighting and just i like alot of the features better. That being said, i did get a really good deal on my pro 197. Cant really complain since i got it for half the price of a Uniden.
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Old 10-25-2012, 8:04 AM
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i wish i had read this thread earlier, im in Middletown and could have sent you my file to give it a try. I have the pro 197 too and it works just fine on the CSP system. Idk, never had any problems with mine, although i do have to say, when it comes to features, i like the Uniden better. I like the FTO and how you can change the color of the backlighting and just i like alot of the features better. That being said, i did get a really good deal on my pro 197. Cant really complain since i got it for half the price of a Uniden.
Had I not had the benefit of having another digital scanner to compare reception against, I would not have realized the difference. I did get it to work and track, that was not the problem. It is the way GRE forces you to have to program it that causes the problem and/or slow reception.
Thanks for offering to help though, I do appreciate it even though I already returned it!

Manny
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Old 10-25-2012, 8:28 PM
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Besides the 16 red primary channels there are the 18 blue secondary channels that are just as important to this system. One thing we discovered was that some of the frequencies here on RR database for the CSP are not up to date. I found updated frequencies on Scanning New England. I'm not criticizing or anything, just pointing out what we discovered during this ordeal.

Thanks for all your responses guys!

Manny
Manny,

Please submit the errors as a submit info ticket, so I can correct what is wrong.
I will glance over the weekend to see what doesn't match up.

Thanks,
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Old 10-26-2012, 12:22 AM
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brndnstffrd,
Can you send me your CSP file? I'd like to compare it to mine and see if maybe there's some way I can tweak mine. What I wound up doing to not miss that uch was set up 2 CSP objects and I put all of the freqs in there. My thought is that yes these are not all control channels but they are freqs associated with the system so if the scanner looks for them, then if it comes across one it will work. I tried just programming the control channels and to be honest that didn't work very well for me. Given it was overnight and not daytime so the transmossions were down. But as pointed out even if you go by the list on RR in the data base, you still have to open a seperate group because there are 34 freqs as opposed to the 32 GRE allows. I had a pro 106 prior to getting the 197 and I never realized how many transmissions I was missing. While working well into the early hours with manny using win 500, I have 4 or 5 different files with different ways of setting the freqs up. There were also variations with the freqs listed here on RR and Scan New England but I tried both ways same results. Also someone pointed out a different way to program the system using Win 500 so if there is a way to program the system to not go CC only and to scan all of the freqs other than the system I'm using, please enlighten me because we both looked for hours for that. And yes, my BC396XT pulled CSP troops quite a bit more than and more troops than my 197 and I'm far from a newbie in scanning as I've been doing this since my teens and I'm VERY close to 50. The new computerized stuff is a bit different to me but I think for the most part everyone has been using the gre and uniden digital scanners for about the same time as they haven't been arounfd for 30-50 something years, more like what 10? So most will have the same years of experience there

Thanks,
Joe
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Old 10-26-2012, 10:26 AM
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Manny,

Please submit the errors as a submit info ticket, so I can correct what is wrong.
I will glance over the weekend to see what doesn't match up.

Thanks,
-- Mike
Mike, already done! Ticket # 131419

Manny
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Old 10-27-2012, 9:19 PM
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Mike, already done! Ticket # 131419

Manny
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Old 11-11-2012, 9:08 PM
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brndnstffrd,
Can you send me your CSP file?.....
Thanks,
Joe
I would like to get it too... I'm using a Pro-197 and GSR 500 so I may just be used to all this.... on the bright side I do hear CSP G F and I at the same time I hear it on the CSP mobile in the company car.

Dave
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Old 11-12-2012, 10:20 PM
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Default Update!

Pro-197 is a thing of the past! Now I own a great Uniden 996XT which I purchased from a good friend! (Thanks Tom!) No more scanning, monitoring, skipping, isues! CSP coming in issue free after a few tweaks! Really wanted to make things work out with the 197, but after studying the 996XT closely, I see how much I would have been shorting myself!

Manny
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Old 11-17-2012, 10:30 AM
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Thanks Manny, it will be no secret what I will ask Santa for lol
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