Will encryption kill this hobby ?

[Sownman]

I'm far too new to this stuff to even have an opinion myself. Just wondering what
you long timers think. Will radio become 25%, 50%, 75%, 100% encrypted ?
Will encryption keys become common in the hands of hobbyists eventually ?

What percentage of traffic being unavailable would kill this for you ?

Steve

 

[SLWilson]

Not here !

As far as our local systems, no. We will never go to encryption because we simply can't afford to. Ever!

True encryption is very expensive. Local governments can't afford to spend the $$$ for that. Too many other more pressing things to purchase!

Steve/Gallia

 

[xpawel15x]

I wouldn't worry too much about encryption. I think unmonitorable systems like OpenSky, TETRA, etc. are more of a threat to killing this hobby but not everything will be using those systems anyway. Federal agencies like the FBI and the Prosecutor's Office, Sheriff's Dept's are mostly using encryption if they can afford to. Local pd's rarely use encryption but there are exceptions. In my county for example, nothing is encrypted YET.

 

[Bentley]

I totally agree with you steve. There has been much debate about this in the past, about weather or not 'they' will be able to crack the encryption code for scanners to be able to recieve encrypted signal. Some people are absolutely 100% positive it will never happen. BUT, if you went to these people 30 years ago, when they had 5 channel crystal scanners and told them someday there will be a 5000 channel digital triple trunking scanners they would probably be 100% sure THAT would never happen. But your theory is def. correct, if there is no scanner that will recieve encryption and more and more departments are going digital with encryption, then yes, it would kill the hobby for me. I suppose McDonalds & Burger King drive thru's would be the only thing we would be able to hear 'in the clear' and thats just not exciting enough for me.

 

[Bentley]

As far as our local systems, no. We will never go to encryption because we simply can't afford to. Ever!

True encryption is very expensive. Local governments can't afford to spend the $$$ for that. Too many other more pressing things to purchase!

Steve/Gallia

Think it will ever go down in price ? Just like everything else over time? Or will it stay overly expensive?

 

[relicwr]

Well that depends on how paranoid people are and what kind of areas aren't meant for the public to monitor. Since 9/11, some have been smart as to tighten up communications traffic, but that too doesn't always work. Everybody has a price to carelessly give out confidential information to whoever has the money and resources for it. Then there's the things that absolutely NOBODY can monitor, but at the same time, not everybody has the money to converge towards such equipment. At times, we're not safe from ourselves.

 

[LEH]

At some point, encryption may be become so wide spread as to make the current generation of scanners useless.

Will it be possible to break the encryption. Possibly, but will it be real time or legal. I seriously doubt either.

Currently, the Sheriffs and Fire department where I live is partially encrypted. It makes listening extremely frustrating. Fortunately there are enough other systems to allow for interesting listening. Were this not my home system, I would probably not scan it.

How far will encryption go? That is difficult to say. My county system (which includes sheriff, fire, schools, and such uses encryption sporadically on all talk groups). Will private business encrypt? If it becomes readily available and the costs make it worthwhile probably.

Will this happen anytime soon. Not within the next five years. The costs are just too prohibitve right now. But as older systems are retired, encryption will be an option to be considered in a replacement. And we all know how people like all the latest bells and whistles.

At times, we're not safe from ourselves.

As Pogo once said,

"We have met the enemy,
And he is us."​

 

[Artjirbal1950]

Yes they will, probably not too far off in the future.. The cost of secure communications are falling..
Many in public safety are asking themselves why they always have to go to the cell phone when they need to not be overheard.. Eventually, the decision makers will figure out that they can set the radios up to be more secure than the cell phones for a reasonable cost.. Remember, not that long ago nobody saw the need for encryption on civilian computer netowrks..

 

[zz0468]

As more and more communications go digital, I expect a higher percentage to opt for encryption. I doubt it will get to 100% encrypted in any of our lifetimes, but I think some day in the distant future it will get to that point - at least with public safety.

I don't expect aviation, marine, or railroads to ever go encrypted. Logistically, it's just too difficult, and potentially runs counter to the main reason those services use radios in the first place. But as the "homeland security" mentality gets further entrenched, it's a safe bet that as more and more departments can afford it, they will use it.

That would have minimal impact on my scanning. I rarely ever listen at home, and at work I have a 'company' issued radio. I quite get my fill of listening.

 

[kmacka]

In my area everything is in the clear and un-encrypted. I think in my area that if the county just went to a trunking type system that would take out probably 85% of scanner listeners. Most wouldn't go out and buy an expensive scanner and then have to learn to program it, which could be tricky. So if they just want to limit what scanner land hears, just go to a trunking system.

 

[xpawel15x]

In my area everything is in the clear and un-encrypted. I think in my area that if the county just went to a trunking type system that would take out probably 85% of scanner listeners. Most wouldn't go out and buy an expensive scanner and then have to learn to program it, which could be tricky. So if they just want to limit what scanner land hears, just go to a trunking system.

HaH! I wish they could just stop at trunking. As I don't have the money for a digital scanner at the time.

 

[trace1]

Will encryption kill this hobby ?

No, because everything will never be 100% totally encrypted...

There will always be something to monitor with your scanner, although it just might not be ALL of those Public Safety frequencies that some people think that it is their inalienable rights to do so.

 

[mikeydcg2003]

Looking around the counties in iowa. i don't find much that is Encrypted. I am sure when the pres comes to town the feds have encrypted freqs but does the pres ever come to town anymore.. not really. As fast as the state is working on getting ISICS online, i don't forsee encryption to catch on around here anytime soon. The only ones who really have it are the Pro-Voice Users on RACOM which i am not sure who and if anyone uses it. I can still get everyone i want to.

 

[ibagli]

No, because everything will never be 100% totally encrypted...

There will always be something to monitor with your scanner, although it just might not be ALL of those Public Safety frequencies that some people think that it is their inalienable rights to do so.

It would kill it for me if there was no public safety to listen to. There's nothing else in my county other than the snowplow drivers (who are on the public safety TRS) and the county airport. I wouldn't mind if they went to MDT's for some of the stuff though, because I really don't care about how many speeding tickets Billy Bob has.

 

[SLWilson]

As long as....

Think it will ever go down in price ? Just like everything else over time? Or will it stay overly expensive?

As long as MOTO has the key to the encryption lock, I'd say no. Look at the cost of the system over in NY state. AND, their trial run in a few counties didn't work.

Although NY isn't a MOTO system, Ohio's MARCS system IS working OK.

Locally, through Homeland Security funding, we got a few MARCS radios. Believe me, that IS the way to go. BUT, we DIDN'T get the encryption modules. Again, COST WAY TOO MUCH to add to the radios (per radio)!!!!

I'll be LONG RETIRED before it ever gets affordable to locals !!!!

Steve/Gallia

 

[SLWilson]

Funny you should mention...

Looking around the counties in iowa. i don't find much that is Encrypted. I am sure when the pres comes to town the feds have encrypted freqs but does the pres ever come to town anymore.. not really. As fast as the state is working on getting ISICS online, i don't forsee encryption to catch on around here anytime soon. The only ones who really have it are the Pro-Voice Users on RACOM which i am not sure who and if anyone uses it. I can still get everyone i want to.

Funny you should mention "when the Feds come to town"....

We are in SE Ohio. Had at least three VP visits to our county since I've been working. (Two visits were after we had flood disasters)...

We are hill country. What they brought to talk to EACH OTHER didn't work (those in the "detail") !!

So, locally, the State Highway Patrol had to assist them with communications BETWEEN their people!

So much for fancy high end radios in hill country!!!!

Steve/Gallia

 

[hoser147]

I personally dont think we will see it as Steve mentioned the cost being the biggest factor. Some may go to it for certain ops. But I dont see it happening. Its been used by Salesman for years and most area's didnt get what they thought they were buying. Heck my county got ripped off years ago on a 800 system that was state of the art. Junk they now run 800 one strait channel. Its going to be debated for years to come...........Hoser

 

[br0adband]

To paraphrase an old saying...

"When listening is outlawed, only outlaws will listen..."

or words to that effect.

 

[K9JLR]

I would say encryption will only kill the hobby IF, like other technology, it becomes more affordable and any technological "glitches" are worked out to the point that it becomes as standard as something like FM did about 40 or 50 years ago. In addition, the current standard of keeping the general public from 'legally' received encrypted signals would have to stand as well.

I'm not getting too worried yet.

 

[pogbobo]

i agree ... opensky will kill the hoby it does look sweet on paper tho ...