Angeles Natl Forest - dispatches?

[zerg901]

I know that back around 1985 that Angeles National Forest would start a fire dispatch with a couple of beeps. I think they also sequentially made the broadcast on the 2 closest repeaters to the incident. Do they still do that?

https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid...8d1916fe&msa=0 - I made a map of ANF stations - it needs some more work

[scottyhetzel]

Originally Posted by zerg901

I know that back around 1985 that Angeles National Forest would start a fire dispatch with a couple of beeps. I think they also sequentially made the broadcast on the 2 closest repeaters to the incident. Do they still do that?

https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid...8d1916fe&msa=0 - I made a map of ANF stations - it needs some more work

Nice work...!?!?!

[Exsmokey]

Originally Posted by zerg901

I know that back around 1985 that Angeles National Forest would start a fire dispatch with a couple of beeps. I think they also sequentially made the broadcast on the 2 closest repeaters to the incident. Do they still do that?

https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid...8d1916fe&msa=0 - I made a map of ANF stations - it needs some more work

The dispatches start with 3 beeps. Since the output tone on the southern California National Forests is almost always Tone 8 - 103.5, it is hard to tell what repeaters or remote bases may be involved. Changes in the dispatch, additional information, changing of the IC, new frequency assignments and the like are preceded with 2 beeps. A single beep is used for non-incident, daily routine announcements such as the reading of the weather forecast. This is pretty standard for the federal land management agencies and CDF as well.

I think I've seen this procedure written somewhere, but don't remember where. Some dispatch centers handle traffic very well, with smooth, professional voices and crisp procedure. Others don't do as well. After having one of the best dispatcher's in the region back in the 80's and a year or so into the 90's, the NF I retired from could not be counted as one of the better. They get the job done, but other more active centers sound better.

*EDIT* The new Forest Supervisor's Office in Arcadia was recently opened. The Angeles worked out of bunch of rag tag trailers for over 20 years. There was enough recovery act money to build it and the new ranger station in Acton. I'm thinking they were funded to build these for federal ownership, at least the land for the new supervisor's office is federal. The cost savings of having the building owned by the feds is substantial as compared to having a building built to specs and leasing it. The savings are hard to achieve as not enough money is allocated for building offices, but enough seems to be available to continue leasing. Years ago the supervisor's office for the Angeles was on the tenth floor of the Hilton Hotel in Pasadena.

[Mikerh91]

Originally Posted by Exsmokey

The dispatches start with 3 beeps. Changes in the dispatch, additional information, changing of the IC, new frequency assignments and the like are preceded with 2 beeps. A single beep is used for non-incident, daily routine announcements such as the reading of the weather forecast. This is pretty standard for the federal land management agencies and CDF as well.

2 Beeps is a cancelation on the Angeles with 1 preceding beep for additional important information such as frequency change etc.

[Exsmokey]

Originally Posted by Mikerh91

2 Beeps is a cancelation on the Angeles with 1 preceding beep for additional important information such as frequency change etc.

Thanks for the clarification.

[zerg901]

I suppose this might be the wrong time of the year to ask this.

When ANF sends out a fire dispatch, do they transmit from more than 1 site? Does anyone hear the dispatches being repeated multiple times by the dispatcher? If they send 7 engines to a fire, they might have to use multiple different sites to reach everyone.

[iepoker]

Originally Posted by zerg901

I suppose this might be the wrong time of the year to ask this.

When ANF sends out a fire dispatch, do they transmit from more than 1 site? Does anyone hear the dispatches being repeated multiple times by the dispatcher? If they send 7 engines to a fire, they might have to use multiple different sites to reach everyone.

They can transmit off of multiple sites, or all sites, at the same time. Its all selectable at the consule.

[Mikerh91]

Originally Posted by iepoker

They can transmit off of multiple sites, or all sites, at the same time. Its all selectable at the consule.

While I can not specifically state that the Angeles has or does not have this ability to multi-select at the console, the fact of the matter they don't because it would cause interference. The Angeles does not have a simulcast system and they have to use one site at a time since they only have 1 frequency for forest net and admin net forest wide. If they were to key up every site on the forest net the field units would most likely hear a lot of interference.

This is why the Angeles dispatches brush fires twice. The first dispatch is done on the site that best covers the fire, and the 2nd dispatch is done on the next best site that covers the operational area.

[zerg901]

Thanks mikerh91 - sounds like nothing much has changed since I was out there in the 1980s.

Anyone know about the other Forests? Cleveland - Los Padres - San Bernardino?

I bet that Los Padres National Forest can use the same channel on both ends of the Forest at the same time without causing interference to each other (since it is a long skinny area).

[zerg901]

Does anyone hear the other Forests making multiple dispatches of incidents? This would indicate they basically operate the same as the Angeles NF.

[Exsmokey]

The Toiyabe National Forest in western Nevada and eastern California will transmit a dispatch on the Toiyabe NF Forest Net and the BLM Carson City District at the same time. If any units to be dispatched are not in the coverage of the repeater used to make the initial dispatch then additional repeaters will be keyed up one at a time to make sure all units have received the dispatch.

Other National Forests that are large and topography is such that one repeater cannot be heard over most of the forest, at least by all of the stations (ranger and fire), then dispatches will be repeated on other repeaters depending on the units included on the dispatch. Morning and afternoon weather works in the same way. National Forests that are spread out, such as the Cibola in New Mexico and the Coronado in Arizona have this multiple transmission procedure. When I was on the Cibola NF in the late 70's the local remote base for the Magdalena Ranger District was used to broadcast the weather, but not everyone in the field could hear this remote as there were areas that could not hear the forest net unless it was transmitted on a repeater. All the stations on the district could hear the remote, but people in the field on the back side of a mountain range, in this case the San Mateo Mountains could not receive or transmit to the remote base located at the top of the Magdalena Mountains. The comm center could not possibly transmit the weather and other forest wide announcements over every repeater.

People in the field that missed the weather and needed it requested it be transmitted on the repeater they were using. Dispatchers also kept track of where units were and if a forest wide announcement was made the dispatcher would call individuals on the corresponding repeater to make sure that person heard the announcement.if it was time sensitive. The initiation of fire restrictions is an example of a time sensitive announcement that everyone in the field needed to hear. The Inyo National Forest, which I retired from and now live near, is over 160 miles long from north to south. Announcements are transmitted simultaneously on the north and south nets on the repeater that covers the most terrain in those areas. Some large areas of the forest are not covered by these two repeaters so the situation is similar to the Cibola's.

I hope this answers your questions zerg.