Ahmadinejad's 9/11 Rant

[VE5JL]

Originally Posted by rdale

I didn't ask for your interpretation of NTSB's data. I asked for NTSB's determination of the plane height.

According to their animation, the AC was at 180 feet. That's 140 over street poles and about 70 feet over the Pentagon. So even without the altimeter correction (29.92 - 30.22) it was too high.

[zz0468]

Originally Posted by VE5JL

LOL... did you not noticed the "...Poster Revised November 2001" on the next line?

Yes, I saw that. It's pretty flimsy (non-existant, really) evidence of a conspiracy. The poster was issued in 1999. They apparently didn't do a complete rewrite in November 2001, and using that as evidence of a conspiracy only further illustrates my point that your evidence is weak and contrived.

Originally Posted by VE5JL

I don't want you to believe EVERYTHING that is said about 9/11 from either side.

I don't. But there are some things that are simply not in question. The fact that a 757 hit the Pentagon is one of them.

Originally Posted by VE5JL

All I ever wanted anyone to do was take a non emotional look at the evidence.

Fair enough. The evidence shows that a 757 hit the Pentagon. There is no rational reason to believe otherwise.

Originally Posted by VE5JL

The fact that the man central to 9/11 isn't even accused of the act on his wanted poster should send up red flags.

Only if you're grasping at straws and other flimsy evidence. You're looking at a poster that was issued two years prior to the act. So what if a re-issue a month after the fact hasn't been completely updated? Where in the rulebook does it say that it would have to be?

Originally Posted by VE5JL

As a pilot you should ask a lot of questions.

I do. But there is no reason to question what it was that crashed into the Pentagon that day. I'm sorry that you feel differently. It can be difficult watching seemingly intelligent people wasting their time on nonsense. There are plenty of questions unanswered about 9/11. The physics behind the destruction is not among those unanswered questions.

Originally Posted by VE5JL

Here is a great video from radar data that day. DATA supplied by the government that show the flights of that day.

Pilots For 9/11 Truth: 9/11 INTERCEPTED 1/3 - YouTube

I don't consider anything by Pilots for 9/11 Truth to be scientifically credible. Please provide sources from a reputable and recognized scientific study. But since you like youtube sources so much, try this one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVDdjLQkUV8

[VE5JL]

Originally Posted by zz0468

Yes, I saw that.

And chose to ignore it. Hmmm…. The poster speaks for itself.

Originally Posted by zz0468

It's pretty flimsy (non-existant, really) evidence of a conspiracy. The poster was issued in 1999. They apparently didn't do a complete rewrite in November 2001, and using that as evidence of a conspiracy only further illustrates my point that your evidence is weak and contrived.

You entrust the safety of a nation to a group of people so inept, so incompetent that they can’t update a poster that will accurately reflect the gravity of the crimes? Maybe that’s why 19 men with box cutters did what was alleged??

Originally Posted by zz0468

I don't. But there are some things that are simply not in question. The fact that a 757 hit the Pentagon is one of them.

Maybe you’ve accepted the impossible as possible but thousands of people with more letters after their names and hours in the sky than you or I will ever have, haven’t.

Originally Posted by zz0468

Fair enough. The evidence shows that a 757 hit the Pentagon. There is no rational reason to believe otherwise.

The evidence shows something hit the pentagon. If it was without a doubt a 757, why won’t the FBI release any video they confiscated on that day? If they did and I seen a 757 from any one of them I’d believe it too. Just another reason to ask questions.

Originally Posted by zz0468

Only if you're grasping at straws and other flimsy evidence. You're looking at a poster that was issued two years prior to the act. So what if a re-issue a month after the fact hasn't been completely updated? Where in the rulebook does it say that it would have to be?

Here is the reason he isn’t on the poster.

Rex Tomb, then the FBI’s chief of investigative publicity, was asked why not. He replied: "The reason why 9/11 is not mentioned on Usama Bin Laden’s Most Wanted page is because the FBI has no hard evidence connecting Bin Laden to 9/11.

Odd that we were told within hours it was Bin Laden but here we have the FBI saying “..no hard evidence connecting Bin Laden to 9/11” Then who did it?

Originally Posted by zz0468

I do. But there is no reason to question what it was that crashed into the Pentagon that day. I'm sorry that you feel differently. It can be difficult watching seemingly intelligent people wasting their time on nonsense. There are plenty of questions unanswered about 9/11.

There are plenty of reasons that I won’t repeat again but if you chose to accept the government version there is no evidence that will convince you otherwise. I’d certainly fear for the safety of the nation if they cannot even protect the most restricted airspace on the planet. You’re a pilot look at the aeronautical charts for Washington and tell me a hijacked 757 hit its target 1 hour 17 minutes unmolested with Andrews AFB less than 11 miles away? Where are all of the trillions of dollars of defenses you pay for?

Originally Posted by zz0468

The physics behind the destruction is not among those unanswered questions.

You’re right. AE911truth.org provides all of the physics behind the destruction of WTCI II and 7 by qualified engineers and architects. And all of the science, all of the physics DON’T back up the official story.

Originally Posted by zz0468

I don't consider anything by Pilots for 9/11 Truth to be scientifically credible. Please provide sources from a reputable and recognized scientific study.

How about Steven Jones who has a Ph.D in physics, oh wait, he got fired for his paper on 9/11. Think he knows more about physics then we both do. Or how about Kevin R. Ryan who was terminated from his job at Environmental Health Laboratories Inc., a subsidiary of Underwriters Laboratories Inc. because he wrote a letter to the National Institute of Standards and Technology -- the agency probing the collapse -- challenging the common theory that burning jet fuel weakened the steel supports holding up the 110-story skyscrapers??

You see a pattern here? Anyone that wants to keep their job and pension (or their life) will keep their mouth shut.

Originally Posted by zz0468

But since you like youtube sources so much, try this one:

911 Case Study: Pentagon Flight 77 - YouTube

I do and I will. (I think I've already seen that one) I’ve seen or read most of the so-called evidence from both sides and from a pragmatic scientific point of view, the events on that day (that we all seen) have 3 ways to be see. The government’s conspiracy theory, the non- government so-called conspiracy theory and then the truth.

What I like about AE911Truth.org is they don’t speculate on the ‘who’ or the ‘why’ the look at the events of that day using the scientific method to prove or disprove a hypotheses using empirical and measurable evidence, no emotion, no hyperbole.

[zz0468]

Originally Posted by VE5JL

And chose to ignore it. Hmmm…. The poster speaks for itself.

The poster was issued 2 years before the fact. That it wasn't updated only a month after the fact is completely and utterly insignificant.

Originally Posted by VE5JL

You entrust the safety of a nation to a group of people so inept, so incompetent that they can’t update a poster that will accurately reflect the gravity of the crimes? Maybe that’s why 19 men with box cutters did what was alleged??

Entrust our safety? Where ever did you get that idea? Nowhere here have I attempted to assert the idea that I think the government's handling of the whole thing was flawless. I just think that attributing it to some dark and nefarious conspiracy is far removed from the truth. Oh, a conspiracy took place, without a doubt. But it wasn't an inside job. I prefer to apply Hanlon's Razor to the matter.

Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.

Originally Posted by VE5JL

Maybe you’ve accepted the impossible as possible but thousands of people with more letters after their names and hours in the sky than you or I will ever have, haven’t.

Since you have no idea as to my educational level, or hours in the air, we can set this comment aside as irrelevant. I have never stated here what my level of education is, any titles or certifications I hold, and least of all my flying experience. And I never will.

But I will say this: I know and have known, a substantial number of pilots... commercial, military, and private, from 100 hour VFR pilots, to commercial pilots with 30,000+ hours. I have a number of immediate family members in the aviation industry. I assure you, they're all quite human and quite as capable of latching on to stupid ideas based on emotion and less on science as any other segment of the population. So, the fact that a small minority of airline pilots endorses these inane ideas does not impress me in the least.

Originally Posted by VE5JL

The evidence shows something hit the pentagon. If it was without a doubt a 757, why won’t the FBI release any video they confiscated on that day?

What makes you think that there's footage to be released? You sound very much like the Republican right, insisting that Obama is lying because he won't release his college thesis, when the reality is, there was never a thesis to be released in the first place.

Originally Posted by VE5JL

If they did and I seen a 757 from any one of them I’d believe it too. Just another reason to ask questions.

Tell me... why do you refuse to acknowledge the photos of airplane wreckage at the Pentagon, shards of aluminum painted in the colors of American Airlines?

Originally Posted by VE5JL

...there is no evidence that will convince you otherwise. I’d certainly fear for the safety of the nation if they cannot even protect the most restricted airspace on the planet.

Remember Hanlon's Razor?

Originally Posted by VE5JL

You’re a pilot look at the aeronautical charts for Washington and tell me a hijacked 757 hit its target 1 hour 17 minutes unmolested with Andrews AFB less than 11 miles away? Where are all of the trillions of dollars of defenses you pay for?

And what, exactly, was the government supposed to do during that hour and 17 minutes? Shoot it down? There had been no precedent for any such incident, and there was a great deal of confusion as to what exactly was happening. At that time, the military was not equipped to make the decision to shoot down a domestic airliner over a crowded metropolitan area. To think that is a conspiracy is ludicrous.

Originally Posted by VE5JL

You’re right. AE911truth.org provides all of the physics behind the destruction of WTCI II and 7 by qualified engineers and architects. And all of the science, all of the physics DON’T back up the official story.

Bad science. All of it.

All right... I'm done with this.

This is an argument more of religion than of scientific facts. You clearly believe this because you WANT to believe it, and there's nothing anyone could say that will dissuade you from your desire. If an absolute truth was to confront you, you would still want to believe in this nonsense, and would find ways to object. This is a question of your faith vs. fact.

And there is nothing you can say or show me here that will cause my opinion to waiver in the slightest little bit. I am not of the opinion that our government is perfect. Far from it. But I am of the opinion that it was airplanes that brought down the WTC, and punched a hole in the Pentagon. Airplanes, and nothing else. And I'm done discussing your faith.

[VE5JL]

Originally Posted by zz0468

The poster was issued 2 years before the fact. That it wasn't updated only a month after the fact is completely and utterly insignificant.

The fact that you deleted a quote from Rex Tomb of the FBI as to why his name isn’t on the poster is telling. This isn’t a small omission on a Garage Sale poster AND they had YEARS to correct it if what you say is correct.

Rex Tomb, then the FBI’s chief of investigative publicity, was asked why not. He replied: "The reason why 9/11 is not mentioned on Usama Bin Laden’s Most Wanted page is because the FBI has no hard evidence connecting Bin Laden to 9/11.

Originally Posted by zz0468

Entrust our safety? Where ever did you get that idea?

Ya.. where would I get the idea that the FBI, NSA, CIA, etc had anything to do with the safety of America? What is their role to protect the local 7-11?

Originally Posted by zz0468

Nowhere here have I attempted to assert the idea that I think the government's handling of the whole thing was flawless.

You believe the 9/11 was a well funded and coordinated attack that took everyone by surprise. If that is the case for the sake of argument why did George Bush and Condoleezza Rice, then national security adviser openly lie that there was no indication that anyone would fly airplanes into buildings? They should have known there were many Security Briefings war games and simulations that were going on before and on 9/11? In fact it was very confusing to ATC when they asked several times if this is simulated or real life.

Look up Vigilant Guardian or Able Danger and you will see what I mean. (I’m sure you won’t but if someone else reading this will.)

Speaking of W… How to explain the fact that he LIED about the events on 9/11? He said in this video he seen the first plane go into the building. This is IMPOSSIBLE as the Naudet brothers video wasn’t released until later.

Bush Caught Lying About September 11th - YouTube

Originally Posted by zz0468

Since you have no idea as to my educational level, or hours in the air, we can set this comment aside as irrelevant. I have never stated here what my level of education is, any titles or certifications I hold, and least of all my flying experience. And I never will.

That’s fine, I’m not ashamed of my education or the fact that I have a PPL, a love for science and aviation.

Originally Posted by zz0468

But I will say this: I know and have known, a substantial number of pilots... commercial, military, and private, from 100 hour VFR pilots, to commercial pilots with 30,000+ hours. I have a number of immediate family members in the aviation industry. I assure you, they're all quite human and quite as capable of latching on to stupid ideas based on emotion and less on science as any other segment of the population. So, the fact that a small minority of airline pilots endorses these inane ideas does not impress me in the least.

It should all be based on science. All of the rest and ‘who you know’ is irrelevant. Remember, there was a time when you could have put the most seasoned sailors together in a room and the consensus would have been they can’t sail in that direction because if they did they’d fall off the earth that they all thought was flat.

Originally Posted by zz0468

What makes you think that there's footage to be released?

The most protected airspace on the planet and the only video they have is one 4 FPM parking lot camera? LOL.. here is a good example of Hanlon's Razor for ya.

"...Velasquez says the gas station's security cameras are close enough to the Pentagon to have recorded the moment of impact. "I've never seen what the pictures looked like," he said. "The FBI was here within minutes and took the film."

Three Months On, Tension Lingers Near the Pentagon

That’s from National Geographic someone I assume you’d trust.

Originally Posted by zz0468

You sound very much like the Republican right, insisting that Obama is lying because he won't release his college thesis, when the reality is, there was never a thesis to be released in the first place.

Deflection is another admission of defeat in debate. I’m only going to comment on this simply to explain the ‘Straw Man’ you’ve induced. The debate isn’t for Obama to “release his college thesis,” the debate is for Obama to release his college transcripts. Those are two very different things. To date, Obama has refused to and paid a lot of money to keep those transcripts secret. I won’t comment on his possible motives why he won’t release them I’ll leave that between him, the American people and Donald Trump.

Originally Posted by zz0468

Tell me... why do you refuse to acknowledge the photos of airplane wreckage at the Pentagon, shards of aluminum painted in the colors of American Airlines? Remember Hanlon's Razor?

I don’t, I just don’t accept that the damage on site was that of a 757 flown by a man who couldn’t fly a Cessna. Yes there are photos of metal with paint on them. Were they ever identified by serial number as parts from Flight 77?

Originally Posted by zz0468

And what, exactly, was the government supposed to do during that hour and 17 minutes? Shoot it down? There had been no precedent for any such incident, and there was a great deal of confusion as to what exactly was happening. At that time, the military was not equipped to make the decision to shoot down a domestic airliner over a crowded metropolitan area. To think that is a conspiracy is ludicrous.

Look up Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Instruction 3610.01A issued June 1, 2001 on “Aircraft Piracy (Hijacking) and Destruction of Derelict Airborne Objects and you may see another abnormally to the ‘official story’

Originally Posted by zz0468

Bad science. All of it.

That’s easy to say but hard to disprove. The laws of physics are immutable. The conservation of momentum, Newton’s laws etc are explained by qualified people with Ph.D’s masters etc.

Originally Posted by zz0468

All right... I'm done with this.

This is an argument more of religion than of scientific facts. You clearly believe this because you WANT to believe it, and there's nothing anyone could say that will dissuade you from your desire. If an absolute truth was to confront you, you would still want to believe in this nonsense, and would find ways to object. This is a question of your faith vs. fact.

And there is nothing you can say or show me here that will cause my opinion to waiver in the slightest little bit. I am not of the opinion that our government is perfect. Far from it. But I am of the opinion that it was airplanes that brought down the WTC, and punched a hole in the Pentagon. Airplanes, and nothing else. And I'm done discussing your faith.

This has nothing to do with religion or faith, it’s all science. Accept that or not I don’t care. Speaking of, most people don’t want to accept the scientific evidence because of what is called cognitive dissonance. We all have a world view and when our world view is challenged we get defensive. We get defensive because it is far easier to ‘go along to get a long’ than it is to ask the tough questions or to accept that the government may have been involved in the death of over 3,000 people. Once you’ve realize something is wrong with the official story, you’ve taken on the responsibility of bringing the perpetrators to justice. Most people don’t want that responsibility so it is easier to ignore science, and call anyone who asks questions names.

It’s been fun, thanks for being somewhat civil. Life goes on and the truth will always be the truth, the difference is how we want to perceive it.

[N1RGR]

Originally Posted by VE5JL

It’s been fun, thanks for being somewhat civil. Life goes on and the truth will always be the truth, the difference is how we want to perceive it.

Truth is the government failed to protect us! Nothing more nothing less! To think this was all some grand government ordered massacre is absolutely absurd!

[Michael-SATX]

To Mike4164, you know I'm truly sorry that you thought that you had to get all over emotional about this topic!
I have never said or implied that I was there ! Yes, there was molten steal flowing like lava at ground zero.
The gound zero burned until Dec 19, 2001. A NASA IR satelite took readings 5 days later of grouns zero
that read 1535 F. No sir, jet fuel does NOT burn at 3,000 F. Remember the black smoke pouring out of the
WTC 1 & 2 was due to oxygen starvation. Please explain your fellow FDNY members giving interviews
about hearing bombs going off in succession as in a controlled demolition ? While your at it why at the
10th anniversary were the FDNY not part of the memorial sevice and invited to speak at the podium ?
I think that it was very disrespectfull to leave out the FDNY who lost approx 357-ish members that day !
Also curious, that day one of the Naudet brothers was filming as the FDNY were entering the WTC lobby and
you could see the glass doors and glass walls shattered from blast waves in addiion to the marble panels
blown off the walls from a massive explossion. A plane crash to the tops of the buildings would not have
caused that kind of bizzare damage well before either tower collapsed. Early on, the FDNY radio traffic
indicated that they could knock down a few office fires and next thing the WTC1-N came down in 46 minutes.
I'm still baffled how the Govt can tell me that Flight 11 tail number N334AA was the jet that hit the WTC1-North
and yet there is a static display in Wash DC's National Air & Space museum of a DC-7 with that same tail
number ? The DC-7 I am speaking of was in service from 1956 to 1962 and retired early due to arrival of the
jet age. On May 11 of this year I personally walked through the partial 30ft nose to front section of that DC-7.
It is my understanding that tail number are never reused. So what should I think about this issue ? An FAA
guy I spoke with said that tail numbers are never reused and he said that data from the 911 event was taken
away in a cover up. Pile on that 6 of the10 9/11 commission members called 9/11 a criminal cover up !
I'm also perplexed as to why the FBI has locked up all the NTSB reports and the are not open to the public.
Bottom Line: A people's government with nothing to hide does NOT act in the manners they have period !
I mean lQQk at this Benghazi attack debackle. I guess our officials just can't be bothered to tell us what
really happened. Why in the world for a minute would they want to interrupt and risk their perks and salaries?
Mike, sir I am truly sorry for all that you have suffered and you and the world deserve no less that the truth !
This thread serves as a platform to exchange thoughts and ideas and that is what I am hear to explore.
Now you have shared much and that is exactly what I am interested in learning about. Insults don't do do that.
Finally, of course nano-thermite is not in the NY construction codes, it is an incindiary material that was used
to bring down the WTC's for many agendas some of which were to justify invading other countries, bolstering
the military industrial complex ( think of President Eisenhower farewell address in 1/17/1961 ), to help usher in
many new forms of control over citizens (ie the Patriot Act, Homeland Security, Gun laws to name a few) and
finally to implode our economy by design so as to crush our great country to then bring about one world government
( ie Bush senior saying "It's a bold new idea" this One World Government scheme of the powerfull elite. )

N1RGR, I have been meaning to get back to you for weeks now on the Turner Construction Company
that is said to have planted the nano thermite throughout the elevator shafts of the WTC's. NY Port Authority
records had the Turner Construction Co on the 38th floor of WTC1-N and a crew of 12 men working in another
office in the 3rd sub basement level of the same tower. How about unpresidented power downs in the WTC's
even most of the weekend just before 9/11. Let's not forget that building security for the WTC's contracted to
Securacom/Stratasec Inc. locally headed by George Bush's little brother Marvin Bush and the CEO of this
company was Wirt Walker III the Bush's cousin - hmm. That is just way to bizarre to all tied together about 9/11.
Oddly, Turner Construction got the WTC haul away contract and is building the new Freedom Tower at GZ too.

Believe me Rdale, with less than 5% of Americans awake, I have real doubts to ever have the truth about 9/11
and many many other issues ever brought to light. It's a lost cause. If the next false flag attack on US soil
is botched up enough then just maybe our lame-stream media will actually put down their "talking points" memos
and really go after the story relentlessly like they used to do way back in the old days to uncover the real truth!
Even Donald Rumsfeld said on 9/11 that a missle hit the pentagon - aw heck what would he know right ?
A few years later during a surprise Christmas Eve visit to the troops in Iraq, in speaking about the events
of 9/11, he even refered to the "plane shot down over Pennsylvania". Also, let us ignore that the passenger counts
released by the Airline companies (ie FOIA requested records) don't match the "official story" counts either.
So to be fair, you spring for the Grey Poupon as it's much cheaper compared to all the tin foil hats we are gonna need
to make after checking out this list here >>> Patriots Question 9/11 - Responsible Criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report (scroll down this !!!)

[VE5JL]

Originally Posted by N1RGR

Truth is the government failed to protect us! Nothing more nothing less! To think this was all some grand government ordered massacre is absolutely absurd!

If you want to talk 'absurd' watch this video. It is the offical story that is 'absurd'

9/11: A Conspiracy Theory - YouTube

But lets say it is true... ALL of IT!!! Ask yourself this question.... Why was nobody fired or put in jail for failing to protect Americans? Why wasn't W impeached?

In fact, 2 men at the center of protecting America received promotions.

General Richard Myers was acting head of the Joint Chiefs of Staff on 9/11/01. was promoted to Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff.

General Ralph Eberhart was in charge of NORAD on 9/11/01. was promoted to head the new "Northern Command" established in October of 2002.

Hmmm......

[zz0468]

Originally Posted by VE5JL

...Why was nobody fired or put in jail for failing to protect Americans? Why wasn't W impeached?

Because mistakes,failures, and oversights aren't criminal acts.

[VE5JL]

Originally Posted by zz0468

Because mistakes,failures, and oversights aren't criminal acts.

Sorry, people get fired all the time for very simple things never mind because of the death of 3,000 + people. How little you know about law.

You should do some research.

PENAL CODE

TITLE 5. OFFENSES AGAINST THE PERSON

CHAPTER 19. CRIMINAL HOMICIDE

Sec. 19.01. TYPES OF CRIMINAL HOMICIDE. (a) A person commits criminal homicide if he intentionally, knowingly, recklessly, or with criminal negligence causes the death of an individual.

(b) Criminal homicide is murder, capital murder, manslaughter, or criminally negligent homicide.

Sec. 19.05. CRIMINALLY NEGLIGENT HOMICIDE. (a) A person commits an offense if he causes the death of an individual by criminal negligence.

(b) An offense under this section is a state jail felony.

(emphasis mine) Look up Criminal Negligence here.

Criminal Negligence Law & Legal Definition

If we believe the story as told, Bush, et all, are criminal negligence of the death of over 3,000 people on that day, and the countless thousands since they started their war on terror.

They KNEW an attack was coming and they did nothing. (LIHOP)
Or they and their black opps pulled it off (MIHOP) But for the sake of argument let's stick with the official story.

They planned for this in advance and they were doing a simulation on 9/11 where hijacked airplanes were flown into buildings. Being that they had security briefings saying the attack was coming.

IGNORED WARNINGS: THE CIA BRIEFS ABOUT AL QAEDA ATTACK

May 1, 2001 CIA told White House that 'a group presently in the United States' was planning a terrorist operation 'with explosives'

June 22, 2001 CIA brief reported that Al Qaeda attacks could be 'imminent'

June 29, 2001 Warning that the government needed to take briefs seriously. Added evidence included Bin Laden aides warning of an attack and operatives claiming it would have 'dramatic consequences'

July 1, 2001 Brief said the operation had been delayed but 'will occur soon'

July 9, 2001 Extremist in Chechnya linked to Al Qaeda told followers there would soon be big news - and within 48 hours the information was passed to the White House

July 24, 2001 Bush told the attack was still under preparation but that it had been postponed

August 6, 2001 Bush received review of threats posed by Al Qaeda with headline: 'Bin Laden Determined to Strike in U.S.'

From

Read more: 9/11 anniversary: Series of 2001 briefings warned of attack by Bin Laden | Mail Online

So, as you can see they knew this was going to happen and they neglected to protect US citizens and soil.

After the attacks both Bush and Condalisa Rice LIED to the American people that they had NO knowledge that this was gong to happen and were taken totally by surprise.

Bush lied about seeing the first plane, and Condalisa Rice let the cat out of the bag when she said on September the 4th, Bush signed orders to confront Afghanistan. (4:00) He was tired of swatting at flies.

That was BEFORE 9/11 they decided to take on al-Qaeda but waited becuase the American people had no appetite for war. On 9/12 they did.
Condoleezza Rice tells the 9/11 commission Bush ordered invasion of Afghanistan A WEEK BEFORE 9/11 - YouTube

Add this to the famous PNAC document and quote.

Section V of Rebuilding America's Defenses, entitled "Creating Tomorrow's Dominant Force",

"Further, the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event––like a new Pearl Harbor"

Get the document here and read it for yourself.

9/11 was that event that permitting the illegal invasion of 2 sovereign nations, the implementation of the Patriot Act, Home Land Security and people being sexually assaulted at airports.

So they let it happen to further their long term goals at the cost of 3,000 + lives. And nobody gets fired?????

If that isn't a criminal act, I guess nothing is.

[zz0468]

Originally Posted by VE5JL

Sorry, people get fired all the time for very simple things never mind because of the death of 3,000 + people.

The people you blame aren't guilty of crimes, which explains why there was no impeachment, and why they weren't jailed.

Originally Posted by VE5JL

How little you know about law.

I never claimed to be a lawyer.

Originally Posted by VE5JL

You should do some research.

I did. I discovered that your incessant participation in this thread is a shameless plug for your book.

[N1RGR]

Originally Posted by Michael-SATX

N1RGR, I have been meaning to get back to you for weeks now on the Turner Construction Company
that is said to have planted the nano thermite throughout the elevator shafts of the WTC's.

No problem. Present your evidence.

Originally Posted by Michael-SATX

NY Port Authority records had the Turner Construction Co on the 38th floor of WTC1-N and a crew of 12 men working in anotheroffice in the 3rd sub basement level of the same tower.

So the Turner Co was working in the building? What does this have to do with 9/11?

Originally Posted by Michael-SATX

How about unpresidented power downs in the WTC's even most of the weekend just before 9/11. Let's not forget that building security for the WTC's contracted to Securacom/Stratasec Inc. locally headed by George Bush's little brother Marvin Bush and the CEO of this company was Wirt Walker III the Bush's cousin - hmm. That is just way to bizarre to all tied together about 9/11.Oddly, Turner Construction got the WTC haul away contract and is building the new Freedom Tower at GZ too.

Are you kidding? That's all you have after a two week delay in answering my questions? So because the Turner Co was doing work in the building which they should have been because they were contracted to do so and because Bush's little brother was CEO of the security co proves that the Turner Co planted nano thermite material in the buildings elevator shafts? Where is the proof? You failed to answer any of my questions from that previous post. Go back and read my post and take another two weeks if you have to but please stop with the baseless accusations.

[VE5JL]

Originally Posted by zz0468

The people you blame aren't guilty of crimes, which explains why there was no impeachment, and why they weren't jailed.

I never claimed to be a lawyer.

I did. I discovered that your incessant participation in this thread is a shameless plug for your book.

LOL!!!!!!!!!!

First you say they aren't guilty of crimes then you say you never claimed to be a lawyer. Just because they've never been charged, tried and convicted doesn't mean crimes were not committed. IF there was a real justice system that wasn't so corrupt there would have been criminal charges for criminal negligence causing death. Why do you think they were so keen to settle out of court with the families IF they dropped any further action?

Oh speaking of baseless, my book is about an attack in the future and not any rehashing of conspiracies government or otherwise. So much for your 'discovery.'

[VE5JL]

Originally Posted by N1RGR

No problem. Present your evidence.

So the Turner Co was working in the building? What does this have to do with 9/11?

Are you kidding? That's all you have after a two week delay in answering my questions? So because the Turner Co was doing work in the building which they should have been because they were contracted to do so and because Bush's little brother was CEO of the security co proves that the Turner Co planted nano thermite material in the buildings elevator shafts? Where is the proof? You failed to answer any of my questions from that previous post. Go back and read my post and take another two weeks if you have to but please stop with the baseless accusations.

This is the point of all of the groups calling for a real investigation, to find out the 'who' the 'what' and the 'why'. I like ae911truth.org because they don't speculate on the 'who' the 'what' and the 'why' they just present the evidence collected that day and try to make what we all witnessed fit with the scientific method.

We all observed what happened on that day from the video feeds. In the example of the twin towers and building 7 we seen with our own eyes that 2 buildings were hit with airplanes and building 7 was not. We also observed all 3 building fall. (The fact that the BBC was reporting that building 7 fell 20 minutes is an interesting point to consider.) But lets leave all of that and focus on the scientific method.

The Observation is the buildings fell. The government / A car magazine's hypothesis is because of the damage and fires to the buildings they collapse. If this hypothesis is true you can make predictions. None of them include the laws of physics being tossed nor building 7 that NIST itself admits if the first building in history to fall because of office fires alone.

Also when you use physics calculations about the TT it can be determined that the hypothesis / predictions / and models (test) are incorrect so you must go back to a new hypothesis.

The fact is the buildings at or near free fall speed and the only way to do that is with explosives.

If you have an open mind, watch this video, and see why people want a real investigation.

[zz0468]

Originally Posted by VE5JL

First you say they aren't guilty of crimes then you say you never claimed to be a lawyer.

No one but the lunatic fringe thinks 9/11 was an inside job. It doesn't take a lawyer to share that opinion.

Originally Posted by VE5JL

Oh speaking of baseless, my book is about an attack in the future and not any rehashing of conspiracies government or otherwise. So much for your 'discovery.'

It's a shameless plug.

[VE5JL]

Originally Posted by zz0468

No one but the lunatic fringe thinks 9/11 was an inside job. It doesn't take a lawyer to share that opinion.

It's a shameless plug.

All of the name calling and deflection won't change the fact that the laws of physics didn't change on that day.

[zz0468]

Originally Posted by VE5JL

...the laws of physics didn't change on that day.

No laws of physics need to be broken to satisfy the official explanations of what happened.

[elk2370bruce]

Conspiratory theorists base their beliefs on conjecture and numerous false assumptions. Many believe that all that you see on the internet is true and refereed data/fact sets. Next, we'll be reopening the moon landing conspiracy. Guys - get a life! You cannot prove your conspiracy hypothesis objectively.

[Michael-SATX]

Hey Bruce, I have a life thank you. I sure don't see you debunkers proving much ... Why not ?
With less than 5% of Americans awake, I have real doubts to ever have the truth about 9/11
and many many other issues ever brought to light. It's a lost cause. If the next false flag attack
on US soil is botched up enough then just maybe our lame-stream media will actually put down
their "talking points" memos and really go after the story relentlessly like they used to do
way back in the old days to uncover the real truth!

Even Donald Rumsfeld said on 9/11 that a missle hit the pentagon - aw heck what would he know right ?
A few years later during a surprise Christmas Eve visit to the troops in Iraq, in speaking about the events
of 9/11, he even refered to the "plane shot down over Pennsylvania". Also, let us ignore that the passenger counts
released by the Airline companies (ie FOIA requested records) don't match the "official story" counts either.
So to be fair, you spring for the Grey Poupon as it's much cheaper compared to all the tin foil hats we are gonna need
to make after checking out this list here >>>
Patriots Question 9/11 - Responsible Criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report ( plz explain this guys )

Problem: A people's government with nothing to hide does NOT act in the manners that they have PERIOD !!! Truth was NOT served !!!

Answer: Do a new and real thorough and independant invesigation and punish the guilty, the one's that lied to the American people
and covered up the facts. Let's not make the mistake again by apointing lawyers and politicians to the new 911 commision !!!
Heck 2 members resigned do to not being able to gain access.Also 6 of the 10 called it "a criminal cover up". Explain that guys?

Solution: Through the Bumms Out, no more rQQsting in office 30~40 years which breeds corruption ~ TERM LIMITS PLEASE ~ ASAP !!!

[rdale]

The neat thing is - conspiracy theorists just keep on posting the same old un- and/or dis-proven stuff, thinking that will change the truth. Sort of like when you play Pictionary and just YELL THE SAME ANSWER LOUDER AND LOUDER as if that changes the outcome

Oh - and you usually throw in some number for percentage of Americans who are too stupid / asleep / disinterested to know the truth. That helps.