Columbia County - Fire 1 now NB

NgoraSweatr · Nov 30, 2012

Columbia County Fire 1 is now NB and CSQ, following the trend set by P1 earlier in the month.

It also sounds as if it is repeatered, instead of remote base/receiver as I believe (correct me if I am wrong) it had been.

Correction submitted to DB.

r3wt · Nov 30, 2012

KGD704 has 156.015 with a class of FB2, since mid 2009. It seems they've been planning to switch fire 1 to a repeater for some time, which agrees with what you've observed.

I really hope this CSQ nonsense ends (or is temporary) though.. going to miss having PL tones to filter out interference when I'm mobile.

r3wt · Nov 30, 2012

Fire 1 has been pretty quiet today, but I did catch one dispatch still using a 351 DPL earlier tonight. Perhaps it was only CSQ for a short while during maintenance..?

r3wt · Dec 1, 2012

So far fire 1 is still used only with a 351 DPL. Also no signs of a repeater at this point - have heard (or missed) several mobile transmissions, but nothing repeated.

r3wt · Dec 13, 2012

I just heard some radio testing between county and chief 320, CSQ and repeated. They will probably be going to this configuration in the future, but are still working out some issues. Still hearing comms with a 351 DPL and no repeating between testing.

r3wt · Dec 16, 2012

More radio checks today. Seems they are having some issues yet.. I was picking up constant doubling and the mobile end was complaining of what sounds to be the same problem.

r3wt · Jan 24, 2013

An update for anyone that was following this thread...

Everything from county is CSQ, repeater output is CSQ, all mobile units are 100.0 PL. All/most/many radios are/were programmed with Fire 1 as TX to repeater input/RX 156.015 AND Fire 1 Talkaround as TX/RX on 156.015 with 100.0PL for TX. The Fire 1 repeater is active but not to be used.

When someone attempts to use the repeater, county will say "I'm not sure what you're on, but you should be using the talkaround" (or more recently, "switch to talkaround" as the confusion grows old). Repeater output almost always has some interference (simulcast?) - usually significantly worse on my 396XT than HP1.

At this point, I'm not sure if they're working to fix the repeater or have permanently abandoned it. I had contacted a group of first responders online as an attempt to get a better idea, and their response was that the county was more or less attempting to duct tape together a solution and no one knows exactly what is going on.

One13Truck · Apr 11, 2013

I hope they decide to go to the repeater at some point. For the brief time they were trying it out it was great to be able to hear the field units this far into Luzerne County. Of course now I can barely even get the dispatches unless the conditions are right.

r3wt · May 16, 2013

I've been hearing a lot of checks through the repeater (no PL) from radio maintenance and others lately (several today). County has been receiving well and not advising them of any problems. In the past, county was usually unable to hear the repeater input very well and consistently told radio maintenance to switch to the talkaround. Maybe there is hope for the repeater.

One13Truck · May 22, 2013

One can hope there is! It was nice to hear the repeater for the brief period it was in use. But then again it seems to be hit or miss when I can get Columbia at all up here in Luzerne anyway.

W7FDX · Jul 1, 2013

From Firewire Columbia County on Facebook:

Reminder thie tuesday july 2nd at 0900 (9AM) county is switching back to the repeater. All county fire companies are to switch back then not any sooner

r3wt · Jul 2, 2013

I can confirm they are operating on the repeater as of today. Lots of activity today.. even some from another county, which uses the repeater's input frequency. Columbia identified it as Susquehanna county - a quick look through the DB turned up 158.835 CSQ (Susq EMA ops) which is licensed for only mobile use within Columbia, but unlisted in the DB for Columbia. I can't confirm that is actually the input, although it makes sense since Columbia has become allergic to PL's in the last 8 months.

Also, it seems the new dispatch procedure is:

- Dispatch on Fire 1 (Fire Disp in the DB)
- Units respond on Fire 1 repeater
- Always assign a Mobile Ops channel for each incident
- Further comms to county using County Ops 2 (Fire Ops 2 in the DB); possibly only due to interference from Susq. County, although I heard this occur on multiple dispatches recently even when interference did not occur
- Radio chaos (optional, but likely)

One13Truck · Jul 4, 2013

I saw that they're on the repeater again on FB. Unfortunately being in one of the TRUE dead spots in Luzerne County Columbia County is still very hit or miss as to when I can get them so I haven't heard any calls yet.

That 158.835 is interesting if that is what it will be. Luzerne and Lackawanna both use that for EMA as well so I would expect there to be quite a bit of interference.

Otherwise though the setup doesn't sound too bad although I'd rather see them have a dispatch only channel and utilize the Fire 1 repeater for initial responses only. But you're still better off than we are here in Luzerne. I wish we could switch over to another county for our dispatching.

r3wt · Jul 4, 2013

14 counties in the state use 158.835, but only Butler, Elk, Lawrence, Montgomery, Potter and Susquehanna use it without PL. If that frequency is indeed the input and the repeater requires no PL, only those 6 counties could be repeated. Otherwise all 14 could be a problem. Most are so far away, they will never be an issue though.

I would hope that the next round of Columbia radio changes will be to use PLs again, to prevent these issues. I've seen people complain that PLs cause interop problems (i.e. somebody from a neighboring county called out for mutual aid and doesn't have the correct PL set up), but what's worse?

captclint · Jul 5, 2013

dhoffman83 said:
14 counties in the state use 158.835, but only Butler, Elk, Lawrence, Montgomery, Potter and Susquehanna use it without PL. If that frequency is indeed the input and the repeater requires no PL

It appears as if the original (as you reported on 1/24) input of 151.2200 PL 100.0 is what they are using now(had only one confirmation so far). I have been listening since 7/1, and haven't heard any interference. Susquehanna is not registered for 151.2200, so I don't know where the county got this idea. Since the mobile units are using 100.0 PL, I would guess the repeater is set up to only accept that PL, so again, not sure how any interference is getting through. I will update the DB once I have additional confirmation of 151.2200.

r3wt · Jul 5, 2013

151.22 seems to be a good candidate - on the same callsign as the repeater and licensed for mobile units only. They could have a secondary input to the repeater for the 911 center, as they do with P1, so they are able to override mobile units. I don't know how they have it set up for P1, but I would think for that purpose it would be over some sort of dedicated point-to-point link though (microwave, copper, fiber, IP, etc), which would eliminate it as a source of the interference. At this point I have only heard the one instance of unintelligible speech which county then said was interference due to Susquehanna - maybe a non-issue..?

I just noticed that they are only licensed for repeater operation (FB2) through the Catawissa tower, not Jonestown or Aristes. The other day (7/2?) I was unable to hear several 150 units on an incident that county was talking to on Fire 1. Perhaps only part of the county will be repeated.

One13Truck · Jul 5, 2013

dhoffman83 said:
14 counties in the state use 158.835, but only Butler, Elk, Lawrence, Montgomery, Potter and Susquehanna use it without PL. If that frequency is indeed the input and the repeater requires no PL, only those 6 counties could be repeated. Otherwise all 14 could be a problem. Most are so far away, they will never be an issue though.

I would hope that the next round of Columbia radio changes will be to use PLs again, to prevent these issues. I've seen people complain that PLs cause interop problems (i.e. somebody from a neighboring county called out for mutual aid and doesn't have the correct PL set up), but what's worse?

Way too late that night to be thinking about PLs so you're right. I missed that. But considering how well Luzerne does everything I wouldn't count out an occasional issue through them too. LOL

It would be nice to see them go back to PLs full time though. As long as they set them up now with PLs I wouldn't think it would cause too much issues with interops. All the neighboring Counties could just add them in now as they adjust to the recent changes instead of worrying about adding them at a later date if Columbia decides to add them back. That is assuming they don't decide to do a PL roulette like some places have recently started to do. I don't understand that either.

One13Truck · Jul 5, 2013

Must be one of the lucky nights for me. I didn't hear the call itself but for 180's dumpster fire I head Lt 180 on the air.... Hey when you've been awake for almost 20 hours sometimes it's the little things. LOL

Columbia County - Fire 1 now NB

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