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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 09-12-2008, 9:06 AM
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Originally Posted by DonS View Post
Maybe, with sufficient storage space. However, keep in mind that I have 4 apps that can be registered, going back 5 years. Having my email client search through a large repository (my existing combined repository files are well over 2GB) of saved emails likely wouldn't be much faster than the 15 minute "generate a new key" solution, especially if the user has changed email addresses, moved, etc. (making it difficult to discern unique users).
If they only system you can come up with to save software keys is in e-mail messages I would hate to see your software.

I use Proscan and so far it has worked fine. As for scanning software that allows streaming, for the price, it can't be beat. Cut him a little slack, in this day and age especially on the internet, it is nessasry to verify some information before handing out information. I am sure he was just trying to make sure there wasn't anything fishy going on.

Aaron
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 09-12-2008, 9:42 AM
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Originally Posted by itsmevoss View Post
If they only system you can come up with to save software keys is in e-mail messages I would hate to see your software.
Keys for my software are generated automatically and remotely, and are only sent to me via email (I'm copied on the email that the customer receives). I keep those emails for 7-10 days in case they "bounced" on their way to the customer, then delete them.

I've never been inclined to keep the key emails (or the data they contain) for any longer, in any form. I suppose that if I had been so inclined, I could've written something to hook into my email client, look at the text of each received email, then store any key information in a separate, "non-email" file. But (and perhaps I've been a bit naive in this), I've never felt that it was my job to be a key backup service for those customers who don't save the keys themselves.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 09-12-2008, 9:57 AM
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Don was backing me up on the cost to replace lost keys which Steve though was BS. Thanks Don.

I didn't want this tread to go off on a tangent.
The original complaint that I received from Steve (only complaint that I ever received)
Is the title to this thread? "ProScan Poor Support". My support is at a 100% customer satisfaction rate. I never ever heard of any other complaints against me. Steve was upset that I didn't give him another activation which isn't in the support category anyway.

I tried to work with Steve but his story kept changing from "I re-formatted the hard drive" to "I replaced the hard drive, all other hardware exactly the same" to "I don't know if the motherboard was changed" to "all these inners were replaced". He just wasn't being upfront and his answers were conflicting.

Even in this tread he says thing conflicting such as "going to Butel 100%" to "I found a ProScan key generator and activated ProScan myself" to asking for activation. If Steve was not trying to BS me I would have helped him out like I helped everyone else.

I agree with Brandon that the activation process could be a pain. I will rethink the activation process.

Thank you all for posting favorable comments and I will keep the support at 100%.

Last edited by ProScan; 09-12-2008 at 8:08 PM..
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 09-12-2008, 9:57 AM
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Don, I do agree with you on that point. People need to understand that it is there responsibility to keep track of these things. When you get an important number you need to right it down and keep it in a safe place.

Aaron

Last edited by itsmevoss; 09-12-2008 at 9:59 AM..
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 09-12-2008, 5:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonS View Post
Maybe, with sufficient storage space. However, keep in mind that I have 4 apps that can be registered, going back 5 years. Having my email client search through a large repository (my existing combined repository files are well over 2GB) of saved emails likely wouldn't be much faster than the 15 minute "generate a new key" solution, especially if the user has changed email addresses, moved, etc. (making it difficult to discern unique users).
- you wouldn't have 2 GB of regkey emails

- your email client searching for 15 minutes does not equate to 15 minutes of your searching; work smart, not hard

- users can provide their original email address; if they don't / can't, it pretty much eliminates your obligations


Quote:
Originally Posted by DonS View Post
Keys for my software are generated automatically and remotely, and are only sent to me via email (I'm copied on the email that the customer receives). I keep those emails for 7-10 days in case they "bounced" on their way to the customer, then delete them.
Deleting them is work. Why aren't they automatically moved to dedicated mailboxes (one per product) and kept there forever (and backed up)? Most email clients have filtering/routing rules, don't they?

I would think that who paid for what would be considered to be an important business record and I'd want them stored on my PC and in my backups, rather than on some payment provider's system - a system that you have no control over.


Quote:
I've never felt that it was my job to be a key backup service for those customers who don't save the keys themselves.
Sounds like customer service to me. Saving emails should be trivial. Searching them should be trivial.

Anyway, just my opinions; it's your biz to run as you see fit and I can see where 8 to 12 requests per day would be a PITA.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 09-12-2008, 7:17 PM
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Originally Posted by slicerwizard View Post
- your email client searching for 15 minutes does not equate to 15 minutes of your searching; work smart, not hard
It's 15 minutes of my computer crunching away at the hard drive, severely impacting any other disk-intensive operations (e.g. compiling code for my "day job") I can perform during that period. Given that my entire "job" is based on sitting at the computer writing/testing/debugging code, bogging down the machine with 8-12 disk-intensive searches per day becomes a problem.

Quote:
- users can provide their original email address; if they don't / can't, it pretty much eliminates your obligations
Users can save the single email they receive from my key-generation server, rather than me saving thousands of them. My "obligation" was satisfied when I delivered the paid-for key in the first place. Protecting what was paid for is the purchaser's "obligation", not mine.

Quote:
Deleting them is work. Why aren't they automatically moved to dedicated mailboxes (one per product) and kept there forever (and backed up)? Most email clients have filtering/routing rules, don't they?
They are automatically moved to dedicated locations, then deleted after a couple of weeks - 2 minutes of work every other Wednesday to purge a couple of "folders".

As for "why" they're not kept in those locations forever (and backed up)... because I don't feel that's reasonable to expect. No matter how trivial I might think it is for my local Dodge dealer to give me a new key for my truck, I certainly wouldn't dream of expecting him to keep a stash of "replacement keys" (or grind new ones on demand), for free, in case his past customers happen to lose theirs.

Quote:
I would think that who paid for what would be considered to be an important business record and I'd want them stored on my PC and in my backups, rather than on some payment provider's system - a system that you have no control over.
I keep those records that are required come tax time: X dollars in "business income" and Y dollars in "business expenses". I declare the income (not itemized by transaction), and keep records of each expense transaction.

If large corporations and the corner drug store don't need to record that Don Starr paid $0.50 for a candy bar on 12 Sept 2008 (and instead just record "received $0.50 on 12 Sept 2008", if it's even itemized that far), then I don't need to keep that type of record. I just need to record $A in income in 2008.

Quote:
Sounds like customer service to me. Saving emails should be trivial. Searching them should be trivial.
To me, the "customer service" part is offering a fully-functional product for a free trial period, answering technical support questions before and after registration, offering unlimited future upgrades at no cost, adding features as people request them, etc.

Saving a registration key is "customer self service", IMNSHO. And if me saving thousands of emails is trivial, each customer saving a single email should be relatively trivial, as well.

Quote:
Anyway, just my opinions; it's your biz to run as you see fit and I can see where 8 to 12 requests per day would be a PITA.
2 requests per day became a PITA prior to Mar 2004, when my Win96 program had "hardware-locked" keys. People were, quite understandably, replacing hard drives, network cards, motherboards, and entire PCs. The Win96 keys that depended on those things stopped functioning. At that time (01 Mar 2008), I eliminated the hardware-dependent keys in favor of keys that would work on any machine, any time - they were tied, instead, to user-specific personal information (name, email, street address). I offered every existing Win96 user a "non-hardware-dependent" replacement key, and manually generated these new keys for all users that requested them (at that time, I *did* have records of all registrants - there weren't so many back then).

Personally, I think it's silly to expect any vendor of "online software" to indefinitely maintain and supply on demand a key that's already been delivered, unless they've already said they'd do so. Why is the vendor expected to be the backup service? They lived up to their end of the agreement when they supplied the key that was paid for.

A couple of years ago, I needed to install several paid-for apps on a new PC. I couldn't find my copies of the keys for Adobe Acrobat or Photoshop. I lucked out on Acrobat - I'd purchased it recently enough that Adobe still had the information available online. For Photoshop, I was SOL - I "manned up" and paid for CS2 again; I sure as heck didn't complain online about Adobe's Draconian requirement that I protect what I'd purchased.

In the case of my software, the user must explicitly agree to certain terms before they can register the software. One of these items is an admonishment: "DO NOT LOSE THIS KEY". I don't promise that I'll be able to replace a "lost" key, nor do I even promise a response to a request for one.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 09-13-2008, 1:00 AM
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Your 100% is gone. Although very unlikey, but even if I was the only complaint, your talking 99% customer satisfication. 100% means all, not most, but all.

Anyway, I don't want anyone to forget I sent Bob a copy of my key and this whole issue was over the fact that his copy protection only allows you to install the software twice. After a year of using his system, I was on my second computer and it crashed. All I wanted was a reinstall. It was just very hard for me to believe I had to answer 10+ emails from Bob and his 20 questions to get my software reinstalled.

Again, Microsoft reactivated my $500 office package no problem, so what is your deal Bob, do you just occationally like to mess with a customer?


Steve


Quote:
Originally Posted by ProScan View Post
Don was backing me up on the cost to replace lost keys which Steve though was BS. Thanks Don.

I didn't want this tread to go off on a tangent.
The original complaint that I received from Steve (only complaint that I ever received)
Is the title to this thread? "ProScan Poor Support". My support is at a 100% customer satisfaction rate. I never ever heard of any other complaints against me. Steve was upset that I didn't give him another activation which isn't in the support category anyway.

I tried to work with Steve but his story kept changing from "I re-formatted the hard drive" to "I replaced the hard drive, all other hardware exactly the same" to "I don't know if the motherboard was changed" to "all these inners were replaced". He just wasn't being upfront and his answers were conflicting.

Even in this tread he says thing conflicting such as "going to Butel 100%" to "I found a ProScan key generator and activated ProScan myself" to asking for activation. If Steve was not trying to BS me I would have helped him out like I helped everyone else.

I agree with Brandon that the activation process could be a pain. I will rethink the activation process.

Thank you all for posting favorable comments and I will keep the support at 100%.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 09-13-2008, 3:17 AM
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Steve, I asked a total of 4 questions and that many because your story kept changing.
You said the hard drive was replaced and all other hardware exactly the same.
The last question you replayed "I don't know if the motherboard was replaced because a repair shop did the work" sounded to me like you didn't know if you should have answered yes or no.

I always said I'm willing to work with you on this. You said you could offer proof by showing me the repair shop paper work and when I accepted you stopped working with me on this.

I am willing to issue you a full refund minus the $1.75 paypal fee. Please email me the account email address to send it to.

Last edited by ProScan; 09-13-2008 at 3:29 AM..
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 09-13-2008, 5:55 AM
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To me it's pretty simple SAVE THE FREAKIN KEY WHEN IT IS EMAILED FROM THE VENDOR!

it is really not that hard, I have a GMAIL account and ALL of the Keys i have for as long as i can remember. if i had an HDD failure the keys are not on my machine so no worries i can retrieve them.

Backing up Your system regularly is a no brainer there are many options out there, I Use DVD's External Hard Drives and a wonderful service called carbonite to back up important files.

When the Vendor replaces a lost key he does it as a favor, he should not be expected to replace every lost key request, this just creates an excuse for laziness.

one exception is hardware dependent keys, but thats another matter

Quit Crying, accept some personal responsibility and save your keys, crying about this on a public forum because you cant get your way is pretty childish

Thanks to All the Sowftware Vendors, Don,Mike,Gommert,Bob... Your Work is Sincerely Appreciated
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Last edited by Stormchaser_35; 09-13-2008 at 6:01 AM..
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Old 09-13-2008, 7:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormchaser_35 View Post
To me it's pretty simple SAVE THE FREAKIN KEY WHEN IT IS EMAILED FROM THE VENDOR!

it is really not that hard, I have a GMAIL account and ALL of the Keys i have for as long as i can remember. if i had an HDD failure the keys are not on my machine so no worries i can retrieve them.
I have to admit, I feel the same way and do almost the exact same thing.

I have a text file with all keys that I have purchased that I update and email to myself on the gmail account when there is something new added.

That way I can access it no matter where I am.
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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 09-14-2008, 3:03 AM
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You guys must be reading this wrong. I emailed Proscan a copy of my key as proof of purchase just so I could get it reactivated on my computer that was repaired.

THIS IS NOT an issue of a lost key, its an issue of copy protection only allowing the software to be activated twice.

Bob: Lets just settle this once and for all. I don't want your money, I just want legal use of what I paid for. Please just set your activation system so I can reactivate the software properly on my laptop. PM me if you erased my email me with my key an I'll send it again.

Steve

Quote:
Originally Posted by JWhipple View Post
I have to admit, I feel the same way and do almost the exact same thing.

I have a text file with all keys that I have purchased that I update and email to myself on the gmail account when there is something new added.

That way I can access it no matter where I am.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 09-14-2008, 7:21 AM
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I was working with you on trying to get you activated up until the name calling started (joking or not it's still name calling). I asked a total of 4 questions, not 20 as you claimed and each answer was BS. You said you could offer proof and when i called you on it, you went balistic.

On the lost key, you said that I told you I get 100's of request a day. I actually told you I have several request ahead of you. Your original email address (steve@4xxxxxxxx.com) is different then the one you sent the request on (sxxxxxxxx@verizon.net). Here you claimed it was the same.

Here you claimed that you upgraded your computer last year. You registered ProScan on 05/29/08. The request for a lost key was made on 07/02/08 and in the email you stated that your computer crashed and said nothing about upgrading your computer.

I already lost a lot of productivity time working on ProScan. I don't need these kinds of problems. I will only make a refund at this point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by swwesq View Post
You guys must be reading this wrong. I emailed Proscan a copy of my key as proof of purchase just so I could get it reactivated on my computer that was repaired.

THIS IS NOT an issue of a lost key, its an issue of copy protection only allowing the software to be activated twice.

Bob: Lets just settle this once and for all. I don't want your money, I just want legal use of what I paid for. Please just set your activation system so I can reactivate the software properly on my laptop. PM me if you erased my email me with my key an I'll send it again.

Steve

Last edited by ProScan; 09-14-2008 at 11:22 AM..
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 09-14-2008, 2:53 PM
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I think this thread needs to go PRIVATE???
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Old 09-14-2008, 3:28 PM
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ProScans satisfaction rate doesnt look tarnished to this outsider. The fact that he is willing to give a refund to someone who used a key generator on his product says alot to me.
I thought this guys problem was solved at the conclusion of his 5 minute google search referred to in message #8 anyway.
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Old 09-14-2008, 8:44 PM
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 09-14-2008, 9:07 PM
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I have ProScan and i'm very happy with his customer service. I would highly recommend Bob's product to anyone!
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Old 09-14-2008, 9:14 PM
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(A customer runs in two minutes to closing time.)

Me: “I’m sorry sir, we’re closing soon.”

Customer: “What do you mean, you’re closing? But I haven’t had time to get what I want!”

Me: “We’re open again tomorrow, 9 til 9.”

Customer: “You should stay open until 10. People need to do their shopping, you know.”

Me: “Sir, people like you are the reason that people like me don’t have lives.”
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2008, 7:03 PM
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Ok, PM sent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ProScan View Post
I was working with you on trying to get you activated up until the name calling started (joking or not it's still name calling). I asked a total of 4 questions, not 20 as you claimed and each answer was BS. You said you could offer proof and when i called you on it, you went balistic.

On the lost key, you said that I told you I get 100's of request a day. I actually told you I have several request ahead of you. Your original email address (steve@4xxxxxxxx.com) is different then the one you sent the request on (sxxxxxxxx@verizon.net). Here you claimed it was the same.

Here you claimed that you upgraded your computer last year. You registered ProScan on 05/29/08. The request for a lost key was made on 07/02/08 and in the email you stated that your computer crashed and said nothing about upgrading your computer.

I already lost a lot of productivity time working on ProScan. I don't need these kinds of problems. I will only make a refund at this point.
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 09-20-2008, 8:35 AM
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Write a script that will extract names from the email. Send it to a SQL database. Set up a cron job (if you use linux) to query requests at night when the computer is not busy. Charge 5 bucks and tell the customer to please allow 24 hours for the key. If you goto bed at 11pm every night, have the system run the job at 2am to give you some room. Problem solved!!! Although I do agree it should be the responsibility of the end user, but at the same time stuff does happen on occasion.

Last edited by corbintechboy; 09-20-2008 at 8:37 AM..
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