SCSD using KSICS

[tipster67]

Not full time at all. Tonight they were using 2041 KI SC9 - Law South Central 9 -- Law Enforcement.. They were coordinating a traffic stop along with Harvey Co.. Harvey was watching a car, when it entered Sedgwick, Harvey wanted it pulled over. So looks like at least some of the cars now have radios for the KSICS system.

[dgruver911]

Originally Posted by tipster67

Not full time at all. Tonight they were using 2041 KI SC9 - Law South Central 9 -- Law Enforcement.. They were coordinating a traffic stop along with Harvey Co.. Harvey was watching a car, when it entered Sedgwick, Harvey wanted it pulled over. So looks like at least some of the cars now have radios for the KSICS system.

All of Sedgwick County's cars have KSICS in them. They have a huge template in them that includes several modes of Sedgwick County as well as the "required" KSICS template (what is that, something like 20 modes?). I'm actually more curious as to who from Harvey County they were talking to on SC9 Law...none of Harvey's LEO units except the SO Transport Van have 800 radios in them, and no patching of KSICS talkgroups to local channels is allowed. But it could have been Dispatch. They have 2 800 radios plus the dedicated SC9 PSAP consolette. And since one of our Tactical Dispatchers was working last night and has the knowledge on how to access and use those channels....

Also, Tipster67, just a point of etiquette, in the future you may might want to actually spell out the County in your posting title. Who is SCSD? Sedgwick, Shawnee, Sheridan, Sherman, etc..? Get my point? Us locals can figure out out, others may not be able to.

[tornado911]

I overheard the traffic tiptser67 is talking about. It was Harvey County Dispatch that was talking to the Sedgwick Co. deputies and relaying traffic back and forth with their own deputies on VHF.

[tipster67]

TY tornado911, I was only half *** listening... I heard another SCSD deputy tell the officer to switch over and that the channel was patched. So for ****s and giggles I fired up the KSICS scanner and caught the traffic. I have nothing else to add for dgruver911, but I hope between the two of us it helps..

[cinsu]

Originally Posted by dgruver911

no patching of KSICS talkgroups to local channels is allowed.

Is this a local policy? At the very least I know Shawnee County has the ability to do it and does it when needed. I recently heard KHP called up Shawnee and asked them to patch a KHP Event TG to a Pottawatomie County Sheriff TG.

Early last year I think I remember Osage County patching their UHF to a KSICS interop TG at one point and Shawnee County patching one of their Analog 800 TGs to the same KSICS TG.

[nec911]

Originally Posted by cinsu

Is this a local policy? At the very least I know Shawnee County has the ability to do it and does it when needed. I recently heard KHP called up Shawnee and asked them to patch a KHP Event TG to a Pottawatomie County Sheriff TG.

Early last year I think I remember Osage County patching their UHF to a KSICS interop TG at one point and Shawnee County patching one of their Analog 800 TGs to the same KSICS TG.

Most of the counties have the ability to console patch to KSICS, but they are not supposed to without express permission from the Division Commander at Central Communications.

With Moto-bridge allegedly working in most of the counties, there should be no reason to patch at all, but that is the "old school" and antiquated training kicking in too often.

[cinsu]

Originally Posted by nec911

With Moto-bridge allegedly working in most of the counties, there should be no reason to patch at all, but that is the "old school" and antiquated training kicking in too often.

Many times in Shawnee County there should be no reason to patch various local talkgroups together but they do. I agree that the motobridge system is very under utilized, but there are huge coverage gaps and several counties with no towers and local training for personnel is severely lacking, not by the state but on the part of PSAP administrators. From everything I have seen there is motobridge repeaters on every regular KDOT built KSICS tower. This doesn't help motobridge in areas where local counties have added towers for KSICS coverage. As we are seeing in another thread now KDOT is coming in building local repeaters of specific talkgroups.

I have 2 specific events in mind where motobridge was attempted but lacked coverage for one and was not functioning properly for the other. I would be happy to email you the details of those tonight if you are interested.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

[nec911]

I will take any information you get. Always looking to help keep the comms going.

[KAA951]

I have not had good luck with Motobridge, and every interop class I have been at where they tried to patch across bands failed for one reason or another. Part of the problem was KDOT implemented the system on the cheap with low power 30-40 watt repeaters. And, there are so many repeaters out there on the same frees and tones that you almost always light up multiple towers, which interfere with each other.

The only function I have seen work was when the dispatcher linked towers together on the same band- e.g. 800 analog in Topeka to 800 analog in Hays. Which is neat, but of limited utility in a real-world tactical incident.

Motobridge was more about getting federal money to pay for all the microwave links that make KSICS possible than true interop.

[firefive76]

Originally Posted by nec911

Most of the counties have the ability to console patch to KSICS, but they are not supposed to without express permission from the Division Commander at Central Communications.

With Moto-bridge allegedly working in most of the counties, there should be no reason to patch at all, but that is the "old school" and antiquated training kicking in too often.

We've never heard anything about not being able to patch anything to KSICS and have done so several times.

I agree with KAA, the Motobridge is pretty much worthless IMO. I've also been to classes where it doesn't work correctly or just plain doesn't work. We patch because not every radio in the county has Motobridge TAC's in them. I'd love to hear a success story on the system actually helping.

[KD0BSS]

Originally Posted by dgruver911

All of Sedgwick County's cars have KSICS in them. They have a huge template in them that includes several modes of Sedgwick County as well as the "required" KSICS template (what is that, something like 20 modes?). I'm actually more curious as to who from Harvey County they were talking to on SC9 Law...none of Harvey's LEO units except the SO Transport Van have 800 radios in them, and no patching of KSICS talkgroups to local channels is allowed. But it could have been Dispatch. They have 2 800 radios plus the dedicated SC9 PSAP consolette. And since one of our Tactical Dispatchers was working last night and has the knowledge on how to access and use those channels....

Also, Tipster67, just a point of etiquette, in the future you may might want to actually spell out the County in your posting title. Who is SCSD? Sedgwick, Shawnee, Sheridan, Sherman, etc..? Get my point? Us locals can figure out out, others may not be able to.

It was actually on SC9 PSAP, not the SC9 LE talkgroup, that we were passing info back and forth on. You might double check how you have the TGs named in your scanner, Tipster.

[dgruver911]

Originally Posted by cinsu

Is this a local policy? At the very least I know Shawnee County has the ability to do it and does it when needed. I recently heard KHP called up Shawnee and asked them to patch a KHP Event TG to a Pottawatomie County Sheriff TG.

Early last year I think I remember Osage County patching their UHF to a KSICS interop TG at one point and Shawnee County patching one of their Analog 800 TGs to the same KSICS TG.

From the User Agreement that every agency has to sign with KDOT in order to have radios on the KSICS:

Shared User shall:
E. Not cross-connect any KHP Talkgroup or other user Talkgroup without prior written consent from KDOT and KHP.


This has been reiterated many times in meetings held by KDOT and the State Office of Emergency Communciations. KHP Event Channels are only allowed to be patched through Motobridge under that policy.

[nec911]

Originally Posted by dgruver911

From the User Agreement that every agency has to sign with KDOT in order to have radios on the KSICS:

Shared User shall:
E. Not cross-connect any KHP Talkgroup or other user Talkgroup without prior written consent from KDOT and KHP.


This has been reiterated many times in meetings held by KDOT and the State Office of Emergency Communciations. KHP Event Channels are only allowed to be patched through Motobridge under that policy.

Thanks DG. I was out of town and finally getting caught up on my emails. I know that the Communications Unit Leaders have been told that if we catch anyone who is patching, we are to make sure KHP knows who it is so they can verify they have the right permission and authorization in hand. If they don't, then KHP let's KDOT know and they stop them. KDOT reported to many of us that are very few people who have written authority to do it and there are stiff penalities right now for those that do so without written permission. I have reported three persons and been told there were consequences. Nothing like having every single one of your radios shut off for not obeying a simple rule.

[firefive76]

This very question was brought up (about patching) at a recent class I went to. A VERY high up person in the NE region said that it is permissible to patch to KSICS...

[dgruver911]

Originally Posted by firefive76

This very question was brought up (about patching) at a recent class I went to. A VERY high up person in the NE region said that it is permissible to patch to KSICS...

The verbal word of an un-named secondary source, or the written contract language and the direction of the state office of Emergency Communications? Hmmmm....I think I'll stick with NOT patching to KSICS.

[bear780ks]

This sounds like thread i will want to follow more often.. Great info.. b780

[firefive76]

Originally Posted by dgruver911

The verbal word of an un-named secondary source, or the written contract language and the direction of the state office of Emergency Communications? Hmmmm....I think I'll stick with NOT patching to KSICS.

Where might one find this wording? If you're referring to your above post, all that says is that you cannot patch 2 KSICS talkgroups together is how I read it.

[cinsu]

Originally Posted by dgruver911

From the User Agreement that every agency has to sign with KDOT in order to have radios on the KSICS:

Shared User shall:
E. Not cross-connect any KHP Talkgroup or other user Talkgroup without prior written consent from KDOT and KHP.


This has been reiterated many times in meetings held by KDOT and the State Office of Emergency Communciations. KHP Event Channels are only allowed to be patched through Motobridge under that policy.

I know verbal consent was established from KHP in a life threatening emergency circumstance where their primary dispatch talkgroup was patched with an analog frequency by a local agency.

Interop channels (PSAP, LE, FIRE) are not under the control of any one user except KDOT. Who can give consent for patching of those talkgroups at 0200 on a Sunday during a life threatening emergency?

I don't really care who is in power and control of any frequency, a life threatening emergency circumstance in which no other communication mode is possible or feasible takes precendence and the FCC still acknowledges that.