Encryption/digital for HS Football? No Way? - Page 2

fineshot1 · #21 (**permalink**) 10-16-2009, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manatee

If I bought a Frequency Counter, I have seen that they only work with analog transmissions. Is this true of all?

Not completely true - the Optoelectronics Digital Scout frequency counter does get some hits on some
digital modes - see link below

Optoelectronics, Inc.

But its pricey - I would like one for myself.

See the small print for it below.

"The Digital Scout is not capable of counting Direct Sequence Spread Spectrum (DSSS), CDMA and PCS."

Wyandotte · #22 (**permalink**) 10-16-2009, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manatee

Twas on the field last night. . . I am serious, I have been trying to solve this mystery. If I bought a Frequency Counter, I have seen that they only work with analog transmissions. Is this true of all?

I think you would need to get pretty close to pick up on a freq counter. With a UHF antenna on mine, I usually need to be within 3 feet or so.

You need to leave your scanner at home for the next game, and take your camera. Get as close as you can to the coaches on the ground, get the best pix you can of the stuff they are using, and post it here. Somebody will recognize the stuff.

Also, if you feel like it, post the name of the school district. If they got a license for anything RF, the snoop dawgs on RR will find out the freqs they are using.

Wyandotte · #23 (**permalink**) 10-16-2009, 07:13 PM

duplicate post deleted.

manatee · #24 (**permalink**) 10-16-2009, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyandotte

I think you would need to get pretty close to pick up on a freq counter. With a UHF antenna on mine, I usually need to be within 3 feet or so.

You need to leave your scanner at home for the next game, and take your camera. Get as close as you can to the coaches on the ground, get the best pix you can of the stuff they are using, and post it here. Somebody will recognize the stuff.

Also, if you feel like it, post the name of the school district. If they got a license for anything RF, the snoop dawgs on RR will find out the freqs they are using.

Ahhhhh, I have programmed in the school district frequencies per "Scannerstuff Northwest Frequency Directory". No go.

ecps92 · #25 (**permalink**) 10-16-2009, 08:28 PM

Please be specific, trying to help.

The 400 band runs from 406 [Gov't] into 430/440 Amateur
450 Media 452 Taxi's 453 Local Govt 454 Paging....thru 512 Mhz

What speciific Freq'

Quote:

Originally Posted by manatee

I did ask. . . I know the coach's son. . . he won't tell. Noise always in the 400 band.

gmclam · #26 (**permalink**) 10-16-2009, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manatee

If I bought a Frequency Counter, I have seen that they only work with analog transmissions. Is this true of all?

In order to get a stable reading on a frequency counter, ideally the signal should not be modulated. But the bigger issue is in getting enough signal into most counters. You need a good antenna feeding into the counter, and to do that you kind of need to know the general band they are operating in.

manatee · #27 (**permalink**) 10-16-2009, 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ecps92

Please be specific, trying to help.

The 400 band runs from 406 [Gov't] into 430/440 Amateur
450 Media 452 Taxi's 453 Local Govt 454 Paging....thru 512 Mhz

What speciific Freq'

I didn't save anything, as I didn't hear any words.

Squad10 · #28 (**permalink**) 10-16-2009, 08:59 PM

If you haven't already, you may want to try the FCC's Advanced License Search:

License Search - Advanced License Search

fineshot1 · #29 (**permalink**) 10-16-2009, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyandotte

I think you would need to get pretty close to pick up on a freq counter. With a UHF antenna on mine, I usually need to be within 3 feet or so.

Not so with my Optoelectronics Scout 40 - it was designed to do just what manatee is trying to do.

I use mine all the time and with a dual band ducky on mine I routinely get hits from people using
HT's from about 200 feet away and much further from base stations and repeaters.

mike_s104 · #30 (**permalink**) 10-16-2009, 09:14 PM

The local high school here uses voice inversion. VERY secure. :-)

dracer777 · #31 (**permalink**) 10-17-2009, 05:09 PM

Wirelessly posted (MOT-QA30/00.72 UP.Browser/7.2.7.5.610 (GUI) MMP/2.0)

Maybe you should just plant a bug in the helmet. XD

manatee · #32 (**permalink**) 10-19-2009, 07:53 PM

Well last Friday, had a new Uniden scanner, away game. . . crickets. This sucks.

HancockCountyHal · #33 (**permalink**) 10-19-2009, 09:51 PM

Here's a site that sells sports communications equipment.
High schools take their football seriously enough to spend the money to ensure a fair game.

HCH

http://www.telexaudiocom.com/binary/...20Brochure.pdf

Ray_Air · #34 (**permalink**) 10-22-2009, 08:38 PM

You really need to go in there with a surveillance receiver like the Optoelectronics Xplorer or the older R-10. If it's digital you will here the noise, if it's FH , if you're close enough, you will here the frequencies changing and voice if it's analog FH. If it's digital FH then you will just hear popping and clicks as the frequencies hop.

If this high school knew people had this must interest in intercepting their comm's they would probably go AES- lol.

KE4NYV · #35 (**permalink**) 10-23-2009, 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rdale

If you're hearing white noise, that's probably encryption. It's not that expensive for the basic stuff. You wouldn't hear trunking since they don't use trunking.

Probaly just low level voice inversion. I have a $50 Motorola Talkabout FRS that has this feature. It works. You can tell it is inversion by the change in audio inflection. Not true encryption.

cubn · #36 (**permalink**) 10-23-2009, 12:15 AM

I've noticed a lot of schools (even small schools) are using Portaphone systems. One small school was seen using Coach Comm headsets.

Ten years ago I used to be able to monitor most any high school team (home or away). Recently I've only heard one high school program using analog UHF and they're a small school that barely wins any games.

fmon · #37 (**permalink**) 10-23-2009, 10:13 AM

For more then ten years Newport News VA High Schools have used the 800 Mot smartnet for coms from coach to assistant in booth. Each school has a talkgroup ID.

KE4NYV · #38 (**permalink**) 10-23-2009, 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fmon

For more then ten years Newport News VA High Schools have used the 800 Mot smartnet for coms from coach to assistant in booth. Each school has a talkgroup ID.

Yep, in fact when I was doing their MTC3600 controller upgrade last year, I saw that talkgroup in the list.

radiofan1 · #39 (**permalink**) 10-26-2009, 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fineshot1

It might also be either MotoTRBO or the Icom IDAS / Kenwood NXDN digital which may sound like
digital encryption although it is not. They are just another type of digital and may be tough to lock
onto due to the TDMA format.

NEXEDGE - The RadioReference Wiki

"NEXEDGE is a digital radio brand from Kenwood which uses the NXDN Common Air Interface. The NXDN CAI was developed jointly by Icom and Kenwood and has a following of several companies, known collectively as the NXDN Forum. The NXDN CAI uses Frequency Division Multiple Access (FDMA), employing a 4-level FSK modulation scheme. "

slicerwizard · #40 (**permalink**) 10-27-2009, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manatee

If I bought a Frequency Counter, I have seen that they only work with analog transmissions. Is this true of all?

"Digital" transmissions are still analog signals - I assume you've heard a control channel or two on an analog scanner.

TDMA OTOH...

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmclam

In order to get a stable reading on a frequency counter, ideally the signal should not be modulated.

Really not even worth mentioning. I doubt the OP would be concerned if the reading was off by even a few kHz - which it wouldn't be.