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Multi-State Communications Networks - The purpose of this forum is for discussion of trunked or conventional communications networks that span more than one state. They are local government or commercial in nature. For Federal or Military use the appropriate Topic Specific forum.

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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 03-13-2018, 6:54 PM
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And am I imagining things, or is there no database entry set up for the two existing sites (Wagoner OK and Etlna OH) ? I can't find an AEP P25 system listed.

Mike
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Old 03-13-2018, 8:24 PM
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Originally Posted by mtindor View Post
And am I imagining things, or is there no database entry set up for the two existing sites (Wagoner OK and Etlna OH) ? I can't find an AEP P25 system listed.
It's not in the db. The information was posted in the forums but either nobody submitted it or the admins never worked it.
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Old 03-13-2018, 8:34 PM
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Originally Posted by nd5y View Post
It's not in the db. The information was posted in the forums but either nobody submitted it or the admins never worked it.
Ok thanks. Perhaps I'll take the initiative

Mike
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Old 03-13-2018, 9:09 PM
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Here is the system in the DB:

American Electric Power (Eastern US) - P25

I've added the system, and for now have added the Leonard OK site and will add the Ohio site after I consult with Tom WA8PYR.

The Leonard site info was gathered from the following thread (which should not be used for further discussion now that this thread is in place):
https://forums.radioreference.com/ok...55-7875-a.html

NOTE 1: I added it as Phase 1 for now. Nobody has reported whether it Phase 1 or II at this point . We can all speculate. But for now I'll leave it as Phase I, and that way people without Phase II abilities won't be scared to add it and listen (assuming there is anything to listen to).

NOTE 2: The Leonard OK site is already in the AEP EDACS (Oklahoma) system in the DB, but with completely different frequencies. The site license is the same for both. So they appear to simply be using some frequencies on the license for the P25 test site and different frequencies on the same license for the EDACS site.

Mike
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Old 03-14-2018, 7:59 AM
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Default Site 8-008

Revisiting site 8-008 (which Tom PYR discovered on 857.8125).

If I look at Ohio AEP licenses, this site could be one of many licenses, and depending upon what conditions were like at the time that Tom copied it, it could be a site closer to him or a site farther away from him that just happened to be picked up because of some enhanced tropo.

To that end, I'm listing all of the Ohio AEP licenses that list 857.8125 as a frequency. If you happen to be near one of these site locations, please consider checking all frequencies on the site for the existence of a 24/7 P25 control channel. If found, please try to run Unitrunker or DSDPlus or Pro96Com or something on the site in order to obtain any alternate CCs and neighbor information. The CC may still be 857.8125, or the CC may rotate and up being on another frequency.

If you were looking for this site, you'd want to check all frequencies listed for a particular site and check for a P25 control channel.

Here are the possible sites/locations of Site 8-008 :

WPMH529 / WQCS497 Leonardsburg (Delaware)
855.6125
857.8125
858.8125
859.2875
859.8125
860.2875
855.4125
856.8875
857.3375
857.8875
859.9125

WQCS820 Shawnee (Perry)
855.0625
857.8125
859.8125
860.3375

WQCS820 / WNXM650 Powell (Delaware)
855.4125
857.3375
857.8125
858.8125
859.2875
859.9125
855.6125
858.2875
859.2875
860.2875

WQEY359 Otway (Scioto)
854.7625
854.7875
855.0375
857.8125
860.3625

WPMH529 Mt Sterling (Pickaway)
855.0625
857.8125
858.4125
860.4125

WPCQ249 Peebles (Adams)
857.8125
858.8625
860.8125

WQCP620 / WPCQ250 Latham (Pike)
857.8125
855.0125
855.8875
859.7875
860.7875

WQCP620 / WPCQ249 West Portsmouth (Scioto)
854.8375
855.0625
855.8125
857.8125
860.9125
854.9375
855.6875
857.3625
857.7875
859.8875

Thanks!

Mike
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Old 03-14-2018, 9:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtindor View Post
NOTE 2: The Leonard OK site is already in the AEP EDACS (Oklahoma) system in the DB, but with completely different frequencies. The site license is the same for both. So they appear to simply be using some frequencies on the license for the P25 test site and different frequencies on the same license for the EDACS site.
I don't know how it is in OH but some of the AEP EDACS sites in OK and NW TX can have over 50 channels licensed at one site even though there are only actually 4 or 5 in use.
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Old 03-14-2018, 10:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nd5y View Post
I don't know how it is in OH but some of the AEP EDACS sites in OK and NW TX can have over 50 channels licensed at one site even though there are only actually 4 or 5 in use.
It doesn't seem to be that extreme in Ohio, but I've definitely seen some sites with more licensed frequencies than they have ever put into service. Most of the AEP EDACS sites in Ohio are using very close to (if not precisely) all of the frequencies licensed to the site, but obviously some aren't. Just on the sites I listed in my previous email, I'm positive that at some of those locations they are using just a fraction of the licensed frequencies for a site on that particular EDACS site. I don't think there is a single Ohio EDACS site using more than 8 freqs, with most using quite a few less.

Mike
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 03-14-2018, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtindor View Post
Here is the system in the DB:


NOTE 1: I added it as Phase 1 for now. Nobody has reported whether it Phase 1 or II at this point . We can all speculate. But for now I'll leave it as Phase I, and that way people without Phase II abilities won't be scared to add it and listen (assuming there is anything to listen to).



Mike
I got some hits earlier on TG:4703 and 10001. Sounds like they were talking about loading codeplugs in radios on 4703. 10001 Proscan must of been recording a different system.

Also, if I'm reading Unitrunker correctly, there are some P2 hits.


ETA: I've put scanner into just monitoring this site for a bit to see what all is going on.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 03-14-2018, 12:14 PM
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I don't know how Unitrunker shows a Phase II talkgroup. Where I am, I have seen/heard a Phase II talkgroup on a system. Since I don't know how Unitrunker differentiates the two, and cannot see any differentiation with my own two eyes based upon the screenshot, I'm going to leave it as Phase I in the DB for now.

I added the 854 mhz frequency and TG 10001 and 4703.

Looks like you may have some corruption in UT there. Same frequencies showing as different channel numbers, whihc seems odd to me. Be careful in UT that you don't switch control channels with the UT receiver enabled. You want to disable the UT receiver, switch, and then enable again.

I'd recommend going to the Channels tab and clearing out all o the channels on the site and letting them repopulate on their own.

Thanks

Mike

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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 03-14-2018, 12:31 PM
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I'm almost certain the LCN having a 0- and 8- on the same frequency is an indicator. Also the band plan shows plans for slots 1 and 2.

Maybe someone can chime in. I wish there is a way (or might be and I'm too dumb!) for Proscan to differentiate a P1 transmission or P2.
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Old 03-14-2018, 12:34 PM
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Actually just found it. The 4703 TG is showing PT0.
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Old 03-14-2018, 12:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wx5uif View Post
I'm almost certain the LCN having a 0- and 8- on the same frequency is an indicator. Also the band plan shows plans for slots 1 and 2.

Maybe someone can chime in. I wish there is a way (or might be and I'm too dumb!) for Proscan to differentiate a P1 transmission or P2.
The Unitrunker screen shots look to me like phase II unless for some reason it is displaying corrupted data. Click on the frequency column in the call history tab and sort the channels by frequency. If you watch it you will eventually see two transmissions at the same time on the same frequency with different LCNs. You should see three sets of frequenies. One set with one band plan is phase I. The control channels will always use these. The other band plan will have two frequencies with consecutive LCNs. Only phase II voice channels will use these. I have never used Proscan so I can't help with that.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 03-14-2018, 1:08 PM
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Thanks to both of you for the education. I've changed the system to Phase II in the DB.

Mike

Last edited by mtindor; 03-14-2018 at 1:14 PM..
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 03-14-2018, 1:13 PM
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The question remains (at least for me) as to determining if a talkgroup is a Phase I or Phase II talkgroup. Does Unitrunker differentiate between the two types in its display? Does Proscan? Do scanners?

I want to make sure I label things correctly in the DB, but I'm at a loss since I've never had any Phase II P25 in my area to monitor.

Mike
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Old 03-28-2018, 2:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wa8pyr View Post
Doing a bit more research, and my guess is this active control channel (857.8125) is at the Etna site. I can receive the Columbus EDACS site from home full quieting, while the Etna site is slightly noisy (but still easily copyable).

The new P25 site is the same, copyable with a bit of noise.

Won't be able to pin it down for sure until I can get out and roam around a bit (which won't be until the temperature climbs to a more reasonable level).
I am 2-3 Miles from Etna site. I ran all the known frequency's through unitrunker and DSD+. I get an EDACS signal on 855.4375. I can also see signal on 860.8875 but nothing decodes on the software. I imagine that means it is data?

I also ran 857.8125 but there is nothing there. I ran a custom scan for a couple hours and found the same data the software gave me.

I hope that helps, if there is anything else I can do to help let me know. I will keep an ear out for any changes.
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Old 03-28-2018, 5:31 AM
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I am currently on the west side of Franklin County, Ohio and can pick up the 857.8125 CC really well. I have a remote scanner on the east side of the county that is not picking anything up on that frequency. With that said, I am thinking that site 8-008 is either Mt Sterling or Powell.
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Old 03-28-2018, 7:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RakkFO View Post
I can also see signal on 860.8875 but nothing decodes on the software. I imagine that means it is data?
What does it sound like? Is there any way for you to post a recording?

Twice now I have seen new P25 sites or systems in my area that transmitted some type of contstant test pattern or BERT for a while when they first went on the air. It isn't control channel data and doesn't decode.
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Old 03-28-2018, 7:34 AM
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Originally Posted by au1344 View Post
I am currently on the west side of Franklin County, Ohio and can pick up the 857.8125 CC really well. I have a remote scanner on the east side of the county that is not picking anything up on that frequency. With that said, I am thinking that site 8-008 is either Mt Sterling or Powell.
That frequency is licensed to the following AEP locations -- well there were a couple more, but I had originally passed the list on to Tom and removed a few that I knew he couldn't have been hearing.

WPCQ249 857.8125 PEEBLES (ADAMS)
WQCP620 857.8125 LATHAM (PIKE), WEST PORTSMOUTH (SCIOTO)
WPMH529 857.8125 LEONARDSBURG (DELAWARE), MT STERLING (PICKAWAY)
WQCS820 857.8125 SHAWNEE (PERRY), POWELL (DELAWARE)
WQEY359 857.8125 OTWAY (SCIOTO)

Based upon your report of west side of Columbus hearing it pretty good, it probably is Leonardsburg, Mt Sterling or Powell.

Mike
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Old 04-24-2018, 9:01 AM
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So will this be a network wide P25 system? Or could each site be different? I’d really like something to test in my phase 2 Unication.
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Old 05-09-2018, 8:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by au1344 View Post
I am currently on the west side of Franklin County, Ohio and can pick up the 857.8125 CC really well. I have a remote scanner on the east side of the county that is not picking anything up on that frequency. With that said, I am thinking that site 8-008 is either Mt Sterling or Powell.
I recently confirmed that it's Mount Sterling. I was able to hear it full quieting on the Pro-197 I use for CC monitoring with the attic antenna, and when I plugged it into the PSR500 with a Comet Miracle Baby antenna, it was still there, nearly full quieting. Mount Sterling is only about 14 miles from where I am, and Etna or Powell wouldn't have been nearly that good.

I confirmed with a handheld Yagi swung toward Mount Sterling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigarmsp226e2 View Post
So will this be a network wide P25 system? Or could each site be different? I’d really like something to test in my phase 2 Unication.
It's a networked system and will most likely cover both the eastern and western AEP service areas. According to the PR blurbs, it was touted as intended to serve the entire utility.
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