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Old 04-25-2014, 6:42 PM
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Default Wake County Simulcast: How to hear it once again!

Evening Folks!
The Wake County Simulcast System has undergone rebanding over the last few days.
There are some important changes that you need to make in your scanner before you can
once again monitor Wake County Communications. Let's go through this step by step.

What has happened: The Wake County Simulcast System (which is still part of
the statewide VIPER system currently) has undergone rebanding.

What is rebanding?
We have a great article on Rebanding (or Refarming) in the RR.com Wiki:
Rebanding - The RadioReference Wiki
A simple explanation is that due to an agreement between SprintNextel and the FCC frequencies once used by Public Safety in the 862Mhz-869Mhz have to be vacated and moved down to the range of 851Mhz-854Mhz.
This affects scanners because of the way Motorola systems operate. Scanners use a calculation method to figure out which frequency to "go to" to follow a conversation on a Motorola System. Trouble is that calculation method was devised before rebanding was conceived and only works on frequencies in the 862Mhz-869Mhz ranges. This calculation method does not work in the rebanded ranges of 851Mhz-854Mhz. So we have to "tell" the scanner how to calculate which frequency to go to on systems that have moved to the 851Mhz-854Mhz range.

First things first: Let's update our Control Channel List for the Wake Simulcast System.
We do need to put the new Wake County rebanded Control Channel Frequencies into our scanners and delete the old pre-rebanding Control Channel Frequencies.
So delete the Frequencies 868.150Mhz, 868.5375, 868.5625 and 868.7875.
They are no longer valid.
For the time being if you normally monitor the main Wake Simulcast system enter in the following 4 Control Channel Frequencies:

---853.150Mhz
---853.9625Mhz
---853.7875Mhz
---853.5375Mhz


If you normally live in the Southern Part of Wake County and have monitored the Fuquay Varina IR Site in the past add the following
2 Control Channel Frequencies:
---853.925Mhz
---853.4625Mhz


For most recent scanners all you have to enter is the Control Channel Freqs above and not the voice channels.

HOWEVER,
WE ARE NOT DONE YET! We are only halfway finished!
We still have to tell the scanner how to calculate frequencies on our rebanded Wake System.
How do we tell the scanner how to calculate the correct rebanded frequency?
We use a feature called "Custom Tables" that all recent Trunking Scanners have.
It will vary a little from software package to software package but the end result is the same...it is the addition of 2 lines of info:

Quote:

Lo Freq | Hi Freq | Step | Offset
851.0250 | 854.0000 | 25.0 | 440
851.0125 | 868.9875 | 25.0 | 0
What do those 2 lines mean?
--Line 1 (the one that ends in 440) tells the scanner how to calculate a frequeny on a rebanded system.
If the scanner does not pick up a rebanded Control Channel in the 851-854Mhz range then the scanner ignores Line 1 and goes to Line 2.
--Line 2 (the one that starts with 851.0125) tells the scanner how to handle a non-rebanded system.

Our Wake County Simulcast System from here on out should always rely on Line 1.

How do we add the above 2 rebanded table lines to scanner software?
It depends on the scanner software.
For Freescan:
Look at the following Image:
http://i.imgur.com/xbETvkk.jpg
In the Wake County Site Click on the site then click the box "Site Type" then choose "Moto Custom/Reband Type II". You will then see the box at the bottom left pop up for "System Band Plan". Leave the values as is and DO NOT CLICK THE AUTO UPPER.
Make sure your Control Channels of 853.150Mhz and 853.9625Mhz are listed in the "Trunk Frequencies" Tab. Write the changes back to your scanner. You are now back in business! Congrats!

For Win500:
Look at the following Image:
http://i.imgur.com/kzfB5ac.jpg
Go to "TSYS OBJECTS". Then click the "Trunking Tables" box to the right.
Now make sure "800Mhz Rebanded" is selected and your table looks like the pic above.
Make sure your Control Channels of 853.150Mhz and 853.9625Mhz are listed in the "System Frequencies" box. Write the changes back to your scanner. You are now back in business! Congrats!

For Win96:
Look at the following image:
http://i.imgur.com/pnFM1JM.jpg

Go to the Box labeled "MOT 3600 CC" circled in red. Select "Multi-Table". Then click
the "Extended Tables" box. You will see the "Extended Trunking Tables" box pop up.
Select the option for "800Mhz Rebanded". You should see the display pictured above.
Select "Ok".
Make sure you have the Control Channel of 853.150Mhz and 853.9625Mhz listed in the bank on the left hand side and that they are marked as "Motorola". Write the changes back to your scanner. You are now back in business! Congrats!

These are the 3 software packages I have been asked about the most. If others wish to provide steps on how to update trunking tables in other software packages feel free to do so! Please provide pics to make it easier on folks.

Please remember that there could still be changes/modifications as time goes on so I will update this thread and the database listing as I get accurate, verified info.

If you see anything that needs updating/correcting please email or post here and I will update this thread as time allows.

Thanks for being a part of RR.com and Happy (rebanded) Monitoring!
Marshall KE4ZNR
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Last edited by KE4ZNR; 05-05-2014 at 1:41 PM.. Reason: added Fuquay IR Site info
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Old 04-25-2014, 8:29 PM
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Marshall, like always, thanks for your help!

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Old 04-25-2014, 8:43 PM
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All- with the rebanding completed (or is it really?), suggestions on how long to wait before purchasing the latest home patrol scanners?
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Old 04-26-2014, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randyg711 View Post
All- with the rebanding completed (or is it really?), suggestions on how long to wait before purchasing the latest home patrol scanners?
Hey Randy! Good to see you here!
Why wait?
All current scanners (including the HomePatrol line) can handle rebanded systems easily.
Once I made the adjustments to the CCs and the tables in all 3 of my
HomePatrol Units (HP-1, BCD436HP, BCD536HP) I am able to hear Wake County Communications again no problem.
I would as that we keep this thread on the topic of Wake County Rebanding....if there is a need to have a thread discussing anything else lets keep that topic separate.
Thanks and Happy Monitoring!
Marshall KE4ZNR
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Old 04-28-2014, 7:19 AM
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I have been asked to provide a tutorial on how to reband Wake County sites using Sentinel for
the HomePatrol-1. Here is how to do that step by step:

1) Highlight the Favorites List you wish to reband then select the "Pencil with the Star" Icon at the top of the screen (seen here in Red Box):



2) Make sure you have the same Favorites List selected in the following box and select "OK":


3) Now we are in the Favorites List Editor as seen below:


4) Select the Site as seen below and in the "Frequencies" Tab DELETE all 868.xxxMhz frequencies and add the 2 new control channels of 853.150Mhz and 853.9625Mhz:


5) Now select the 3rd Tab at the top "Band Plan". In the box circled in red select "Custom". Then make your table look exactly like this:


6) Click "File" then "Save" then exit out of the Favorites List Editor.

7) IMPORTANT: NOW WRITE YOUR CHANGES BACK TO YOUR HP-1.
IF YOU DO NOT WRITE YOUR CHANGES BACK TO YOUR HP-1 THEN NONE OF THE CHANGES YOU MADE ABOVE WILL TAKE EFFECT.

8) You need to make the above changes for every Wake County Site you have in any Favorites List!

9) Later today when the new HP-1 Master Database is released it will have the updated Wake County Site info (along with custom tables) so any favorites lists from here on out created from the latest Master Database should not need to be adjusted.

Hope this helps the HP-1 users!
Marshall KE4ZNR
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Last edited by KE4ZNR; 04-28-2014 at 7:20 AM.. Reason: clarity
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Old 04-28-2014, 8:06 AM
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Thanks Marshall. I successfully did my HP, 436 & 536 over the weekend with the guidance you had posted earlier. It was not hard to do.

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Old 04-28-2014, 8:25 AM
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Thanks for the guidance, Marshall. Question: I have a few other control channels in the 868.xxxx range in my Wake County site. Can those be safely removed also?
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Old 04-28-2014, 5:23 PM
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Mine is working fine for some of the time but not all the time. BCD996T, and it's sticking a lot on 853.2625 and won't leave that frequency unless I hit the scan button again.
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Old 04-28-2014, 5:24 PM
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By the way there is no audio on that frequency and nothing to show that there is a signal or P25 transmission going on
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Old 04-29-2014, 7:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pelargir View Post
Thanks for the guidance, Marshall. Question: I have a few other control channels in the 868.xxxx range in my Wake County site. Can those be safely removed also?
You can delete all 868.xxxMhz frequencies. They should no longer be in use.
Marshall KE4ZNR
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Old 04-29-2014, 7:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthorpe View Post
Mine is working fine for some of the time but not all the time. BCD996T, and it's sticking a lot on 853.2625 and won't leave that frequency unless I hit the scan button again.
Let me do some research. I have not noticed anything like this on my
radios (HomePatrol-1, 396XT, BCD436HP, BCD536HP).
The severe weather coming into Central NC should provide good chance to
figure this out.
Marshall KE4ZNR
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Old 04-29-2014, 7:31 AM
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There is a constant signal on that frequency. Whether it be idle data or active, its always there. Is there a way to ignore that frequency, until we figure it out? Its odd to say the least.
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Old 04-29-2014, 8:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthorpe View Post
There is a constant signal on that frequency. Whether it be idle data or active, its always there. Is there a way to ignore that frequency, until we figure it out? Its odd to say the least.
Got the scoop: There is an intentional constant carrier on that frequency on purpose.
There is some site coverage testing going on.
So there is nothing wrong with your (or anyone elses) radio.
Marshall KE4ZNR
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Old 04-29-2014, 8:48 AM
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Is there a way to eliminate from the list or would we have to turn off cc only and leave it out of the mix?
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Old 04-29-2014, 8:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jthorpe View Post
Is there a way to eliminate from the list or would we have to turn off cc only and leave it out of the mix?
Turning off CC Only and leaving it out of the list is the only way I know of to eliminate
the frequency.

I have been told that this testing should be resolved by this afternoon.
Marshall KE4ZNR
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Old 04-29-2014, 9:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KE4ZNR View Post
Turning off CC Only and leaving it out of the list is the only way I know of to eliminate
the frequency.

I have been told that this testing should be resolved by this afternoon.
Marshall KE4ZNR
ok ill just leave it alone and see what happens. I hate scanning with my XTL because then I miss my dispatcher so I have my scanner in the car to hear everyone else without losing my own channel's transmissions.
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Old 04-29-2014, 9:49 AM
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I've been having fits as well with my PSR-500 and the 396T in my shack (ProSCAN server scanner) parking on 853.2625. Found a 5-plus hour long recording of nothing but motorboating (trunking data channel) on my ProSCAN list. Missed 5 hours of good recording. Hopefully it's short lived. Thanks for the detailed explanation, Marshall!

Looking at Trunk88, that channel is offline as I type this and I see VIPER techs doing some testing on their various TG's.
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Old 04-29-2014, 2:48 PM
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Marshall

Have a Uniden 396T. Upgraded to firmware 3.02.02
Using Freescan D/L old pre reband program
Made changes per your instructions above.
--Deleted the 4 Freq from the trunk freq list
--Added the 2 853.150Mhz ---853.9625Mhz to the trunk freq list at the bottom
Uploaded but did NOT Erase all
Uploaded just the changed groups
When on hold on a particular channel (Fire Alert for example)
*** I get a flashing message---- Finding CtrlChan****
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Old 04-29-2014, 4:23 PM
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A big hat tip to all who contributed information to fix the issues created with the rebanding. I follow the instructions on three different model scanners and it fixed all of my problems.
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Old 04-29-2014, 8:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KE4ZNR View Post
Got the scoop: There is an intentional constant carrier on that frequency on purpose.
There is some site coverage testing going on.
So there is nothing wrong with your (or anyone elses) radio.
Marshall KE4ZNR
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris-KH2PM View Post
I've been having fits as well with my PSR-500 and the 396T in my shack (ProSCAN server scanner) parking on 853.2625. Found a 5-plus hour long recording of nothing but motorboating (trunking data channel) on my ProSCAN list. Missed 5 hours of good recording. Hopefully it's short lived. Thanks for the detailed explanation, Marshall!

Looking at Trunk88, that channel is offline as I type this and I see VIPER techs doing some testing on their various TG's.
Not trying to butt in on a system 1000 miles from me...but...

Are the people having the issue with this frequency seeing it "lock up" while they are trunk tracking? If so that means a call was assigned to that frequency.

Strange things are afoot at the Circle K.
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