Antenna for indoor UHF

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RedPenguin

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I am currently in a valley surround by high mountains. My entire county is on UHF and I am trying to get a better antenna than just a rubber duckie.

I cannot put anything out in yard due to high risk of vandalism.

I thought about what others have said about car scanner antennas and looked at a few at Radio Shack but not sure that's what I need.

I also debated a scanner amplifier but not sure if it can power multiple scanners I got at least 4.

My problem is signal can fade in and out while a person is transmitting like someone keeps playing with the volume knob.

Edit: Also I thought maybe it was electronic noise or computers but my almost no electronics neighbor is having exact same issue with her Pro-164. Also local PD on 453.650 claim they also are having issues not being able to contact Dispatch or vice-versa.
 
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GrumpyGuard

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I would suggest an outdoor antenna placed on a mast attached to your chimney or fascia board on you home. Since you are in a valley you would need to get the antenna as high as possible to get good reception.
 

kb5udf

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Ideas

First, to figure out if a new antenna would help, you need to make sure what your received signal strength of the repeater is. If you have a meter for receive on your scanner take notice of the signal level
and see if you are hearing the repeater well, or if the users are having troubling hitting the repeater.

If you have a good signal level on the repeater, but the users aren't hitting it well, it will sound like
static, and no antenna changes on your end would help.

Assuming the problem is your ability to receive the repeater, I'd suggest taking your scanner up with your to the attic, and move around to see if you can find a "sweet spot" where the signal is better. Consider putting a more substantial antenna thereabouts.

I have and use the tram 1486uhf antenna (needs tuning). Alternative, you might get something like
a 3-5db mobile magmount antenna on ebay for a few bucks, and stick it on a flat piece of metal like a pie pan. Just make sure the antenna you buy is for the correct frequency range, in your case 450-470, or so.


FYI antennas usually perform better above the roof level and outside, so if this is feasible, go that route. The tram I recommended to you can easily be mounted to any standard TV antenna type mount pipes.

Another route you might consider, is that of getting a yagi or beam antenna and adjusting it in the direction
of the desired repeater for maximum signal strength. Generally new beams tend to be somewhat more expensive than verticals, but they can also be more effective depending on the size and gain.

Bottom line, odds are VERY good that if you can receive a signal at all with a portable antenna, you can receive the same signal very well with a more substantial antenna, assuming the problem is signal strength.

JB
 

RedPenguin

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I see some problems already. A few of the channels units do have major problems reaching the repeater and/or are known to have crap working radios to where no one can understand them. Yet even fixed location dispatches fade in and out.

Also no attic but can try something inside upstairs window.
 

gewecke

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I see some problems already. A few of the channels units do have major problems reaching the repeater and/or are known to have crap working radios to where no one can understand them. Yet even fixed location dispatches fade in and out.

Also no attic but can try something inside upstairs window.

Try a mag mount antenna on the outside of a window mount ac ! Usually works well!

73,
n9zas
 

RedPenguin

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Try a mag mount antenna on the outside of a window mount ac ! Usually works well!

73,
n9zas

Ok, that's what I thought.

I think my house itself is doing something like maybe metal in the walls.

Some of the far away channels (not extremely far away but like 20 miles) if I had my scanners not near a window, they barely could pick said channels up.

The minute I moved them closer a window, they suddenly got WAY better, still not perfect, but I'd say like 75% listenable vs maybe 10% listenable.
 

popnokick

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Do you have a balcony or patio? You can easily make the wire version of the Off-Center Fed Dipole shown in the RR Antenna Wiki. Hang it vertically in/near the balcony door or a tall window and run the coax back to your scanner.
 

RedPenguin

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Nope

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Do you have a balcony or patio? You can easily make the wire version of the Off-Center Fed Dipole shown in the RR Antenna Wiki. Hang it vertically in/near the balcony door or a tall window and run the coax back to your scanner.

Nah but really wish I did.
 

druhe

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Do you have a balcony or patio? You can easily make the wire version of the Off-Center Fed Dipole shown in the RR Antenna Wiki. Hang it vertically in/near the balcony door or a tall window and run the coax back to your scanner.

I have used several versions of this antenna with great success. Even though a window or balcony is not available you will see improved radio performance, not only on UHF but on other bands as well. You can build one for about $2.25 give or take a few cents. It's well worth the effort.

Homebrewed Off-Center Fed Dipole - The RadioReference Wiki
 

Rt169Radio

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Are you able to put a antenna on top or on the side of your house?
 

RedPenguin

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Are you able to put a antenna on top or on the side of your house?

Unfortunately not but I did notice some really cool antenna options while looking on eBay at Mag Mounts.

I saw the Workman SC-1 with suction cups which seems like a really cool idea.

But a mag mount with the RH77CA seems like it would be a very good performer for me as well.

If I can ever get it with the holiday shipping, LoL.
 

RedPenguin

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Thank You Guys

Thank all of you so much.

I got my mini mag mount (BNC with RH77CA) today and at first was disappointed with the results of putting it in the window.

It still didn't quite seem to get reception, though when putting it up to almost the ceiling on top of a picture frame on the wall next to the window, I was blown away at the great reception, it's like HD TV vs old snowy analog OTA TV.

I'm hearing stuff I have not been able to hear well for at least a year like NorthCentral PD (this channel I had virtually given up on even receiving).

Still going to mess with the Workman SC-1 and the homemade one that DRuhe showed, but I'm just glad I know for a fact there is much better signal available just as long as you can find the right sweet spot. Also I must admit having a mag mount is nice, I get a kick out of how you can move the antenna basically anywhere but leave the scanner stationary.
 
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gewecke

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Thank all of you so much.

I got my mini mag mount (BNC with RH77CA) today and at first was disappointed with the results of putting it in the window.

It still didn't quite seem to get reception, though when putting it up to almost the ceiling on top of a picture frame on the wall next to the window, I was blown away at the great reception, it's like HD TV vs old snowy analog OTA TV.

I'm hearing stuff I have not been able to hear well for at least a year like NorthCentral PD (this channel I had virtually given up on even receiving).

Still going to mess with the Workman SC-1 and the homemade one that DRuhe showed, but I'm just glad I know for a fact there is much better signal available just as long as you can find the right sweet spot. Also I must admit having a mag mount is nice, I get a kick out of how you can move the antenna basically anywhere but leave the scanner stationary.

Keep in mind to use that antenna for OTA TV you might try sticking it to a metal surface horizontally, even near a window or if possible off the side of a steel rain gutter?

73,
n9zas
 

RedPenguin

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Keep in mind to use that antenna for OTA TV you might try sticking it to a metal surface horizontally, even near a window or if possible off the side of a steel rain gutter?

73,
n9zas

Yea I know what you mean.

I was just using that as a comparison to emphasize how much better the audio is from having the RH77CA on a mag mount vs on the scanner itself.
 

RedPenguin

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An Update

Just to give everybody an update here is my final results with my new antennas.

With a mini mag mount with the RH77CA, my BR330T seems to really pick up traffic with little static.

With the Workman SC-1 (wire antenna with suction cups) to my window, my older Realistic Pro-2083 picks up with virtually no static, like I'm listening to the channels with a direct Internet connection to the repeaters or something.

Also I guess I was wrong with the North Central frequency (453.300). I tried every virtual way to put my antennas, on every scanner possible and even though I can get other far away stations, 453.300 is very finicky. DRuhe probably can say exactly how 453.300 is setup, and even though it's supposed to even serve Adams Township which is not that far away, I don't have great reception. All I can figure is the repeater's antenna must be aimed more towards North vs South where I am. 453.475MHZ is in Pindleton and yet that channel comes in like 95% or so audible.


So if anybody is having a similar problem, these are the items I used:

Mini Mag Mount with BNC and 5 ft cable:

OPEK AM-109-BNC - Mini Magnetic Antenna Mount | eBay

Workman SC-1:

SCANNER ANTENNA BNC Connector Suction Cup Window Mount | eBay

Though I can't wait until my BNC adapters arrive so I can mess with the antennas that DRuhe showed but so far I'm noticing much better results that just putting the RH77CA antenna on the scanner alone.
 
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RedPenguin

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Different Window

Oddly enough, sometimes even a window makes all the difference.

I still wasn't get quite the results I wanted even with all my tricks, so I decided there is another window in the room and even though it's only like 12 feet maybe away from the other window, I said that window isn't as blocked by houses behind it then behind them, it has more of an open look down the street.

The signal went so clear I couldn't believe my ears.

It was like before listening with a tin-foil antenna and now like I was next to the repeater or was using the different agencies own base radios.
 

vagrant

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That antenna (RH77CA) plays double duty for me. It is usually on my 2m/70cm HT, or the Pro-164 when away from the house/vehicle. I'll also use the suction cup mount to get it on a window.

I use filters as well to clean up the intermod/BCB problems I have. Cost a pretty penny, but worth it for my particular home location, or when travelling. Not sure if you suffer from similar problems, but it's worth looking into to be sure.

You noted having multiple receivers (4). I use the EDA-UG 2402 splitter. I picked it up for $10 on Amazon and it delivers +0dB, so it doesn't overload the front end of the receivers. With four outputs, it would seem to be the right solution for you to share that single antenna. You'll probably need some F/BNC adapters and a few runs of cable.
 
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