Parma In The News

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jasonk

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Does anyone have any additional information about this article. Parma claims that they are the first in the State of Ohio to build an Interoperable Radio System. Does anyone know what type of System this is ?

Jason

Parma takes lead in developing areawide emergency communication system
Saturday, February 23, 2008Michael SangiacomoPlain Dealer Reporter

Parma is the first city in Ohio to begin working toward an areawide emergency communication system that would serve police, fire, rescue and other emergency services.

It's called "interoperability," and the idea has been kicking around since the early 1980s when the National Association of Police Chiefs recommended it.

"After 9/11, it became apparent that cities have a hard time communicating with one another during emergencies," Mayor Dean DiPiero said. "We need to make our radio systems able to talk to one another. It just makes sense."


It would cost Parma about $1 million to buy the new radios and set up the backbone of the system, on which other communities could then build. City Council is expected to vote on the system by mid-March.

Under the current system, a department or agency is assigned dedicated radio frequencies, but they cannot use others' frequencies for day-to-day operations. In some cases, agencies may allow another to use their assigned radio channel, but this usually is for temporary emergency communications. There also is a subset of radio channels that can be shared and used by multiple agencies such as the statewide intercity police channels.

In Northeast Ohio, police and fire departments use a diverse set of frequency bands and incompatible systems, according to a 2005 Ohio Department of Public Safety review. Nearly a third of Ohio counties, 28 out of 88, do not have a common frequency band among all law enforcement and safety agencies, the report said.

"You can roam all over the country with your cell phone," said police Sgt. Robert Gerbic. "You should at least be able to do that with emergency radios."

Parma would operate under a set of national interoperability guidelines for police and emergency services, Gerbic said.

There have been times, Gerbic said, when he could see a policeman from a neighboring community standing 30 yards away, but reaching him over the radio was cumbersome and time-consuming.

"I have to call my dispatcher, who calls his dispatcher, and relays the messages back and forth," he said. "What we propose is setting up a way where I can contact him directly."

Gerbic said it would cost $120 million for every police, fire and EMS department in the state to install the system, including new radios and towers.

He looks with envy at the state of Florida.

"Florida is way ahead of us," Gerbic said. "A policeman in Key West can talk directly to his counterpart in Gainesville. Think of the advantages in the event of high-speed chase through different communities or a large-scale disaster."

Gary Holland, director of the Department of Justice Affairs, which oversees county emergency management, said Parma is heading down the right path.

"The technology that Parma is adopting will enhance communication between local, state and federal jurisdictions," he said. "We're all swimming in the same direction."

To reach this Plain Dealer reporter:

msangiacomo@plaind.com, 216-999-4890
 

FPO703

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It's a P-25 system made by MA/Com (I believe). It's in the DB. It might be made by EF Johnson, I'm not certain.

But, as for the 'first in the state' to build an Interoperable radio system, I don't think so, MARCS took home that trophy a long time ago. :)
 

jds911

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I have no idea what their definition of "areawide emergency communications system" is, but they are far from being the first.
 

wa8pyr

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FPO703 said:
It's a P-25 system made by MA/Com (I believe). It's in the DB. It might be made by EF Johnson, I'm not certain.

But, as for the 'first in the state' to build an Interoperable radio system, I don't think so, MARCS took home that trophy a long time ago. :)

Delaware, Franklin and Hamilton counties are way ahead of them too.

In fact, now that I think about it, Franklin County was probably first in the state to have a truly interoperable countywide 800 MHz system. It may be analog, but everybody and his brother and their favorite uncle is on the system, allowing seamless interoperability. Only a few police departments are not part of the system, and most of those are already on 800 MHz and have access to the system. Only three are still on UHF, and one of those is planning on joining up. The other two are studying the issue.

Delaware and Hamilton counties, MARCS and now Parma are relative latecomers to the game. And in the case of Parma, it's great that they're putting in the backbone, but then they have to get the other children (including Cleveland, as if) to play along nicely if they want the interoperability aspect of the thing to really work. Otherwise it's just a shiny new radio system with a handful of happy users.

Better way to handle it... get everybody involved in the planning and implementation of the thing from the get-go, get a term contract from the manufacturer allowing discounts on equipment, and plan on geting everybody on board right away. Even if they can't join up immediately for funding reasons, they're already part of the plan.

Tom
 

jds911

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My thoughts exactly, Tom.

Another one is Miami County. They turned up their countywide EDACS system in 1991 when they opened their countywide communications center. The system continues to serve every police, fire, EMS, municipal services and county service in the county.

Not to take away from Parma's efforts, but to bad the Plain Dealer didn't validate the facts of the story before writing it.
 
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kf8yk

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jasonk said:
Parma takes lead in developing areawide emergency communication system
Saturday, February 23, 2008Michael SangiacomoPlain Dealer Reporter

Parma is the first city in Ohio to begin working toward an areawide emergency communication system that would serve police, fire, rescue and other emergency services.

They must have forgot about us next door in Geauga County running 800 MHz trunking for all public safety since 1987.

- Eric
 

Swipesy

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kf8yk said:
They must have forgot about us next door in Geauga County running 800 MHz trunking for all public safety since 1987.

- Eric

Except South Russell who hangs onto Chagrin Falls, lol

John
 

EngineerZ

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I agree, there's a lot of marketing spin here as many other agencies have built systems to allow interoperability with their neighbors.

What I think they are trying to say is by building out a system with a P25 air interface and (it sounds like) P25 ISSI capabilities, they can support interconnecting their radio system to other agencies that have P25 ISSI to support seamless roaming between radio systems. i.e. I roam off my radio system on to yours and retain the ability to talk on all of my normal talkgroups and to my dispatchers.

But then they confuse the issue by talking about interoperability between agencies which a lot of agencies already do in Ohio... But the technology upgrades they are talking about are only a small piece of the puzzle. The really hard part is doing all of the planning so that the radio system users can talk to the people they need to talk to at the instant they need to talk to them. Even if you have common radio technology, there's still a lot of planning that needs to take place before that officer can talk to the other agency's officer standing 30 yards away...

While MARCS provides interoperabilty across the state, it only does so for folks with Motorola radios. (MARCS is still a Motorola-proprietary system since it uses the 3600 baud control channel...) This is not unlike Florida which is also a proprietary system, so I am confused why Parma touts that as a great example of building interoperable networks on P25 standards. These two networks (along with the county systems wa8pyr metions) are great examples of interoperability; I don't think they make Parma's point. (But perhaps I missed the point then...)

I think their goal was to tout their fully-compliant P25 network, but then they mucked their message up with interoperability issues that have little to do with the technology deployed.

--z

[Edit - for some reason my posting got chopped in half when I posted it; now it should be complete...]
 
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bv154

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EngineerZ said:
While MARCS provides interoperabilty across the state, it only does so for folks with Motorola radios. (MARCS is still a Motorola-proprietary system since it uses the 3600 baud control channel...)

MARCS has been testing E.F. Johnson radios. We've also used a couple EFJ radios on Oxford's 9600 P25 system.
 

16b

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EngineerZ said:
While MARCS provides interoperabilty across the state, it only does so for folks with Motorola radios. (MARCS is still a Motorola-proprietary system since it uses the 3600 baud control channel...)
Thank you!

I suppose it depends on what one's definition of "interoperable" is. If it just means that everyone in the area can talk to each other, then it doesn't matter what kind of protocol the system uses if everyone is on it!

The politicians and bigwigs like to get all exited about their new radio system toys and tell everyone why their $1 million was spent so wisely. The biggest barrier to "interoperability," as others have mentioned, is people not actually working with each other. In Columbus, it's not uncommon for different agencies involved in an incident to have to relay messages to each other between dispatchers because they are on different talkgroups on the same Glorious Interoperable Trunking System.
 

EngineerZ

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bv154 said:
MARCS has been testing E.F. Johnson radios. We've also used a couple EFJ radios on Oxford's 9600 P25 system.
Yup, that's right; I forgot about EFJ. Nonetheless MARCS is still a proprietary system since EFJ still had to get Motorola's blessing and license the 3600 baud control channel technology from them. But you are right, there is a choice of two radio manufacturers there... I believe EFJ is the only licensee of the Smartnet/Smartzone protocol; is that still true?

--z
 
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