New Baltimore County P-25 System - Page 12

doctordave · #**221** (**permalink**) 02-09-2012, 09:21 AM

Hi Mike, Great to hear that you had good success with your 396 while mobile. That is encouraging. I didn't have a good result while mobile in my particular neck of the woods with my 996xt, but hopefully that can be optimized a bit.

Out of curiosity, why would a phase 2 system require multiple alternate control channels, instead of simply relying on one control channel? Are there times when, conceivably, the system might be so busy that a second or third active control channel might be necessary to control the trunked system?

ka3jjz · #**222** (**permalink**) 02-09-2012, 11:15 AM

While this is slightly OT since the County's system is not P2...

Anyway, I'm not up on all the tech stuff of a P2 system, but I would imagine the reason would be the same as it would be for any trunk system - alternates are used to relieve transmitter stress. Remember that a CC is on 24/7 so the transmitter is on full duty - that's a lot of stress. Different freqs for a different transmitter would spread out the transmit load

best regards..Mike

doctordave · #**223** (**permalink**) 02-09-2012, 01:18 PM

I'd typed phase 2....but really meant to reference P25 trunked systems. Your explanation sure makes sense. I suppose I'd always figured the system would cycle the burden of the control channel responsibility amongst the various transmitters....but perhaps the individual transmitters are actually locked onto specific freqs, full-time.

Have heard some sporadic testing of TGs this afternoon and from home, it sounds better than it did 2 Saturdays ago. There are a ton of RF variables in my area, so I don't yet know if this was just good timing with respect to NEXTEL/cellular activity....or if the County tweaked things on their nearby towers. Looking forward to seeing how Saturday goes....presuming the switchover target date remains valid.

troymail · #**224** (**permalink**) 02-09-2012, 03:46 PM

I believe another reason for multiple control channel frequencies includes the possibility that any individual frequency could suffer from some type of interference. Having alternates allows the system to continue to operate. Some time in the past, I believe the Fort Meade 380Mhz system had an interference problem which, if I remember correctly, caused at least the fire department there to move onto and live on the Anne Arundel County system for several days.

Also - I think I've heard in the past that effectively any of the system frequencies could actually be called into service as the control channel frequency..... but that is me just repeating what I've heard....

aka_deno · #**225** (**permalink**) 02-09-2012, 05:14 PM

I have a psr500 and am having issues getting Baltimore County now. i just tried importing all the new p25 stuff into my scanner, but i still get absolutely nothing. i am located in the Owings mills part of the county. so maybe i just dont have a large enough antenna. Anyone have a win500 or psredit file for a PSR-500?

don333 · #**226** (**permalink**) 02-09-2012, 05:49 PM

I'm also using a GRE PSR500 and had no trouble downloading the system. If you're trying to monitor Baltimore County on this system it does not go "live" until this Saturday, 2/11/12 at 0600 or 0630. Until then you still have to monitor the legacy (or current) system. Hope this helps.

ka3jjz · #**227** (**permalink**) 02-09-2012, 07:50 PM

Re programming a pro-96 with 2 systems - I *knew* I read it somewhere, and sure enough, it's in the programming shortcut articles for the 96 and 2096 written by one of our late members...the links for which are here...

Programming Your Radio Shack Scanner - The RadioReference Wiki

PRO-96 and 2096 owners might take note of this...best regards..Mike

jimsmowin · #**228** (**permalink**) 02-09-2012, 08:13 PM

I WILL BE TAKING A SHOT AT PROGRAMMING MY 2096 THIS WEEKEND hope all goes well, any tips are always welcome. i will import from RR to win96. thanks

ka3jjz · #**229** (**permalink**) 02-09-2012, 08:47 PM

I'm not a 96 owner, but I believe that the PDF image that was posted in message 218 is close, but not quite. There's one channel that is marked as locked out, and that's something you're going to not want to do, and there's no conventional channel between the 2 sites as recommended in the shortcuts.

Still it's a place to start....best regards..Mike

CRVFC500FF · #**230** (**permalink**) 02-10-2012, 01:10 PM

As planned. Trail to start tomorrow. If any serious issues arise they can go back to analog at any time for the next 6 months.

jimsmowin · #**231** (**permalink**) 02-10-2012, 03:24 PM

i went in and downloaded from RR to win 96 now i will double check settings and load, are there any settings for the pro-197 that i should be aware of,thanks for your help

2106 · #**232** (**permalink**) 02-10-2012, 05:31 PM

I bought a new pro-197 scanner and downloaded the trial win500 software to get ready for tomorrow and am no getter off than I was with my pro-2096 and arc96 software.

All I get is the message "nothing enabled". I put the control frequencies in and then added three "talkgroups and it has two "wildcards" with the talkgroups.

Would possibly anyone have a Win500 or ARC500 file set-up already they could post a copy of it here so I could read it? Maybe I could see what I'm doing wrong. I've been reading so many FAQs on scanning my heads spinning.

ka3jjz · #**233** (**permalink**) 02-10-2012, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimsmowin

i went in and downloaded from RR to win 96 now i will double check settings and load, are there any settings for the pro-197 that i should be aware of,thanks for your help

Read the Object Oriented Programming section of the following - this was copied from OCGuard in a previous message

Baltimore County (Project 25) - the RR Wiki

Further tips, screen shots and other tricks are welcome. Let's use the wiki to capture them, so the answers to newcomer's questions can be referred to time and again...

best regards..Mike

Highpockets · #**234** (**permalink**) 02-10-2012, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2106

I bought a new pro-197 scanner and downloaded the trial win500 software to get ready for tomorrow and am no getter off than I was with my pro-2096 and arc96 software.

All I get is the message "nothing enabled". I put the control frequencies in and then added three "talkgroups and it has two "wildcards" with the talkgroups.

Would possibly anyone have a Win500 or ARC500 file set-up already they could post a copy of it here so I could read it? Maybe I could see what I'm doing wrong. I've been reading so many FAQs on scanning my heads spinning.

Read the section "Nothing Enabled":

WIN500 - UtahRadio

ka3jjz · #**235** (**permalink**) 02-10-2012, 06:54 PM

and just to be complete, there's a similar section in the ARC500 user guide...

ARC500 User Guide - The RadioReference Wiki

best regards..Mike

2106 · #**236** (**permalink**) 02-10-2012, 07:02 PM

yes I read both of them earlier today thanks, spent most all day reading this sites scanner FAQ's and stuff but having trouble getting my head wrapped around these new terms and concept.

but making progress. its scanning now but don't understand how/what I did and I think it needs more proper settings. The first photo is the south side settings and the second picture are for the north side. I need to keep them separate correct? I think my ID, Group or Radio ID/wildcards? and my scan lists are still wrong. But every so often it gets a transmission.

ocguard · #**237** (**permalink**) 02-10-2012, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by doctordave

Hi Mike, Great to hear that you had good success with your 396 while mobile. That is encouraging. I didn't have a good result while mobile in my particular neck of the woods with my 996xt, but hopefully that can be optimized a bit.

Out of curiosity, why would a phase 2 system require multiple alternate control channels, instead of simply relying on one control channel? Are there times when, conceivably, the system might be so busy that a second or third active control channel might be necessary to control the trunked system?

There is never more than one ACTIVE control channel at a time per system (or per zone, in a multi-zone system). The control channel's data stream is actually relatively small, especially in a 96bps system.

As was explained by another poster, one of the reasons that control channels rotate system frequencies is to alternate the transmit stress involved with continuous duty required by the control channel. The other reason is in case of failure of one of the control channel frequencies.

In a Motorola system, there are four frequencies per zone designated as eligible control channels. This keeps the list of control channels needed to be stored in subscriber units relatively small, and shortens the time needed for subscriber units to "search" for control channels at power-up. Imagine, in a large system, such as Baltimore City, with 28 channels, if every one were eligible as a control channel, and during high system activity, 26 of the frequencies might be in use for voice calls. A subscriber radio powering up would have to "check" every channel to find the control channel.

This is the same premise for scanner users. For Motorola systems, only input the eligible control channel frequencies. This shortens the time it takes the scanner to find the control channel at power-up, or if signal is temporarily lost. Don't be worried about the system switching to a non-eligible control channel for control, because even the subscriber units only have the eligible control channels programmed into them, so it will never happen.

ocguard · #**238** (**permalink**) 02-10-2012, 08:01 PM

Also, just confirmed with an on-duty BCoFD member, cut-over is 06:30 Saturday morning. Voice channels will be transitioned from the analog system to the digital system one-by-one to allow for capacity loading.

Analog equipment will remain in place, but likely powered-down, for a period initially described as 6 months, but likely shorter based on the successful live 24-hr test two weekends ago.

jimsmowin · #**239** (**permalink**) 02-10-2012, 08:05 PM

it looks alright to me when i downloaded it , RR put both systems together and mulity site to roam. i live too far away to recieve it though.

ocguard · #**240** (**permalink**) 02-10-2012, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by doctordave

I suppose I'd always figured the system would cycle the burden of the control channel responsibility amongst the various transmitters....but perhaps the individual transmitters are actually locked onto specific freqs, full-time.

In a trunked system, at the tower site electronics bank, each repeater always retains it's frequency full-time. When the control channel rotates, it actually switches from one machine to another. Each repeater is tuned to it's assigned frequency, and is connected to the RF line for the transmit and receive antennas in a specific order to retain it's tuning thru the multi-plexer can.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2106

I bought a new pro-197 scanner and downloaded the trial win500 software to get ready for tomorrow and am no getter off than I was with my pro-2096 and arc96 software.

All I get is the message "nothing enabled". I put the control frequencies in and then added three "talkgroups and it has two "wildcards" with the talkgroups.

Would possibly anyone have a Win500 or ARC500 file set-up already they could post a copy of it here so I could read it? Maybe I could see what I'm doing wrong. I've been reading so many FAQs on scanning my heads spinning.

Where are you located? It may be just as easy to meet up and have someone program your radio, and, in the process, give you a crash course. It's a huge learning curve. I can see some of the issues in your screen caps, but not enough to trouble-shoot. Send me a private message and I'll see if I can help you out.