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Old 06-30-2013, 3:01 PM
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Default CPU upgrades. Please stop with the false info

As a person whom has been into computers since back when whatever you wanted to do came after LOAD, I am a bit aggravated.

I happen to be a person whom cares about the environment. I hate the world we are leaving for our children. In turn our children will have to figure out a way to dig themselves out of the environmental mess we have made, not to mention other messes like debt or whatnot (another topic altogether). This however is not my point.

I have a real problem with the supposed "know hows" living on the net spreading false information to the "know nots".

Back when the personal computer became the norm in homes, five minutes after purchase your PC was already out of date (bit of far stretch I know but not really, you catch my drift). Moore's law was the norm and technology moved so fast that very few except the truly knowing could keep track. Keeping track didn't even carry any advantage because by the time you figured it all out new stuff was coming out and you had to do it all over again. Now we have slowed down (I am slow glad).

You still have the "know nots" and the people whom claim to think they have a clue. These people whom think they have a clue do nothing but fill landfills and do nothing for the people they are trying to help (the know nots) but cost money for not particular reason.

So now the Haswell CPU is on the way. Now what you get is the "know nots" asking the new breed of supposed "know hows" if they should upgrade. The answer is always yes you should. I have to ask why? I cannot crawl the whole net and stop this and I really wish I could.

Even as far as we have got with speed of storage media, we are not to a point of maximizing processor performance per launch of application. What I am saying is, it does not matter how fast a CPU becomes if the storage media cannot give the information at the same speed the CPU can process it.

I am typing this as we speak on a i7 Ivy Bridge laptop with 8gb ram and a 120GB with the fastest SSD it can run taking full advantage of the technology in this machine. Application launches are about instant but still not nearly as fast as the processor could go. Next to me I have my aging desktop. It has a first gen i3 540 with 12gb ram with the fastest SSD it can handle. Between the two machines you would notice no difference in performance. Now if we were to crunch some numbers the i7 would smoke my older i3, but most people are not crunching numbers (and when I say crunching numbers not 1+1 either, complex algorithms). So in everyday use there would be no need to upgrade my desktop. Everything is almost instant the same as the i7, there is not way to get faster.

Now clock speed. People like to use the clock speed argument, and these "know hows" convince the "know nots" with clock speed. Okay, now we know that the current storage medium is not even able to keep up with the CPU, why does clock speed matter? Well, it don't to much. Under special applications like gaming (especially the MMO variety) can take advantage of the extra speed for different reasons I won't go into. For the average user clock speed is not important. Even modern ULV processors are fast. This was not always the case and you might have an old ULV CPU and maybe you should upgrade, maybe not depends on your usage habits.

This gets under my skin. There are indeed special circumstances that do indeed warrant an upgrade. But most want to browse the net and check email (in our case run a radio) and for these applications save your money.

Its so funny, I was playing an MMO and we were all standing around talking about our CPUs. Someone asked what I had, I told them I had an i3. They all LOLed and asked if I was poor or something. My answer I am smart. Then they started talking FPS and the funny thing was I beat some of the newer i7s. To funny and I love when someone comes to me and tells they just built the ultimate rig and all this and that. We talk about my i3 and they think its funny. I boot it up, show them how it works and they always leave with their tail tucked. LOL....
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Old 06-30-2013, 3:34 PM
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Oh, ok.
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Old 06-30-2013, 5:59 PM
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Default Re: CPU upgrades. Please stop with the false info

I had my single core AMD for nearly 10 years, and it suited me fine with appropriate ram, storage, etc. upgrades. But everything wears over now, so I went from one core, to 8. The ones who upgrade when the next best thing comes out are usually the same ones that are waiting in line at the apple store for the new iPhone.

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Old 06-30-2013, 7:17 PM
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I still run a Q6600 overclocked to 3.2 GHz. I just want to buy an i7 3930k. Screw Haswell, it really is no different. My laptop is a core 2 duo 2.5GHz. Fine for what I use it for which is just Internet. I don't need an i3 or i7 laptop.
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Old 06-30-2013, 9:34 PM
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Up till about 4 years ago I had 25 machines. They varied in speed from 25MHz up to my AMD 3000+.

I refused to throw them away. My wife one day stubbed her toe and that was the end of that. I kept the 3000+ and used it for about six years I guess. After that it turned into a parts machine and the case and PSU to that machine is still in use today. The motherboard ended up taking a crap on me.

Now I have this laptop I just bought (area issue and trying to have more room). My desktop is here as an emergency rig (mainly for games). I also have a little 14 inch ThinkPad for when I need something portable. I have some tablets as well for doing quick lookups and whatnot (probably need to rid myself of one).

I just hold on to things because I try and find a use for them. My wife tries to keep me in check though. I would just rather find a use for something rather then see it polluting the world in some way (and no I am not a hippy or anything).
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Old 07-01-2013, 4:33 PM
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The computer I am writing this post on, and the one I've written all my previous ones on, is a '99 (?) Dell Optiplex GX100.* 1.2 GHz Pentium III, 1GB RAM (had to install a hacked BIOS to get that to work) and 20GB hard drive. Nothing fancy, especially by today's industry standards, but somehow I've gotten by just fine accessing the network with this box for the past several years. I'm not a fan of "Hell's Dells"--usually they don't last longer than ~3-4 months in my care. For the most part, they're throwaway junk (which brings us back to corbintechboy's point about environmental problems) and I'm rather surprised this box has held on as long as it has.

It's just a network terminal, nothing more--I use my non-networked Phenom X3 box for the important work. I do a lot of audio and video processing, so a multi-core CPU is a major improvement over the Pentium IV I had in there previously, even if my OS and application software are all 32-bit. Assuming you're stuck using Winblow$, the more modern versions of NT (5.0-up) still let you use the individual cores as discrete CPUs, even if the OS doesn't support threading. NT 5.0 Professional only supports 2 CPUs, but even that is quite a drastic improvement in itself.

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* Not certain about the model year. It was current tech when I was in high school more than a decade ago (learnt to type on one) and my school had an entire fleet of them at the time.
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Old 07-01-2013, 6:30 PM
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The higher number means it's better, right?

Newer technology?
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Old 07-01-2013, 7:12 PM
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Default CPU upgrades. Please stop with the false info

I'm happy with my 2007 Toshiba Satellite 305, running Vista.

Oh, and the iPad 3Gen!

I use technology until it can't really do much of anything anymore. I still use my Pro-2005 scanner, for instance.

I have a feeling Corbin, that a lot of the folks on RR are happy with "trailing edge" technology; it's the way of the radio hobbyist!
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Old 07-01-2013, 9:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimru View Post
I'm happy with my 2007 Toshiba Satellite 305, running Vista.

Oh, and the iPad 3Gen!

I use technology until it can't really do much of anything anymore. I still use my Pro-2005 scanner, for instance.

I have a feeling Corbin, that a lot of the folks on RR are happy with "trailing edge" technology; it's the way of the radio hobbyist!
I think the days of having to upgrade are over.

I am under the impression that any modern computer (last 5 years or so) is very future proof. I would even say that a Celeron from that era is a good computer.

I am under the same impression, use a computer until it offers very little in modern technology. But then I am a Linux user and the useful life of a machine can become greatly extended with Linux. Set an old machine as a media server or something.
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Old 07-01-2013, 10:02 PM
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there is always going to be that " NEWER IS BETTER - I GOT TO HAVE IT " Mentality for those who have what most gamers know as a "E-P3N15" ooooh mine is bigger and better than yours.... will ALWAYS be the fight.
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Old 07-02-2013, 1:39 AM
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I'm just waiting for the 5 GHz processors so that I can play FSX to it's full potential.
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Old 07-02-2013, 3:25 PM
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you dont need a 5GHz CPU to run FSX at full potential........... my 3770K clocked @ 4.5 with my 2x 650 Ti BOOST 2GB Cards runs it locked at 60 FPS Full Features + VSync. you cant just rely on one component to handle everything in today's computing world. balance is the key here.


you need:

CPU Power: to handle the core app data
Video Rendering Power: to handle the video and rendering aspect
( For games supporting PhysX) you need a PhysX capable GPU
Memory: enough RAM and fast enough RAM to handle the fast acting and massive amounts of bus data going between the CPU and Buses

HDD: you need enough storage and PageFile space and as a bonus if you want faster world data loading times, a SSD with PF disabled and handled by another drive is a big +



i could go on and on, but this is the RANTS section not Computers.


BACK ON TOPIC:::::


yes it is getting annoying how the fight for the best system drags on everyday.

look at newegg and the public wish lists....... 3000 upto 6000 $$ in spending for systems. i can take some of the blame, my current system i could sell right now minus 1 HDD with my personal data on it, for about 1800-2000$. but i have no future plans on upgrading till the next major roll out of hardware comes through. and i never trash components unless they are dead-dead. and then at that i have a E-Recycler friend that i take everything to. i dont dump ROHS stuff in the trash. and if its still good, i either use it, or sell it to a good user.
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Old 07-02-2013, 7:02 PM
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Yeah, but are you running addons and have 1500 AI planes all running around? And are you running at maximum settings? Sure you can run FSX on midi core settings, but your not getting the full potential.
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Old 07-03-2013, 8:22 PM
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rendering is set to max, now the AI and addons.... dont have many of those, i could run it at that and see though, but the point still remains, a CPU is not going to handle everything smoothly like you think it will just because its running @ 5GHz
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Old 07-04-2013, 12:08 AM
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Well, I'm a member at Flightsim.com and many members there know that you need a decent CPU and many do and still can't set everything to max and get good frame rates. I use a ton of addons with enhanced airports and such with over 1500 AI planes all flying around. That there WILL tax a system. My current rig is a Q6600 and a GTX 560 TI. I was going to build a new system with a 3930K but I never got around to it. Been too damn busy lately to mess around with it. I don't even hardly game right now.
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Old 07-04-2013, 12:43 AM
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To bad Windows won't allow some of the power of Linux.

Back in the day I have set up 3 machines to cross compile and share the load. What is being stated above would be a prime candidate for something like this. Split the load of the game like that and with 3semi powerful machines you would be able to easily max out the settings.

Makes me wonder about flight gear and if that would be possible in Linux. Of course I have not dabbled in that in years and have no idea how it compares to FSX. But I do know years ago there were addons and a mass community built around it.

Now of course GPU is a big issue. Drop some money on an NVidia Titan maybe (if you have a couple bucks laying around ).
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Old 07-04-2013, 4:48 PM
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Well, it's M$ so what do you expect?
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Old 07-06-2013, 10:44 PM
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Quote:
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I use technology until it can't really do much of anything anymore. I still use my Pro-2005 scanner, for instance.
Same here my friend...

I've never paid more than $150 for a laptop... and I never will.

My current cheap "beast" is a Dell Studio 1555 with Core 2 Duo 2.1 GHz, 4 GB RAM, and 320 GB HD. It was a $125 pawn shop special. It handles everything and runs all of my radio stuff perfectly. I couldn't imagine needing anything better.

I'll let other folks spend big bucks and buy new toys. I know I'll eventually end up with them for a tiny fraction of what they paid.
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