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Old 01-10-2017, 1:00 PM
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Default NYPD going encrypted?

Heard from a reliable source that NYPD has ordered new radios from Motorola that are encryption capable. I don't have any further details.
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Old 01-10-2017, 1:17 PM
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All new Motorola APX radio's have encryption already built into the radios now. It's not an add on feature anymore. Now to how much encryption or any encryption is used is the unknown equation.
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Old 01-10-2017, 2:42 PM
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Originally Posted by weathermedic View Post
Heard from a reliable source that NYPD has ordered new radios from Motorola that are encryption capable. I don't have any further details.
Only on like 4 or 5 channels.
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Old 01-10-2017, 6:04 PM
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What channels?
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Old 01-10-2017, 7:11 PM
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Originally Posted by 55engine View Post
What channels?
From New York City County, New York (NY) Scanner Frequencies and Radio Frequency Reference

470.63750 473.63750 WIF561 RM EF1 NAC VIP VIP Escort (Detective 2) (Encr.) P25 Law Tac
471.01250
474.01250 WIF569 RM EF3 NAC OCCB 2 Organized Crime Control Bur. 2 (Encr) P25 Law Tac
470.88750
473.88750 WIF560 RM EF0 NAC CW 4 Citywide 4 (Encrypted) P25 Law Tac
471.13750
474.13750 WIF566 RM EF4 NAC Command Command (Encrypted) P25
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Old 01-10-2017, 10:08 PM
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There are 5 citywide channels with P25 and crypto capability: CMD, CW4, DET2, IAB, OCCB2.

On each of these channels, the old analog system remains in place and can be switched back in as needed.

There are currently only a few special commands with P25 radios with crypto, and right now only IAB and CMD have the P25 infrastructure turned on. The other 3 channels are in the old (unencrypted) analog mode at the moment.

As new radios come in, expect to see more crypto on these channels. But it will be confined to special uses on these channels. The bulk of the NYPD system will remain analog and encrypted for the foreseeable future. In particular, there are no current plans to expand the P25 capability to other channels, such as SOD or the precinct zone dispatch channels.
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Old 01-10-2017, 10:09 PM
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Originally Posted by allend View Post
All new Motorola APX radio's have encryption already built into the radios now. It's not an add on feature anymore. Now to how much encryption or any encryption is used is the unknown equation.
Yes, it's built into those radios, but it's still an optional feature that they charge for to enable.
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Old 01-11-2017, 12:24 AM
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Originally Posted by blaze View Post
Yes, it's built into those radios, but it's still an optional feature that they charge for to enable.
He is talking about ADP which comes free and can be used at no extra cost. You get one free key, if you want multi key or AES then you have to pay
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Old 01-11-2017, 12:30 AM
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Originally Posted by tbendick View Post
He is talking about ADP which comes free and can be used at no extra cost. You get one free key, if you want multi key or AES then you have to pay
The NYPD P25 radios are mostly Vertex. The NYPD keys are all AES256.
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Old 01-11-2017, 3:01 AM
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Default New radio and t band give back

Two question one is what new model radios they ordered. last why order new radios with the uhf t band give back
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Old 01-11-2017, 3:33 AM
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I believe TAC G is now encrypted as well. I may be mistaken, but I recall monitoring last year and one unit asked to go to TAC G and when I switched to it, all I heard was hash. Since I now live in Virginia, I can only monitor when visiting NYC every few months, so verifying for me is a drawn out process.
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Old 01-11-2017, 6:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Jimru View Post
I believe TAC G is now encrypted as well. I may be mistaken, but I recall monitoring last year and one unit asked to go to TAC G and when I switched to it, all I heard was hash. Since I now live in Virginia, I can only monitor when visiting NYC every few months, so verifying for me is a drawn out process.
Those units that switched at that time must have elected to use P25 mode. Tac G is just a simplex channel. There is no repeater. Any mode may be used there, depending on the users at that time. I still hear Aviation on there on occasion using+ analog. That is all I can hear being 70 miles from the city.
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Old 01-11-2017, 6:48 AM
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Originally Posted by MFR401 View Post
last why order new radios with the uhf t band give back
Putting aside the notion that NYC's attitude towards the giveback is basically "Come at me, bro"...

The start of the long T-Band recovery and auction process is not set to begin until February 2021, which is a full four years away. That's only the first step of the process, with the actual deadline for clearing public safety from the band is not until early 2023.

So here we are in January of 2017, a full four to six years before the giveback will actually have any real effect on users...and what exactly do you want the NYPD or any other T-Band user to do until that time if they need new equipment? Duct tape and bubble gum to fix radios that are probably already a few years old and falling apart under the constant use and abuse they receive in the city?
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Old 01-11-2017, 12:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimru View Post
I believe TAC G is now encrypted as well. I may be mistaken, but I recall monitoring last year and one unit asked to go to TAC G and when I switched to it, all I heard was hash. Since I now live in Virginia, I can only monitor when visiting NYC every few months, so verifying for me is a drawn out process.
As others have noted, Tac G is a direct (simplex) channel, and used mostly by SOD. They don't have encrypted radios at this time, so it wasn't them. There are co-channel users, however, and you might have heard some other agency, depending on your particular location.
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Old 01-11-2017, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by GTR8000 View Post
Putting aside the notion that NYC's attitude towards the giveback is basically "Come at me, bro"...

The start of the long T-Band recovery and auction process is not set to begin until February 2021, which is a full four years away. That's only the first step of the process, with the actual deadline for clearing public safety from the band is not until early 2023.

So here we are in January of 2017, a full four to six years before the giveback will actually have any real effect on users...and what exactly do you want the NYPD or any other T-Band user to do until that time if they need new equipment? Duct tape and bubble gum to fix radios that are probably already a few years old and falling apart under the constant use and abuse they receive in the city?

Exactly. No one seriously believes any t-band giveback is going to happen in NY metro area any time soon.

The NYPD t-band system is *extremely* well engineered, with a *lot* of infrastructure spread throughout the city. They just added transit to it, and just replaced five of the citywide channels with new P25 bases and receivers.

If the feds try to make them give back T-Band any time soon, NYC would likely secede from the Union first.
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Old 01-11-2017, 2:30 PM
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Originally Posted by blaze View Post
As others have noted, Tac G is a direct (simplex) channel, and used mostly by SOD. They don't have encrypted radios at this time, so it wasn't them. There are co-channel users, however, and you might have heard some other agency, depending on your particular location.

Roger that, thx!
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Old 01-12-2017, 12:54 AM
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From what I know and have seen, mostly all the units that fall under SOD (ESU, K-9 etc) are all using APX7000's now that were recently issued, along with the Transit Bureau and CRC. I would assume the new radios they are getting are either APX7000's or APX6000's. IAB has been issued APX6000's. I know Motorola discontinued the APX7000 few months back, but when it comes to the NYPD they get Motorola to do special things for them. I guess when it comes to selling approximately 30,000 radios to a customer they may make an exception For the NYPD. I would doubt they would purchase the APX8000 since they don't really have a need for a four band radio. But it certainly would not surprise me.

As for encryption on Tac-G, I highly doubt it. I hear clear transmissions on it from time to time. That really wouldn't work out too well for the officers who are still carrying radios that are not encryption capable who utilize Tac-G.
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Old 01-12-2017, 1:31 AM
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From what I know and have seen, mostly all the units that fall under SOD (ESU, K-9 etc) are all using APX7000's now that were recently issued, along with the Transit Bureau and CRC. I would assume the new radios they are getting are either APX7000's or APX6000's. IAB has been issued APX6000's. I know Motorola discontinued the APX7000 few months back, but when it comes to the NYPD they get Motorola to do special things for them. I guess when it comes to selling approximately 30,000 radios to a customer they may make an exception For the NYPD. I would doubt they would purchase the APX8000 since they don't really have a need for a four band radio. But it certainly would not surprise me.

As for encryption on Tac-G, I highly doubt it. I hear clear transmissions on it from time to time. That really wouldn't work out too well for the officers who are still carrying radios that are not encryption capable who utilize Tac-G.
The 7000 hasn't been discontinued entirely yet, just the models with UHF.
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Old 01-12-2017, 8:19 AM
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The 8000 is available at reduced pricing with a subset of bands enabled in the flashcode... all the way down to making it a super duper 6000-type with one band only.

They may opt for a 2-band flashcode in the 8000, which is what Moto has been showcasing to replace the 7000s
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