CanesFan95
Active Member
If a county or city buys a Phase I or II P25 trunking system, will they be stuck always having to buy their radios from the same vendor? Or can they use a Harris P25 radio on a Motorola P25 system, or vice-versa?
Is P25 Considered Proprietary?
- Thread starter CanesFan95
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P25 itself is not proprietary, however some addon features are (ADP encryption etc). As long as some of those features aren't used then you can typically mix and match vendors. For example the State of Michigans MPSCS P25 system allows radios from Motorola, Harris, Tait, Kenwood etc etc...
Project25_MASTR
Millennial Graying OBT Guy
LWIN has almost as many Tait subscribers on it as Motorola (it's Motorola base).
Western Counties (next door to Austin's GATTRS) had both Motorola and Kenwood subscribers on it (Motorola base).
It's all about what proprietary features are turned on.
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Western Counties (next door to Austin's GATTRS) had both Motorola and Kenwood subscribers on it (Motorola base).
It's all about what proprietary features are turned on.
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CanesFan95
Active Member
Well this sounds like a good thing. Maybe now there'll be some bid competition among vendors so municipalities don't have to pay out the nose when they need new radios and repeaters. Now the vendors can't say, oh, well, we don't support this and that anymore so you don't get stuck having to buy a new radio system every 10 years.
The whole notion behind the APCO Project 25 was to have "open technology", which among other things, keeps radio costs competitive. They are pricey enough even at that.
The "trap" that some jurisdictions can fall in is if they use manufacturer propietary stuff, exactly like that Motorola ADP encryption mentioned previously. A system can be "encrypted" for $10 per radio, which could be lucrative. The downfall is that the jurisdiction has locked themselve into Motorola for replacement radios. That's because the other competitors can't do that ADP.
The "trap" that some jurisdictions can fall in is if they use manufacturer propietary stuff, exactly like that Motorola ADP encryption mentioned previously. A system can be "encrypted" for $10 per radio, which could be lucrative. The downfall is that the jurisdiction has locked themselve into Motorola for replacement radios. That's because the other competitors can't do that ADP.
Project25_MASTR
Millennial Graying OBT Guy
ADP is actually a horrible example…Tait offers it as well (specifically to get those Motorola sales).
What will be proprietary are things like asset management, some avl features, OTAR and OTAP.
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mmckenna
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It depends on other things too:
Vendors have been known to "wine and dine" officials in attempts to sway decision making processes. This usually goes against the purchasing rules. Vendors will go directly after department/agency chiefs in attempts to "buy" the contract.
Department/agency heads have their own biases. There are a fair number of them that will complain about anything not Motorola. I went through this when changing over from a Motorola trunked system to a Kenwood system. Had a few months of complaints until end users realized they were just as good if not better.
Purchasing departments won't put the effort into requiring competitive bids. This can happen either due to internal issues, lack of staff, or lack of knowledge. Purchasing departments that are on their toes and that have the staff will usually start asking questions, especially if only one vendor bids, or other vendors start complaining.
Unfortunately while P25 is open, there are still too many ways for it to go wrong.
Guess I learned something new today. I was thinking that ADP was only a Motorola thing and other manufacturers were unable to provide that.
Can you point me to more information on this? (Our fire department might be buying some more radios and were of the thought Motorola was all they could use because of ADP on some channels.
ADP *was* proprietary for a long time, and yes other vendors offer it now too (including Harris). It was just the first example I could think of.
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CanesFan95
Active Member
So it's both Phase I and II that are not proprietary?
mmckenna
I ♥ Ø
Neither are proprietary. P25 is a standard that was developed partly by APCO and standardized under the TIA.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_25
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