Garbled PSR-600

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cjw124

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Hello everyone. I have a psr-600 that I recently purchased. I have had it back to the dealer multiple times for adjustments as the digital channels are garbled. The dealer I bought it from is very familiar with the system operating here in Onondaga County as he does the repair for alot of the EMS services. He has said my area is a problem area trying to get things right. I have tried several different antennas along with all his adujustments and still garbled. Any ideas from any of you? Thanks in advance!!
 

fineshot1

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Perhaps you are near one of the tower sites and your receiver is being blasted
by too much very strong rf from multiple transmitters. Have you tried the attenuator
function yet to see if it helps in the decoding?
 

MegaHertz315

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PLEASE read this:

Simulcast digital distortion - The RadioReference Wiki

It does a GREAT job explaining the problem!

The "dealer" won't tell you about this because all they care are about is the $ $ $ they are getting from you. They don't want to tell you anything that will discourage you from not purchasing it or you returning it.

You might think the dealer you bought it from maybe very familiar with the system operating here in Onondaga County, but the scanners operate differently (as far as coverage/reception is concerned). And he should know this. If he isn't aware of it, then he might not really know about it as much as you think he does (the scanner listening part of it).

Read that entire article and things will make more sense. The article is very well written.

Are you using an outside antenna? When you select "tune" and enter 460.5000, what is the signal strength?
 
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cjw124

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I actually got the scanner from Al at Nu-Tronics. He has done all of the adjustments for nothing. I actually used to work for him 30 years ago. LOL He has been great, If I don't figure this out he said he will stop by the house in a couple of weeks to try and get it right. I am in Camillus and he said it is one of the hardest ares to get right. The wiki did help and i an going to try some of the suggestions. I have tried 3 different antennas including a piece of wire cut to length for UHF and I keep getting the same results. I turn on the Attenuater and I lose the the police channels completely. Is the attenuater adjustable from the keypad?
 

fineshot1

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If you turned on the attenuator and lost the system then that is most likely not the problem.

Read the article KC2CNY posted as that would have been one of my next educated guess's.
 

cjw124

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I did read the article that KC2CNY suggested and it was very helpful so my thanks go out to him. I'm sure I'll get it right eventually. It's just a pain. LOL But any suggestions help. Thank you's to all.
 

radiodude817

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I have also read the article about multicast transmissions. In WNY the only simulcast system I know about
is the one in Ontario, Canada. I have been monitoring this system on and off for a couple of years now with a PSR-600. What is interesting to me is the acceptance of garbled or broken up communications. This system uses analog for Highway & Hospital traffic, P25 for police and some encripted comms for Niagara Regional Police. I would guess that 1 out of 20 P25 communications are unreadable to me as well as the dispatcher or
patrol car as they frequently ask for a repeat of the message. In this case it seems the system is at fault. In my estimated 20% of missed communications that I have seen, seems to be a very high rate of failure.

As my friend a TV broadcast engineer states, "this digital stuff is not quite ready for primetime".
 

cjw124

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Same thing here Radiodude. Police and the like are are digital while Fire and EMS are analog. I am just having problems with the digital channels. I think the next step in going with a directional antenna. I even tried a piece of wire cut to UHF length and still got the same thing. LOL
 

radiodude817

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Are you sure its your radio and not the system. You should look for someone in your area to verify either way.
If its a system problem there is nothing you can do to fix it.
 

cjw124

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Onondaga County, NY
Radiodude it seems to be a location problem. The radio works fine at the place I bought it, like usual. I have been told this area is a problem. Hopefully I can get it working.
 

fineshot1

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Radiodude it seems to be a location problem. The radio works fine at the place I bought it, like usual. I have been told this area is a problem. Hopefully I can get it working.

Your receive problems may also be due to a high noise level in your home.

High noise levels can cause a data decode problem for digital reception where
as for analog that is not a problem.

Power off all of your household appliances (especially your internet routers/modems)
one by one and see if the reception problem for digital gets any better.
 

PCN

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I'm having the same problem in Marcellus at the lower section by the creek. I had to put an outside antenna up to get any decent signal at all. I think I am getting either Rose Hill, Skaneateles or Stump Road Towers. I read in the minutes on the County Web Site that they are in the process of changing licenses to move the Stump Rd. Tower to better cover Marcellus, which should give me a decent signal and might help knock out the weaker ones that I assume are creating the problem..

My radio (BCD996T) does not do this and works fine at the NuTronics store as well as my summer camp on Skaneateles Lake that has a line of site location to the Rose Hill Tower.

About half of the transmissions are garbled and sound like they are off frequency. I monitor the EMT Dispatch and the Fire Dispatch repeater on a seperate scanner (460.025 EMT and 453,850 Fire).

I monitor talkgroups 45,46,48 and 51 on the BCD996T.

Is there another radio available that might handle this problem better than the Uniden?
 
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studgeman

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I have also read the article about multicast transmissions. In WNY the only simulcast system I know about
is the one in Ontario, Canada. I have been monitoring this system on and off for a couple of years now with a PSR-600. What is interesting to me is the acceptance of garbled or broken up communications. This system uses analog for Highway & Hospital traffic, P25 for police and some encripted comms for Niagara Regional Police. I would guess that 1 out of 20 P25 communications are unreadable to me as well as the dispatcher or
patrol car as they frequently ask for a repeat of the message. In this case it seems the system is at fault. In my estimated 20% of missed communications that I have seen, seems to be a very high rate of failure.

As my friend a TV broadcast engineer states, "this digital stuff is not quite ready for primetime".

First, you care comparing apples to oranges, Bell Fleetnet is a completely different type of system. It is neither simulcast nor P25. it is a multicast, motorola type II with P25 audio. The digital is not the problem with the system it is the enginering, that system is not designed for 95%+ coverage, most wide area systems of that time period were designed for about 80% coverage. It is designed to coverage a hurge are with only a handful of towers. That is why no major metro area really uses it. When Lambton County (Sarnia) moved to the system they added several towers. They knew that requirement up front.
 

KA1RBI

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That article is OK but is not complete and omits mentioning the root cause of the problem (that scanners are doing DSP sampling post-detection).

Rather than reiterate, please see

http://forums.radioreference.com/ne...ndaga-county-garbled-bcd996t.html#post1698713

I tried editing the above wiki article but it would not let me - would the mods please consider updating that wiki article accordingly - (first that the root cause is scanners do DSP sampling post-detection; and second, that it ain't that much harder of a mod to open up a scanner to tap its IF than it is to disc-tap it)...

Best Regards

Max

p.s. just to keep this on-topic for Onondaga county, I don't have to go to Syracuse on July 4th to watch the fireworks display - I watch from my back porch. They do a GREAT job.
 
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