Scanning MARCS conventionally... why?

[mtindor]

I can routinely monitor [and _want_ to monitor] 9 MARCS sites and can sometimes monitor another four depending on conditions. I got sick and tired of how long it takes to scan the MARCS system trunked - 1.5-2 seconds per site x 9 sites = 13.5-18 seconds to scan the system just _one_ time. You miss a ton of traffic that way.

So, I decided I'd also set up a conventional system - I call it 'MARCS CONV'. I then set up a group for each site, such as 'MC New Alex' or 'MC Bridgeport'. In each group I add the respective channels (frequencies) for that area. Then I go and lock out the active control channels.

So then, when I feel like missing as little activity as possible _and_ I don't care if I know who is talking other than what site they are talking from. Sure, I can't lock out trunk groups that I don't want to hear, but I can live with that.

One large caveat is that the transmitter for each frequency on a site is keyed up for a second or so - and this happens every x # of seconds (haven't figured out how often). It's an annoyance because while you are scanning you find a lot of quick keyups. But it still scans the numerous MARCS sites a helluva lot faster (probably on the order of 10x faster on average) than scanning it in trunked fashion.

So if I'm not hellbent on picking up new TGs, I'll turn off the MARCS trunked and turn on the MARCS CONV system and then I'll scan my local county's trunked system. I miss _much_less_ traffic this way - at the expense of giving up the ability to (a) see who is talking, (b) lock out annoying TGs - and of course I have to hear the occasional dead air transmissions that occur on each freq.

I just figured I'd post this because I really like having the ability to use both trunked and conventional when the spirit moves me. Sure, anybody can do this, but how many think of doing it? I say that if you can monitor a lot of sites from your home location and you _want_ to monitor them without missing a lot of traffic and are willing to put up with some of the cons of doing so, go for it

Mike

 

[Dubbin]

So if I'm not hellbent on picking up new TGs, I'll turn off the MARCS trunked and turn on the MARCS CONV

So how are you going to know if you found a new TG and what the ID is?

 

[mtindor]

So how are you going to know if you found a new TG and what the ID is?

I said "So if I'm not hellbent on picking up new TGs, I'll turn off the MARCS trunked and turn on the MARCS CONV." So, you must assume that at the time I'm scanning conventionally, I am not hellbent on picking up any new TGs.

Sure, it's very enjoyable to sit around and wait for new TGs to pop up to try and identify them, but I also get a lot of enjoyment out of actually hearing what is going on in my area.

Bottom line is that for the _most_ part, if something is heard on the sites I listen to, it most likely is specific traffic to/from vehicles/posts/sites in my general area and I can probably figure out what they are talking about even if I don't know a TG. If it pops up on my display as coming from MC Stratton, 99% of the time it is going to be a Steubenville post unit talking to Wintersville. Sure, might occasionally get some Columbiana County traffic, or LDH stuff come across there, or Liquor Control (which I hear sometimes down here on the weekends when they are busting a joint).

Also - if it sounds like some new activity that is going to be ongoing for a few minutes, I already know what site they were talking on based upon the fact that I put a specific site's frequencies in a group with a recognizable name (MC Stratton) and I can just use a Quickkey (presuming I know how - and i dont, i'd do it manually) to switch on the MARCS trunked site that I heard them on - then I'll monitor it for a TG.

I just find that a lot of the time I'd rather be hearing what is going on in my area rather than specifically dedicating my 500 dollar scanner to scannign 10 sites, picking up 1/10th of what i could pick up, just to find out what new TGIDs pop up. And I find that having a conventional system with those frequencies in it comes in handy for for hearing what I want to hear.

- Mike

 

[Dubbin]

I said "So if I'm not hellbent on picking up new TGs, I'll turn off the MARCS trunked and turn on the MARCS CONV." So, you must assume that at the time I'm scanning conventionally, I am not hellbent on picking up any new TGs.

Umm I knew that and it wasn't me that said the above

 

[JoeyC]

I suppose if all one wants to do is hear traffic on the system, listening to a bunch of busy trunked sites conventionally works. I like to know what/who I am hearing. Listening to a busy statewide system conventionally allows you to hear everything on the system in a highly disorganized manner. If thats your forte, more power to ya!

 

[mtindor]

I suppose if all one wants to do is hear traffic on the system, listening to a bunch of busy trunked sites conventionally works. I like to know what/who I am hearing. Listening to a busy statewide system conventionally allows you to hear everything on the system in a highly disorganized manner. If thats your forte, more power to ya!

Hmm, it's not always my preferred way. But it does come in handy for me. Disorganized is a relative term - disorganized if you are used to mostly listening to trunked systems. But if you've been listening to radio traffic via a scanner for 20 or 30 years you are used to it being disorganized and don't really look at it from that perspective. Back before trunked systems were around, you had no choice but to listen in a disorganized fashion, no?

And I suppose if I lived in a major metro area or a 'high traffic' area as far as radio comms goes, I'd feel more like monitoring the trunked system. But where I'm at, even though I can hear 9-13 MARCS sites on any given night, even with 9 sites in there I rarely hear a peep simply because there isn't a lot of traffic on the sites I am close to and monitor. So for me, taking 18 seconds to scan a system is a high price to pay when (a) I must monitor so many sites just to hear anything at all, (b) those sites have very little traffic on them and (c) the time it takes to scan the whole system means that I often would miss hearing a few other conversations that I would otherwise pick up had I not been waiting on the scanner to finish scanning the 9 sites for traffic.

When you hear so little out of MARCS (like I do in my area), quantity is often more important than quality. The more I hear, the better I like it - even if it means that I might not be getting all the neat little data to go along with it.

Mike

PS: BTW, it wasn't that long ago that people listened to scanners to hear what is going on

 

[Dubbin]

Back before trunked systems were around, you had no choice but to listen in a disorganized fashion, no?

Not really because you knew who the frequencies belonged to.

 

[mtindor]

Not really because you knew who the frequencies belonged to.

Hey man, stop bustin my bawls rofl. You're right though. But for all the people who go TG hunting, they spend countless hours tracking them only to NOT figure out who is using them - or at least not finding out for weeks or months.

That isn't to say that I don't hunt for TGs - but my forte is DXing trunked systems. I want to hear them, I want to map them, I want to locate them. After i've exhausted all possibilities within my listening area and an hour and a half travel distance, I'll then start to monitor systems more for TGs

Mike

 

[Mylan]

Ok here's what I think:
(this pertains only to my car where i only have one scanner)

Since around here there aren't many marcs users (almost exclusivly OSP) I program the voice channels of the bridgeport and powhatan sites into conventional banks. I can always tell who is talking because of their traffic.(posts 07, 30, 41)
IF by chance I hear somthing I dont recognize, I can quickly activate the corresponding site's trunking bank to quickly ID the unidetifiable TG I do this because like mtindor said, it really sucks to miss so much while the scanner checks the control channel for each site. This way I only have to consistantly scan two trunking systems instead of four.

one feature about the powhatan site is that it only becomes active when there is a patrol unit in the area that has a radio turned on whereas the bridgeport site brodcasts every transmission on post 07 TG so when I'm driving down route seven south of the moundsville bridge I know if there is a cop in the area once I hear a transmission (not that I speed or anything

 

[mtindor]

Ok here's what I think:
(this pertains only to my car where i only have one scanner)

Since around here there aren't many marcs users (almost exclusivly OSP) I program the voice channels of the bridgeport and powhatan sites into conventional banks. I can always tell who is talking because of their traffic.(posts 07, 30, 41)
IF by chance I hear somthing I dont recognize, I can quickly activate the corresponding site's trunking bank to quickly ID the unidetifiable TG I do this because like mtindor said, it really sucks to miss so much while the scanner checks the control channel for each site. This way I only have to consistantly scan two trunking systems instead of four.

one feature about the powhatan site is that it only becomes active when there is a patrol unit in the area that has a radio turned on whereas the bridgeport site brodcasts every transmission on post 07 TG so when I'm driving down route seven south of the moundsville bridge I know if there is a cop in the area once I hear a transmission (not that I speed or anything

Ahah, another person besides me that knows the usefulness of scanning conventionally The only difference between you and me is that you can _quickly_ activate the corresponding site's trunking bank - I can't _quickly_ do anything with this scanner, yet !

I haven't taken mine mobile yet but look forward to listening to a lot of Belmont County area stuff next week when I go down there. I'll probably spend the whole day scanning. I'll be in a lousy location for DXing anything, but I'll definitely hear BC911 and StC MARCS - I don't know if I'll hear Bridgeport MARCS from Bannock or not.

Mike

 

[Mylan]

here is what I don't like about the St' C site. the BCI prison near bannock yaps quite excessivly on that site.... when I trunk out that site, I have that TG locked out but I don't conventionally scan it, as it doesn't work out too well, also on the St' C site you may expect to hear post 30 coms which can get fairly busy

as for quickly activating... I use the 796d in id search mode , If I hear something that I need to see the TG I just hit "3" (the BPT bank) and quickly hit "resume" then the CC will ID the TG for me..... I dont ever use ID scan unless some TG like the wheeling city busses or water dept. is being annoying or I dont want to hear a long and drawn out med channel on belmont or wheeling trunks. then after a few minutes I go back to ID search so I don't accidentaly deactivate one of my ID lists by pressing a number key..... also from bannock you may pick up the fairview site if post 30 is not active on ST.C.

from rayland south program 867.5875..... that is the most common voice channel on bridgeport marcs

 

[mtindor]

I'll keep that in mind about BeCI. I'll be right down the road from them about a mile or so. I figured they'd use some other radios internally rather than chatting on MARCS - figured they would only use MARCS when their mobiles were out. That reminds me - I miss seeing our tax dollars being put to good use by the BeCI 'road crews' in their fancy orange uniforms ROFL. Used to see them often when I would travel up I70 towards work.

Ok on Cambridge post and Fairview. I bet the Cambridge post is pretty chatty given the I70/I77 area - I imagine you get some smugglers coming through that way

I haven't gotten the hang of Quick Keys or Group Keys in the 996 yet - although I know I really need to. Would be handy to just be able to turn on/off all my MARCS trunked groups with a few keystrokes instead of switching to each one manually and locking/unlocking them.

I'll be sure and have the Bridgeport freqs active. Last time I listened to that site, most of the traffic was encrypted

Mike

here is what I don't like about the St' C site. the BCI prison near bannock yaps quite excessivly on that site.... when I trunk out that site, I have that TG locked out but I don't conventionally scan it, as it doesn't work out too well, also on the St' C site you may expect to hear post 30 coms which can get fairly busy

as for quickly activating... I use the 796d in id search mode , If I hear something that I need to see the TG I just hit "3" (the BPT bank) and quickly hit "resume" then the CC will ID the TG for me..... I dont ever use ID scan unless some TG like the wheeling city busses or water dept. is being annoying or I dont want to hear a long and drawn out med channel on belmont or wheeling trunks. then after a few minutes I go back to ID search so I don't accidentaly deactivate one of my ID lists by pressing a number key..... also from bannock you may pick up the fairview site if post 30 is not active on ST.C.

from rayland south program 867.5875..... that is the most common voice channel on bridgeport marcs

 

[SLWilson]

Confused...

I guess I'm not quiet sure what you mean when you say you are "scanning MARCS conventionally"....

If you put the site freqs in a "conventional" scanner, all you hear is noise.

But, if you mean that you are putting the control channel of your local MARCS towers in and are just listening to whatever comes through in the OPEN mode, I understand that. That's pretty much what I've been doing with my Pro2096 since I got it.

However, doing it that way, I heard every MARCS transmission that the tower sent out.

What I finally did was set up the local SO27 TG, the OSP Post TG's (regular traffic & their TAC TG's...) our local EMA TG and a few more and now, I don't have to hear everything else that I was hearing in the OPEN mode with just the control channel programmed in....

I have all of the other local conventional freqs in the same bank with the couple of MARCS tower control channels that I can receive. It all works OK (Other than the 2096 ISN'T the greates thing to hear VHF Hi or Lo band on)

 

[mtindor]

What I mean by scanning conventionally is that I put _all_ the frequencies for _all_ the MARCS sites that I want to monitor into a single system programmed conventionally. In the scanner the system is not a trunked system but a regular conventional system.

Basically, I like to monitor multiple MARCS sites but do not like the delay. And the MARCS sites I listen to do not get a lot of traffic - and I _do_ want to hear all the traffic I can and not miss any of it because of delays. So I created a conventional group (just like I would if I wanted to through a bunch of regular VHF-LO, VHF-HI and UHF frequencies in a group) - but the frequencies I tossed in were MARCS frequencies.

I then locked out the control channels since in a conventional system I would keep stopping on a control channel and I'd have to hear the control channel all day.

Being that they are programmed in conventional fashion - I cannot see TGIDs, and I cannot block out traffic based upon their TGID. That's some of what I give up by doing it this way. But that's also why I still have MARCS programmed into a trunked system as well. If I want to limit what I hear or if I want to find new TGIDs, I scan the trunked MARCS system. If I want to hear as much as I possibly can and ensure that I hear the most of each conversation I can when scanning so many MARCS systems, I scan the conventional system that I created.

In your case, you obviously listen to fewer MARCS systems (maybe only one?) and they are so chatty that you want to limit what you hear. That's where we differ. I don't hear enough (scanning 9 MARCS sites) and want to hear more, and full conversations. You are scanning one or two MARCS sites and don't want to hear every TG.

If you scan just one trunked system, you will get 99% of the conversations - but as you add trunked systems, the delay it takes to scan each of those systems adds up and causes you to miss many transmissions on other trunked systems.

- Mike

PS: being that you are using an RS scanner, you may not know exactly how a dynamic memory scanner like a 996/396 (and one or two other unidens I think) work - Hell, I don't pretend to know it all at this point either - It continues to be a learning curve for me. There aren't 'banks' anymore (which saddens me). If I want to program in multiple MARCS sites I either create one trunked system with multiple sites or I create multiple trunked systems. You have either a trunked system or a conventional system on a 996. Trunked systems are what you would think they are - systems where you program in systems that you specifically want to monitor in trunked fashion. Conventional 'systems' are groups of frequencies (channels on a 996) that you are scanning conventionally - which usually would consist of all of your other frequencies that aren't trunked system frequencies.

I guess I'm not quiet sure what you mean when you say you are "scanning MARCS conventionally"....

If you put the site freqs in a "conventional" scanner, all you hear is noise.

But, if you mean that you are putting the control channel of your local MARCS towers in and are just listening to whatever comes through in the OPEN mode, I understand that. That's pretty much what I've been doing with my Pro2096 since I got it.

However, doing it that way, I heard every MARCS transmission that the tower sent out.

What I finally did was set up the local SO27 TG, the OSP Post TG's (regular traffic & their TAC TG's...) our local EMA TG and a few more and now, I don't have to hear everything else that I was hearing in the OPEN mode with just the control channel programmed in....

I have all of the other local conventional freqs in the same bank with the couple of MARCS tower control channels that I can receive. It all works OK (Other than the 2096 ISN'T the greates thing to hear VHF Hi or Lo band on)

 

[jpryor]

The one thing I like about it here in NW Ohio, all I really need to monitor is the MARCS Toledo tower site and I can pick up all the area activity. I do have the local MARCS input frequencies in a conventional system so I can monitor for near scene traffic, gives some perspective as to how close activity may be.

 

[mtindor]

The one thing I like about it here in NW Ohio, all I really need to monitor is the MARCS Toledo tower site and I can pick up all the area activity. I do have the local MARCS input frequencies in a conventional system so I can monitor for near scene traffic, gives some perspective as to how close activity may be.

I envy you. There is almost zero traffic on the 6 highest quality sites I monitor. The next three have periodic traffic, of less concern because they are farther away from my home territory and sometimes have encrypted transmissions. The places that would have a lot of activity are nowhere near me - the two I'm working on being able to reliably receive are down in Bridgeport and St. Clairsville (east Ohio) and have quite a bit more traffic (and of course a bit of it is encrypted).

Mike

 

[SLWilson]

Ok....

What I mean by scanning conventionally is that I put _all_ the frequencies for _all_ the MARCS sites that I want to monitor into a single system programmed conventionally. In the scanner the system is not a trunked system but a regular conventional system. Basically, I like to monitor multiple MARCS sites but do not like the delay.

I think I understand what you are doing. I think that is what I am doing as well, but, just a different way on the 2096!!!!

Where I am, I can regulary hear the Carmel Church (Jackson County) and the Gallipolis (Gallia County) sites. But, instead of programming ALL of the voice channels in, I just put the Control Channel of each of those 2 sites in the scanner.

I also (in the same bank) have the local EMS, sheriff, county garage, county schools etc VHF Hi band freqs. And, the city PD UHF and a local FD low band freq.

I can do all this in one bank. Hear everything going on on MARCS and locally!!!!

Steve/Gallia

 

[K8TEK]

Here's another idea... Don't scan 9 different sites.

 

[SLWilson]

So I Understand....

I can routinely monitor [and _want_ to monitor] 9 MARCS sites and can sometimes monitor another four depending on conditions. I got sick and tired of how long it takes to scan the MARCS system trunked - 1.5-2 seconds per site x 9 sites = 13.5-18 seconds to scan the system just _one_ time. You miss a ton of traffic that way.

So, I decided I'd also set up a conventional system - I call it 'MARCS CONV'. I then set up a group for each site, such as 'MC New Alex' or 'MC Bridgeport'. In each group I add the respective channels (frequencies) for that area. Then I go and lock out the active control channels.

So then, when I feel like missing as little activity as possible _and_ I don't care if I know who is talking other than what site they are talking from. Sure, I can't lock out trunk groups that I don't want to hear, but I can live with that.

One large caveat is that the transmitter for each frequency on a site is keyed up for a second or so - and this happens every x # of seconds (haven't figured out how often). It's an annoyance because while you are scanning you find a lot of quick keyups. But it still scans the numerous MARCS sites a helluva lot faster (probably on the order of 10x faster on average) than scanning it in trunked fashion.

So if I'm not hellbent on picking up new TGs, I'll turn off the MARCS trunked and turn on the MARCS CONV system and then I'll scan my local county's trunked system. I miss _much_less_ traffic this way - at the expense of giving up the ability to (a) see who is talking, (b) lock out annoying TGs - and of course I have to hear the occasional dead air transmissions that occur on each freq.

I just figured I'd post this because I really like having the ability to use both trunked and conventional when the spirit moves me. Sure, anybody can do this, but how many think of doing it? I say that if you can monitor a lot of sites from your home location and you _want_ to monitor them without missing a lot of traffic and are willing to put up with some of the cons of doing so, go for it

Mike

Sorry, but I think I might be a little slow on all of what you said above. Help me out....

Am I understanding that you simply look at a single MARCS tower site, get and programm the freqs from that single site into a single bank on the scaner, add the TG's that you wish to monitor into that bank as well and then just "scan" that bank for what you wish to hear?

Is that what you're doing?

It sounds like something I might like to try if that "IS" what I need to do to set it up....

Thanks,

Steve/KB8FAR

 

[jerk]

Here's another idea... Don't scan 9 different sites.

I agree! Scan less sites.
And limit the the amount of talkgroups you monitor.

When it gets busy, I only monitor two sites. And when really busy of just want to hear local traffic, I turn on those two sites with ID scan enabled only. So State Police, DNR, other Counties fire or ambulance etc, solves the problem.