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Old 02-22-2013, 8:57 AM
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Default SSN over the air?

I was floored the other day driving through northern Nevada on I-80. NHP made a traffic stop around Winnemucca on a Nevada driver who didn't have his license with him, so they looked it up by SSN. They broadcast his Social Security number, dispatcher then replies with his DL number, DOB, just about everything a identity thief would want. I would NEVER give my SSN to a cop, and you should always know your DL number.
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Old 02-22-2013, 9:11 AM
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Nothing illegal about it. Routinely we [here in New England] use the SSN to ID someone

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Originally Posted by tahoekid77 View Post
I was floored the other day driving through northern Nevada on I-80. NHP made a traffic stop around Winnemucca on a Nevada driver who didn't have his license with him, so they looked it up by SSN. They broadcast his Social Security number, dispatcher then replies with his DL number, DOB, just about everything a identity thief would want. I would NEVER give my SSN to a cop, and you should always know your DL number.
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Old 02-22-2013, 9:14 AM
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Never said it is illegal, just not smart. California Highway Patrol looks up DL by name and DOB.
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Old 02-22-2013, 9:22 AM
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almost everybody that likes to listen to scanners are honest.
we treat it as a hobby and not a job
job here is defined as a way to make money illegally.
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Old 02-22-2013, 10:37 AM
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I don't understand it either, I don't put my SSN on anything I don't explicitly have to, even those dumb forms that say it will help identify me. I wouldn't give it to a cop for any reason. But I've had the same DL# number for the 13 years I've lived here, so I remember it like my phone #.

The other agencies can be heard doing it too depending on the officer and where they're at. I've heard LV Metro do it on their info channel, same with Henderson and NLV.

While visiting Reno, I heard Reno PD and Washoe both doing it on PS Share.
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Old 02-22-2013, 10:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tahoekid77 View Post
I would NEVER give my SSN to a cop,
Quote:
Originally Posted by bfperez View Post
I wouldn't give it to a cop for any reason.
Depends on the cop, but if you refuse to comply, you could end up in jail .... or a hospital.
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Old 02-22-2013, 4:35 PM
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when i lived in sac ca. the sheriff would call over ssn. to id.
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Old 02-22-2013, 4:42 PM
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Happens a lot here in Maryland. Good or bad, there's a lawyer somewhere salivating over the thought of the potential lawsuit after some schlub gets his identity stolen...
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Old 02-22-2013, 5:14 PM
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Investigation Finds Government Giving Out Social Security Numbers | ksl.com
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Old 02-22-2013, 6:26 PM
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Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; U; en-US) Gecko/20081217 Vision-Browser/8.1 301x200 LG VN530)

That is one reason why many Info channels are going encrypted. To protect that information. The last time I renewed my DL, I was given the option to change my DL number which originally was my SSN to a sequentially issued number, which I did.
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Old 02-22-2013, 6:29 PM
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Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; U; en-US) Gecko/20081217 Vision-Browser/8.1 301x200 LG VN530)

You could always try asking the officer if his/her Info channel is encrypted before giving them your SSN, or request that they use their cell phone or MDC to run a check due to the chance an unscrupulous listener could steal your identity.
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Old 02-22-2013, 7:15 PM
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What about the many towing companies (and a few taxis that haven't yet been forced to use card readers) that read your credit card number, including the extra codes from the card back, over their unencrypted analog radio to charge your tow. With the SSN a crook would need to do some work to buy something on you. From what they hear from the tow truck driver (card type, card #, security code #, name, address, etc.) they can go online and order up whatever they want immediately. With a bit of patience, they can even confirm that the card is good when the tow truck driver gets their confirmation number for their charge.
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Old 02-22-2013, 7:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KB7MIB View Post
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; U; en-US) Gecko/20081217 Vision-Browser/8.1 301x200 LG VN530)

You could always try asking the officer if his/her Info channel is encrypted before giving them your SSN, or request that they use their cell phone or MDC to run a check due to the chance an unscrupulous listener could steal your identity.
How many people do you think even know what a scanner is let alone encryption ? i for one would never give my SSN to any cop jail or not and for those who do not know your ssn is the same as your medicare number so it is double jeopardy for them. the chinks are just looking for easy access to your money why make it any easier.


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Old 02-22-2013, 8:06 PM
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Back 10-15 years ago, the Wisconsin State Patrol would take credit cards for bond. They aired the CC# and CVN right over the air!! That stopped when they went to MDC terminals.
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Old 02-23-2013, 8:27 AM
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I'd be more concerned with carrying your driver's license when operating a motor vehicle on public roadways than a police officer giving a lawful order to produce some kind of ID in its place. You should be happy they give you that second chance before hauling you off to the magistrate.

http://ssa-custhelp.ssa.gov/app/answ...ecurity-number
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Old 02-23-2013, 11:21 AM
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On the road, yes, but there's no requirement to carry ID if using public transportation, or for that matter, walking down a public street...

What usually happens on transit is that the cops see a loiterer or vagrant and start asking questions. Either the person is stupid or just wants to prove a point, so instead of just shutting up and agreeing to leave, they get into it with the cops, so now the cops get serious. About this time the person remembers he has an open warrant for lewd and malicious bubble gum-chewing or something equally as stupid in some other state, so NOW he wants to clam up. Or give his brother's/cousin's/father's/uncle's name as his. That's usually how it gets to the point of a SSN being read on the air.

If a department is routinely reading SSNs over unencrypted channels even when a valid license or photo ID has already been presented, they're just begging for trouble in today's litigious environment.


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Originally Posted by ResQguy View Post
I'd be more concerned with carrying your driver's license when operating a motor vehicle on public roadways than a police officer giving a lawful order to produce some kind of ID in its place. You should be happy they give you that second chance before hauling you off to the magistrate.

Legal requirements to provide your Social Security number
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Old 02-23-2013, 11:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spleen View Post
On the road, yes, but there's no requirement to carry ID if using public transportation, or for that matter, walking down a public street...
In many states, there are laws on the books that state you MUST carry a valid state issued photo ID at all times when out in the public. Does not matter if you are walking down the street or whatever. You can be fined with a misdemeanor if you cannot provide a valid state issued ID or other acceptable form of identification for those here from other countries.

Edit: Missouri used to use a 16 digit number that began with a single letter for you driver license or state ID card.
Then they changed that many years ago and the only number used was your SSN. When identity theft started increasing, Missouri allowed you too chose between your SSN or a computer generated number. Today, they only use the computer generated number but there are still many Missouri residents that still carry valid ID's with their SSN on them as they have not yet expired. As those expire, they will get a generated number when they renew their license of state ID.

Last edited by kruser; 02-23-2013 at 11:39 AM..
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Old 02-23-2013, 12:45 PM
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I'd like to see your source(s), but this isn't the forum for this discussion. Bottom line is that there may be places with some sort of ID-carry law on the books, but the courts have already ruled against the cops on this one. As a U.S. citizen, you are not required to carry a photo ID at all times (technically, you aren't even required to own a photo ID other than a driver's license) and furthermore, you have the right to not even talk to the police. That said, if you're caught committing a crime or heavily suspected of committing a crime, the cops will argue probable cause and probably win if you claim the right to not talk to the cops during your arrest/field interview.
Think about it...if you were required to carry a photo ID, about a third of the population of New York City would be "criminals". People are born there, live their entire lives there, and die there, and never once got behind the wheel of a car. Their only photo ID might be employer-issued. There will be things you will not be able to do or participate in because you don't have that ID, especially post 9/11, but you can't get locked up for it.


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Originally Posted by kruser View Post
In many states, there are laws on the books that state you MUST carry a valid state issued photo ID at all times when out in the public. Does not matter if you are walking down the street or whatever. You can be fined with a misdemeanor if you cannot provide a valid state issued ID or other acceptable form of identification for those here from other countries.

Edit: Missouri used to use a 16 digit number that began with a single letter for you driver license or state ID card.
Then they changed that many years ago and the only number used was your SSN. When identity theft started increasing, Missouri allowed you too chose between your SSN or a computer generated number. Today, they only use the computer generated number but there are still many Missouri residents that still carry valid ID's with their SSN on them as they have not yet expired. As those expire, they will get a generated number when they renew their license of state ID.
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Old 02-23-2013, 1:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spleen View Post
Bottom line is that there may be places with some sort of ID-carry law on the books, but the courts have already ruled against the cops on this one. As a U.S. citizen, you are not required to carry a photo ID at all times (technically, you aren't even required to own a photo ID other than a driver's license) and furthermore, you have the right to not even talk to the police.
I'm not even sure if Missouri makes it law but what happens is up to the officer involved. I was told there is such a law on the books in the state though. I've also talked with others that were issued citations for not carrying a valid ID. Perhaps those get thrown out when they go to court.

If the office does not like something about you, your answer, the way you are acting etc, they can take you in and hold you with no charges at all.
I forget the allowable limit but it used to be something like 21 hours at which time they had to either charge you with something or release you.
Of course they can do that even if you have valid ID on your person.
It is in your best interest around here to carry valid ID for the above reason alone. Usually if you have it and are not acting in a suspicious way, they check you out and you go on your merry way.

I do still hear SSN's broadcast over many of the PD department's radios here. We are still mostly analog and a lot of the small muni's do not have MDT's in their cars so the SSN is how they will do it.
I know some officers for a muni that does not use any form of MDT, they will call in SSN's via cell phone when they have someone stopped that only knows their SSN.
In most cases, as long as the description obtained via the SSN matches the person they have stopped, they let them go unless of course they have warrants.
I've heard situations were there are twins and the officer will take the person in so they can verify identity via fingerprints in most cases just to make sure you are not posing as your twin. For those cases, they only do that if one of the twins does have active warrants.

And yes, this has all became much worse post 9/11. Before 9/11, they would not even stop you if you were staggering down the road late at night as you made your way home from the bar!
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Old 02-23-2013, 2:13 PM
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Default SSN over the air?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spleen View Post
I'd like to see your source(s), but this isn't the forum for this discussion. Bottom line is that there may be places with some sort of ID-carry law on the books, but the courts have already ruled against the cops on this one. As a U.S. citizen, you are not required to carry a photo ID at all times (technically, you aren't even required to own a photo ID other than a driver's license) and furthermore, you have the right to not even talk to the police. That said, if you're caught committing a crime or heavily suspected of committing a crime, the cops will argue probable cause and probably win if you claim the right to not talk to the cops during your arrest/field interview.
Think about it...if you were required to carry a photo ID, about a third of the population of New York City would be "criminals". People are born there, live their entire lives there, and die there, and never once got behind the wheel of a car. Their only photo ID might be employer-issued. There will be things you will not be able to do or participate in because you don't have that ID, especially post 9/11, but you can't get locked up for it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop_and_identify_statutes




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