Sudbury - Possible new system

Good day guys.

This morning I was searching in the 790-960MHz range. I found some interesting frequencies that do not belong to the current EDACS public safety system, nor are not in the Industry Canada or RadioReference.com - Sudbury District database. The steps for the bands are set to default. All heard was data soundMaybe they're the freqs for the new Harris system that will replace the current EDACS system. Can someone please confirm that Harris creates P25 system?

Here are the freqs monitored by a BCD396T near Ramsey Lake Rd and Kirkwood Dr :
Freq / strengh (bars) / Data noise sounds like
- 866.0875 / 3 / EDACS
- 866.1625 / 3-5 / EDACS
- 866.2000 - odd one / 4-5 / EDACS
- 866.5500 - odd one / 1 / EDACS
- 866.6625 / 1 / EDACS
- 867.9125 / 1 / Ukn
- 868.2500 - odd one / 2 / Ukn
- 868.4000 - odd one / 2 / Ukn
- 868.7250 / 5 / Ukn

Just a heads up to keep an open ear on those freqs. I do not have UniTrunk or Trunk88 so I'm unable to verify what system(s)/site(s) these freq belong to. I will try to record the data sound and post it on here.

Cheers.

Harris is a very large player in the P25 market. If it's a P25 control/voice channel your 396 should recognize it as such.

Freqs 868.7250 shows system ID as 0001h-1212. It is too early to submit this info, correct?

Looks like there might be a new system popping up then. If you want to keep tabs on this system as it's built out you should get yourself rigged up with UniTrunker.

I can create a system in "staging" to hold the info that has been provided.

For now, I'll call it Greater Sudbury (Project 25)and keep it hidden from view until more info is known.

Forts said:

Looks like there might be a new system popping up then. If you want to keep tabs on this system as it's built out you should get yourself rigged up with UniTrunker.

Click to expand...

Thanks mciupa. Forts, there is. The city's current EDACS is at the end of its rope and apparently Harris got the contract for the new system! Is there a way to run UniTrunker without tapping the scanner? I don't want to modify my scanner!

Here are the 6 other sites I discovered :
- 867.9125 has sysid 0001h-1111
- 868.2500 has sysid 0001h-0202
- 868.4000 has sysid 0001h-1010
- 868.6875 has sysid 0001h-0707
- 868.7750 has sysid 0001h-0404
- 868.8875 has sysid 0001h-0101

How does a P25 system works? Can you input the freqs of all the sites and the scanner will stop on the first active freq (like fleetnet) or you need to setup a different system for each site like an EDACS system?

Any info on the technical side of P25 system that will help me ''discover'' this new system would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

I can confirm what rc1990 is seeing.

I've set the system to Normal display and added some more information.

rc1990 said:

Is there a way to run UniTrunker without tapping the scanner? I don't want to modify my scanner!

Click to expand...

What kind of scanner do you have? From the information displayed above I gather it's a Uniden (see below for my explanation why). If it's a 396XT or 996XT, you can use that radio's CC output feature (so long as you have the cable for it to hook it to your computer) to pipe it into Unitrunker.

Edit: I looked above like I should have in the first place and see you have a 396T. Unfortunately only the XT radios have the CC output capability.

rc1990 said:

How does a P25 system works? Can you input the freqs of all the sites and the scanner will stop on the first active freq (like fleetnet) or you need to setup a different system for each site like an EDACS system?

Any info on the technical side of P25 system that will help me ''discover'' this new system would be greatly appreciated.

Click to expand...

Fair warning: I tend to ramble and get long-winded. Cherry-pick info from this reply as you wish.

P25 is a lot easier to track than an EDACS system. Just toss in the control channel and let 'er rip. You can put all the freqs into one system/site/bank (which is what I think you're getting at above), but many scanners will ignore all frequencies "after" the first control channel it finds. That is to say if you have 20 frequencies in a system and the radio gets a control channel on frequency 2, the radio will not check frequencies 3-20.

Almost all P25 systems these days, and hopefully brand new ones like this one, contain instructions within the control channel to allow radios to identify what the other frequencies are. This is unlike EDACS where the frequency table has to be specifically loaded.

The display information you've been providing indicates the System ID, the RFSS (Radio Frequency Sub-System) number, and the Site number. (RFSS is essentially a "zone" in a multi-site system, generally used to collect a number of sites together. Some systems, like this one, give each site its own RFSS; others put all sites in one RFSS; etc.)

The information displayed on your screen, like 0001h-1111, is broken down like this:

System ID is 001 (P25 sysids are only three hexadecimal (0-9 and A-F) digits long, and you drop the 'h')
RFSS number is 11 (the first two digits of the "site number")
Site number is also 11 (the last two digits of the "site number")

As indicated in the RR database entry for this system (here, as indicated by the two Mikes above), this is RFSS 11, site 11.

FYI, though you may not need this: Uniden scanners don't show site numbers greater than 99, but site numbers up to 255 are valid. If you see your scanner only showing you the SID, that means that you're tuned to a site that has either RFSS or site ID (or both) 100 or greater.

According to the RR database, the WACN (Wide Area Communications Network) ID for this system is 8A22D. (I believe you can get this info from your scanner if you hit FUNC while the SID and site is displaying.) The WACN is yet another layer of grouping - you could have multiple P25 systems with the same WACN and different system IDs. The US government has several of these.

The RR Wiki has a document on P25 and P25 trunking, but it's a bit tech-heavy. APCO Project 25 - The RadioReference Wiki

I found 4 more sites east of town towards Markstay but I've lost the slip of paper I wrote them down on.

Also heard a female voice on talkgroup 400 testing.

WOW! Thanks for that info Jay911. I created a P25 system with all the control channels that I shared with you all. When my scanner scans this system, I see the label DAT (data) at the bottom of the screen but doesn't stop. The system is still in its testing phase. so my question is : is it normal that the system displays DAT when scaning it? I haven't heard any testing going on but Mike did, so I better have my 396T parked on that system!

Yes that is normal. Basically it indicates that it is hearing the control channel ok.

Added two more sites after working in the Sudbury area on Thursday.

Couldn't find the elusive Site 3 and didn't have time to run Pro96Com to see if it shows up as a neighbour of any of the other sites.

I posted a second frequency to site 4 : 868.5000