CBP using strange encryption? (NYC area)

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shell6

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Did anyone else hear this on the CBP Net 1 freq? Basically noise-beep-noise-beep-noise-beep. I didn't record it because I ended up falling asleep a minute later but I know for a fact that it wasn't digital (my scanner is P25-capable) and it didn't sound like any other encryption I've heard before.
 

WayneH

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It's analog DES encryption otherwise known as "SecureNet". ICE still uses it on a lot of the NET repeaters, if not all of them.
 

ChrisP

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Could you have been hearing OTAR? (Over The Air Rekeying) It sounds a bit like what you typed...

- Chris
 

ecps92

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There are still Analog units using CBP Nets for access 24/7 who have not upgraded to P25 Radios.
NOAA NMF is one that I know of here in New England who use the various CBP Nets [VHF] outside of the NOAA NMF Networks themselves. I'll agree with Chris, most likely it was OTAR

Did anyone else hear this on the CBP Net 1 freq? Basically noise-beep-noise-beep-noise-beep. I didn't record it because I ended up falling asleep a minute later but I know for a fact that it wasn't digital (my scanner is P25-capable) and it didn't sound like any other encryption I've heard before.
 

bigcarl64

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I hear the exact same transmissions here in the Houston area on the CBP frequencies.
 

davidbond21

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I hear that too frequently in San Antonio, mostly on 165.2375 and also on 163.775 sometimes, always in analog. I have been wondering for a while what it was.
 

shell6

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I don't think it's OTAR because transmissions are prolonged and of varying length and separation.
 

shell6

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I'm running out right now to go get lunch but I'll tune in to that freq when I get back and if opportunity arises, I'll record.
 

WayneH

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If it sounds like open squelch with a beep at the end of the conversation then it's analog DES encryption, which it does based on your explanation.
 

mike_s104

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If it sounds like open squelch with a beep at the end of the conversation then it's analog DES encryption, which it does based on your explanation.



this is exactly what the "10-10" mode is that I mentioned before. I've also heard the FBI running something similar for some analog transmissions.
 

shell6

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Actually, I know for a fact that it was OTAR. I just heard the recording and it's exact.

The strange thing is that there is OTAR going on it for multiple days and no actual transmissions.
 

ChrisP

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Actually, I know for a fact that it was OTAR. I just heard the recording and it's exact.

The strange thing is that there is OTAR going on it for multiple days and no actual transmissions.

That's not uncommon on some agencies channels. I've heard nothing but OTAR for long periods on both the CBP Customs NET 1 and some DEA frequencis, but then the voice transmissions are in the clear!

- Chris
 

jmm346

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That's not uncommon on some agencies channels. I've heard nothing but OTAR for long periods on both the CBP Customs NET 1 and some DEA frequencis, but then the voice transmissions are in the clear!

- Chris

When the numerous OTAR transmissions without voice occur, I wonder if

a) someone sitting in an office does a quick keyup of all available radios in their cache to get the new key downloaded, or
b) Charlie-100 individually queries each radio to download the new key, or
c) each agent was instructed via e-mail to key up "sometime today" to download their new key.
 

WayneH

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Considering how many radio sit on the standard "Net" OTAR channels and how they have them programmed I'd say the radios are prone to losing the keys for a number of reasons like pulling the battery off while the radio is on, etc.

The keys, at least in my area, are changed on a monthly basis. All you'll hear all day is OTAR. I sometimes wonder if there are more agencies than ICE and BP using the OTAR system.
 

ChrisP

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I sometimes wonder if there are more agencies than ICE and BP using the OTAR system.

I hear it on the UHF DEA frequencies in many areas and have rarely heard it on Secret Service channels at large events, prior to them going P-25 of course.

I can't recall ever hearing OTAR on the FBI network though...

- Chris
 

WayneH

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I hear it on the UHF DEA frequencies in many areas and have rarely heard it on Secret Service channels at large events, prior to them going P-25 of course.

I can't recall ever hearing OTAR on the FBI network though...
In NorCal DEA only uses their UHF stuff in simplex mode in the clear; it's rare I hear them on their repeaters...that's if the repeater is still running in the area as I've run across an unplugged one before. Anything else is on Nextel. FBI in the same region hand loads their radios.
 
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