Project25_MASTR
Millennial Graying OBT Guy
I've already heard some difficulties coming from some Motorola shops…anyone done any installs or looking at doing installs?
-
To anyone looking to acquire commercial radio programming software:
Please do not make requests for copies of radio programming software which is sold (or was sold) by the manufacturer for any monetary value. All requests will be deleted and a forum infraction issued. Making a request such as this is attempting to engage in software piracy and this forum cannot be involved or associated with this activity. The same goes for any private transaction via Private Message. Even if you attempt to engage in this activity in PM's we will still enforce the forum rules. Your PM's are not private and the administration has the right to read them if there's a hint to criminal activity.
If you are having trouble legally obtaining software please state so. We do not want any hurt feelings when your vague post is mistaken for a free request. It is YOUR responsibility to properly word your request.
To obtain Motorola software see the Sticky in the Motorola forum.
The various other vendors often permit their dealers to sell the software online (i.e., Kenwood). Please use Google or some other search engine to find a dealer that sells the software. Typically each series or individual radio requires its own software package. Often the Kenwood software is less than $100 so don't be a cheapskate; just purchase it.
For M/A Com/Harris/GE, etc: there are two software packages that program all current and past radios. One package is for conventional programming and the other for trunked programming. The trunked package is in upwards of $2,500. The conventional package is more reasonable though is still several hundred dollars. The benefit is you do not need multiple versions for each radio (unlike Motorola).
This is a large and very visible forum. We cannot jeopardize the ability to provide the RadioReference services by allowing this activity to occur. Please respect this.
2015 F150 Install Discussion
- Thread starter Project25_MASTR
- Start date
- Status
w2xq
Mentor
Has the aluminum Ford F-150 been delivered to dealers? Last week I saw a Bloomberg interview with Bill Ford, and I thought the video suggested the production line had just rolled off job #1. The F-150 is Ford's largest model seller; waiting for a bump in the next quarter's results.
Project25_MASTR
Millennial Graying OBT Guy
I know fleet orders are beginning to be delivered but I don't look for the new trucks at the dealership as there is nothing I need with a Ford emblem on it.
As in?? what have you heard?
Project25_MASTR
Millennial Graying OBT Guy
Ground plane issues as well as worries about the roof's not being able to handle the stress of the NMO mount.
From what I've heard, shops are saying that the problems they are running into can be remedied with thick-metal NMO mounts and ground plane kits (to not only support the roof but to remedy ground plane problems).
According to a friend at our local Ford dealer, the dealers will start receiving them for retail sale the first week of December. He said that his dealership has already sold their first three F-150s sight unseen.
Question:
If the NMO mounts are made of steel, won't they have to be redesigned using alumimum? Mounting steel directly to aluminum will cause the aluminum to corrode, and Ford would probably not honor any aluminum corrosion warranty claims due to the installation of the NMO mount.
Why would there be ground plane issues? Aluminum is more electrically conductive than steel. More on this later.
Given that Ford is using 6000-series aluminum for most of the body, some of the body parts are heat treated, and other body parts are actually using thicker aluminum than if they were steel (and they are still saving 700 lbs compared to a 2014 F-150) I'm not sure "stress" is an issue. The body isn't made out of the same aluminum that's used for soda and beer cans. According to Ford's engineers, the aluminum parts have better dent and ding resistance than equivalent steel parts.
All of the aluminum used for body panels in the new F-150 is electro-coated to reduce the possibility of galvanic corrosion. Maybe this electro-coating is causing the NMO mounts to not make good electrical contact with the aluminum body panels.
BTW, GM is rumored to be looking at switching to aluminum for the Silverado pick-ups starting in 2018.
mmckenna
I ♥ Ø
It would be interesting to know more about this.
Ford likely has an up-fitter guide that would cover this sort of stuff, they usually do. Considering hundreds of thousands of F-150's are in use by public works, public safety, utilities and service companies, there are going to be a -lot- of trucks with antennas installed on them, and I'm sure this has been well thought out.
Ford likely has an up-fitter guide that would cover this sort of stuff, they usually do. Considering hundreds of thousands of F-150's are in use by public works, public safety, utilities and service companies, there are going to be a -lot- of trucks with antennas installed on them, and I'm sure this has been well thought out.
12dbsinad
Member
- Joined
- Mar 15, 2010
- Messages
- 1,953
If my memory serves me correct, the previous model F150 had a narrow "rib" centerline with the roof which one could not install a NMO center of roof. I'm not sure Ford really thinks about radio antenna's. Kind of like the new Ford Utility SUV's, no real direct route out thru the firewall.
mmckenna
I ♥ Ø
Right, they do have the rib down the middle, however I've got a 2011 F150 with two NMO's mounted down the center. The rib is hollow, and wide enough that the NMO's will fit, there is even a hole in the back to route the coax out of. I did a write up over on Batlabs on exactly how to do it: http://batboard.batlabs.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=97979
I'd like to hear what the real issue is with the installs. Aluminum bodies are probably going to be more and more popular, so finding a solution to any issues will be something that most of us will have to do.
I'd like to hear what the real issue is with the installs. Aluminum bodies are probably going to be more and more popular, so finding a solution to any issues will be something that most of us will have to do.
Last edited:
12dbsinad
Member
- Joined
- Mar 15, 2010
- Messages
- 1,953
Let me clarify, I'm talking about the center "gutter" visible while looking at the roof. Not on the underside. More of a problem on regular cab pickups. I believe unless you want to drill off center, the only option is far forward, or all the way to the back near the third brake light.
I agree that the "gutter" is probably continuous from front to back on regular cabs. On the SCrews, and maybe the SCabs, that "gutter" is not continuous. There are breaks in it sufficient to install an NMO as mmckenna indicates. Anyway, given the metal forming stresses in that area, it's probably strong enough to deal with whatever an NMO mount might inflict.
I agree that Ford has probably given this issue some thought. If it were me, rather than just assume that the aluminum can't take the stress, I'd be in touch with Ford regional customer service and I'd ask for input from their fleet sales folks.
Attached is a Ford Special Vehicle Engineering that talks about attaching steel accessories to the aluminum bodies on 2015 F-150s. Yes, galvanic corrosion is a concern, but they tell you how to address it. BTW, the NMO mounts that I use are either brass or stainless steel. I don't know how the brass would react with aluminum, but I try to stick with the stainless steel ones anyway.
Also, here is a link to the Ford Body Builder Layout Book. It's usually a pretty good reference for anyone up-fitting a Ford vehicle. Unfortunately, the section on the 2015 F-150 isn't available yet.
Thanks! Got a new F250 coming in this week and that will come in handy.
Project25_MASTR
Millennial Graying OBT Guy
So I found the original post regarding aluminum. While I don't agree with the statement that the aluminum is more brittle than steel. The ground plane issue is a result of the corrosion issue you see in the post.
It would appear some moisture and a combo of brass and aluminum can cause some ground plane problems.
It would appear some moisture and a combo of brass and aluminum can cause some ground plane problems.
gfdfortynine
Member
Production I'm told is about 500 units a day and that is gonna ramp up to 2000. The Silverado rumours are true and yes aluminium is definitely gonna be in a lot more vehicles. People probably don't realize how much it has already been used for years.
The trunk lids on 95-97 Crown vic's were aluminum we used a 3/8 hole NMO mount and never had any issues...VHF UHF or 800..
One of the issues with aluminum, in general, is that it work hardens. In other words, the more times it is bent back and forth, the harder it gets. Work hardening is more of a problem with aluminum than with steel. Since a mobile antenna whip tends to flutter as you drive down the highway, that will cause some cyclic stresses on the mount. Those cyclic stresses may contribute to fatigue of the surrounding metal over time.
The other side of that coin is that aircraft manufacturers have been building airplanes using aluminum skins and aluminum structural pieces for decades. Aluminum airplanes don't regularly fall out of the sky due to structural fatigue. The aluminum industry knows how to deal with the work hardening problem. That's why we have these advanced aluminum alloys.
However, the 2015 F-150 hasn't been on the road all that long. I'm skeptical that any of them have been in service long enough to develop much work hardening in the area of an NMO mount on the roof. In other words, I think someone is raising a possibly premature red flag. In fact, the quoted passage seems to reveal this where the writer says "a previous occasional problem is probably going to become more frequent". In other words, the writer is referring to past problems with other aluminum-skinned vehicles, not with the 2015 F-150. It would be interesting to learn the thickness and grade of the aluminum used in these other aluminum-skinned vehicles compared to the roof of a 2015 F-150.
BTW, has anybody dropped by the BatLabs forums to see if anyone over there has any experience with this? A number of experienced installers hang out there.
The other side of that coin is that aircraft manufacturers have been building airplanes using aluminum skins and aluminum structural pieces for decades. Aluminum airplanes don't regularly fall out of the sky due to structural fatigue. The aluminum industry knows how to deal with the work hardening problem. That's why we have these advanced aluminum alloys.
However, the 2015 F-150 hasn't been on the road all that long. I'm skeptical that any of them have been in service long enough to develop much work hardening in the area of an NMO mount on the roof. In other words, I think someone is raising a possibly premature red flag. In fact, the quoted passage seems to reveal this where the writer says "a previous occasional problem is probably going to become more frequent". In other words, the writer is referring to past problems with other aluminum-skinned vehicles, not with the 2015 F-150. It would be interesting to learn the thickness and grade of the aluminum used in these other aluminum-skinned vehicles compared to the roof of a 2015 F-150.
BTW, has anybody dropped by the BatLabs forums to see if anyone over there has any experience with this? A number of experienced installers hang out there.
Last edited:
mmckenna
I ♥ Ø
I've been looking, have not seen anything yet.
- Status
