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GMRS / FRS Discussions related to GMRS (General Mobile Radio Service) and FRS (Family Radio Service) communications

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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 06-22-2014, 9:03 PM
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They should immediately stop the sale of the bubble pack FRS/GMRS radios - it will take a while but the ones out there will fade out of existence eventually.

I agree, the FCC is not looking to free up any VHF frequencies - it is looking to free up and release 150 MHZ of frequencies in the 3.5 GHz band for citizen's use as opposed to government agency use.
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Old 06-23-2014, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KD8DVR View Post
That is what the Family Radio Service (FRS) is designed as.
I want 5 watts.
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Old 06-23-2014, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by gtaman View Post
I want 5 watts.
And I want $1,000,000. Can't have everything

GMRS gives you the power you want, but for a modest fee for the license.
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Old 06-23-2014, 1:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WB4CS View Post
And I want $1,000,000. Can't have everything

GMRS gives you the power you want, but for a modest fee for the license.
I'll just stick with my industrial/business pool license. I still have 4 years on it.
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Old 06-23-2014, 2:26 PM
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Originally Posted by gtaman View Post
I think they should just make GMRS a license free UHF CB.
Nope, that's already been done. What do you think the FRS channels are for? IF the FCC should rule on a proposal at all, it should be ELIMINATING GMRS from the bubble pack radios, since the majority of those users don't license themselves to use the Gmrs portions of their radios anyway.
The Early 14 channel Frs radios were the BEST approach and still are for those with no interest to be come licensed.

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Old 06-23-2014, 2:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gtaman View Post
I want 5 watts.
PAY for your Gmrs license and you can use 50 watts on a mobile as well! Easy solution...

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Old 06-23-2014, 2:40 PM
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Originally Posted by gewecke View Post
PAY for your Gmrs license and you can use 50 watts on a mobile as well! Easy solution...

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n9zas
Thats why a group of us pooled funds together 6 years ago for a industrial/business license.
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Last edited by gtaman; 06-23-2014 at 2:57 PM..
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 07-07-2014, 8:55 PM
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Default No ham radios on GMRS

FCC Turns Away Petition to Allow Hams to Operate Non-Certificated Transmitters on GMRS.

07/07/2014
The FCC has denied a Petition for Rule Making (PRM) filed by a Florida radio amateur that sought to permit hams who also hold General Mobile Radio Service (GMRS) licenses to operate on GMRS channels with transmitters that have not been certificated for GMRS use, provided the transmitter meets GMRS technical standards. Mark Friedlander, KV4I, of New Smyrna Beach had asserted in his May 29 filing that the proposed rule change would facilitate interoperability in emergency situations, since many emergency response groups utilize both radio services.
“I think it would facilitate emergency communications with CERT groups and other EmComm workers if we could eliminate the need to check with the FCC for each radio,” Friedlander said in a statement seeking support for his petition and which was posted on the East Coast District ARES (Florida) forum. “Doing so would also minimize confusion about the permissibility of ham operators using their radios for transmitting on both services.”
Transmitters used in the Part 95 GMRS must have FCC certification prior to sale and marketing; in general, Part 97 Amateur Radio transmitters do not.
In a June 20 letter to Friedlander, the FCC pointed out that GMRS transmitters that also can be used on Amateur Radio frequencies will not be certificated. The FCC said it adopted that rule “to prevent the possible proliferation of GMRS equipment that is also capable of operating on frequencies for which the GMRS licensee is not authorized.”
Friedlander has noted that the Amateur Service and the GMRS operate on similar frequencies. He argued that Amateur Radio operators who are authorized to design, build, and operate transmitters without equipment certification in the 420-450 MHz amateur band should be allowed to do so on the 462/467 MHz GMRS channels, the FCC said.
“We conclude that the proposed rule change would undermine the prohibition on GMRS equipment with Amateur Radio frequency capability,” the FCC said. “An exception to [the rule] would allow for the proliferation of home-built, non-standardized transmitters in the GMRS, with no practicable way for the Commission to monitor and enforce regulatory compliance for these devices.”
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Old 07-07-2014, 9:11 PM
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Old news.
FCC Rejects GMRS Petition
I don't know why the ARRL just posted that today.
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 08-01-2014, 12:38 AM
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I say redo the request and only ask to allow Part 90 transceivers be able to instead of any HAM transceiver since part 90 are commercial radios that are commonly used for HAM.
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Old 08-01-2014, 8:52 AM
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There is so much of this already occurring in recent years, that it's pointless to even bring to anyone's attention...

Many hams do this as a general rule, and simply keep it under wraps when they go to their "club" meetings or public events.
Illegal yes, but rarely enforced.

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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 08-01-2014, 11:41 AM
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Default Commercial Radios with GMRS freqs. loaded.

Amateur radio operators loading up frequencies that are not legal for the radio they are in, or the user at the radio.

I have seen this many times. In one case it was during the 2008 "Police and Fire" Games. A mini Olympics for firefighters and members of law enforcement. I was there in a communications capacity with the military and was sent to provide: input, assistance and/or opinions as usual.

When I asked the amateur radio auxiliary to the local police department if they "free banded" their equipment. Every person said that they did not. However, when actually looking at their radios, every single one had: FRS, GMRS, MURS, free band modifications and often VHF marine frequencies in non type accepted radios.

The biggest problem in this case is that since they received grant money from the Department of Homeland Security for their gear, they were supposed to have inter-operable frequencies loaded per the NIFOG manual. None of these were listed.

The common response for doing this is in case of an emergency. I would not want to try to defend that stance, but can see why it would be done.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 08-01-2014, 11:51 AM
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While it's wrong to put these GMRS freq's in a ham radio, it's also wrong to exceed the posted speed limit, [which can cause death], yet thousands do it on a daily basis. Not justifying it, but there's more important things in life to worry about.
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Old 08-01-2014, 5:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PACNWDude View Post
Amateur radio operators loading up frequencies that are not legal for the radio they are in, or the user at the radio.

I have seen this many times. In one case it was during the 2008 "Police and Fire" Games. A mini Olympics for firefighters and members of law enforcement. I was there in a communications capacity with the military and was sent to provide: input, assistance and/or opinions as usual.

When I asked the amateur radio auxiliary to the local police department if they "free banded" their equipment. Every person said that they did not. However, when actually looking at their radios, every single one had: FRS, GMRS, MURS, free band modifications and often VHF marine frequencies in non type accepted radios.

The biggest problem in this case is that since they received grant money from the Department of Homeland Security for their gear, they were supposed to have inter-operable frequencies loaded per the NIFOG manual. None of these were listed.

The common response for doing this is in case of an emergency. I would not want to try to defend that stance, but can see why it would be done.
I would be surprised if any of our local hams even knew what the interops or mabas designations were.
Very few even know about the murs channels for that matter, but yet their quick to jump on the encomm bandwagon.

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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 08-01-2014, 5:31 PM
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Originally Posted by gewecke View Post
I would be surprised if any of our local hams even knew what the interops or mabas designations were.
Very few even know about the murs channels for that matter, but yet their quick to jump on the encomm bandwagon.

73,
n9zas
Well sure, that's why they are called whackers. :-)
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Old 08-01-2014, 5:39 PM
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Originally Posted by pinballwiz86 View Post
Well sure, that's why they are called whackers. :-)
I'm not a big fan of that term, although I do believe in having alternative equipment around if things go south, but I see no reason to flaunt your assets when they're not needed either.

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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 08-01-2014, 6:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PACNWDude View Post
Amateur radio operators loading up frequencies that are not legal for the radio they are in, or the user at the radio.

I have seen this many times. In one case it was during the 2008 "Police and Fire" Games. A mini Olympics for firefighters and members of law enforcement. I was there in a communications capacity with the military and was sent to provide: input, assistance and/or opinions as usual.

When I asked the amateur radio auxiliary to the local police department if they "free banded" their equipment. Every person said that they did not. However, when actually looking at their radios, every single one had: FRS, GMRS, MURS, free band modifications and often VHF marine frequencies in non type accepted radios.

The biggest problem in this case is that since they received grant money from the Department of Homeland Security for their gear, they were supposed to have inter-operable frequencies loaded per the NIFOG manual. None of these were listed.

The common response for doing this is in case of an emergency. I would not want to try to defend that stance, but can see why it would be done.
Well in a state of emergency it's logical to have access to any possibly needed frequency, just like a locksmith carries vehicle master key sets.

IMHO as long as the transmitted signal characteristics meet the specification of the band why should it matter what kind of radio it comes from and I seriously doubt the FCC antenna van can tell what type cert radio is transmitting a given signal. So unless they see the radio, how are they gonna know and why should it even matter?

The law is OLD and needs to be updated to accommodate modern all-in-one ability radios.

Check this radio out, it can pretty much do anything. Motorola APX7000 XE VHF 7 800 MHz Ham P25 9600 TDMA Smartzone FPP Bluetooth GPS 818382012623 | eBay
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 08-01-2014, 6:34 PM
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IMHO half of GMRS should be de-licensed.

This is how I think it should be set up.

Keep the 8 FRS 0.5w channels as is (license free)

Remove the license requirement for the 462mhz GMRS channels and allow up to 5 watts.

Keep GMRS license requirement for 467mhz GMRS channels and allow up to 50 watts simplex only (forbid the use of GMRS repeaters going forward).

The reason I see this as the sensible solution is it would inadvertently make most bubblepack radios license free as most do not have the ability to transmit on the 467mhz repeater input GMRS channels thus licensed GMRS would require buying REAL GMRS radio's that do transmit on these frequencies.
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 08-01-2014, 8:15 PM
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How about a better idea.

1) Get rid of the FRS/GMRS bubble pack radios. FRS only bubble pack radios.
2) Increase the output power to 2 watts on FRS comparitable to MURS. Portable units allowed only.
3) Continue to require a license for GMRS use, up to 50 watts.
4) All FRS (as is) and GMRS must be narrowband (2.5 Khz) compliant to prevent bleed over.
5) All GMRS repeaters must be seprately licensed from a regular GMRS license.
6) Allow all part 90 equipment to be part 95 certified.
7) Enforce the laws. If not, then you have yourself anouther childrens band.
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 08-01-2014, 8:18 PM
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How about enforce the existing rules - and if they can' t or won't then stop permitting the sale of bubble pack FRS-GMRS radios and require the packaging of any GMRS radios to be clearly marked that an FCC license is required and the fine for operating the radio illegally.

Dish out a few hefty fines and illegal use will stop.

GMRS and repeaters fills a need void in communications. There are many location around the country where cell phones do not work and other areas where a family with 100 or 200 acre property - possibly farm want & need a repeater for hand held units to be able to communicate to each other.

There are many areas of the country where there are hills and mountains where a mountain top repeater allows people - family members from each side of the mountain to communicate with each other via the use of a repeater.

Please - just because you do not need a repeater - do not screw the rest of us - how about just enforce the existing rules & regulations and allow the law abiding radio users to use GMRS to it's abilities.
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