Terestial TV Reception

crazy_19 · Sep 13, 2014

Hi guys/gales;

Not sure if this is the right place for this post but, here it goes. Normally I can easily pick up over-the-air TV channels from both South Bend and Chicago but lately I haven't been able to get squat. I have tried re-aiming the antenna, different receivers, cables, etc. I know there is an bit of a space storm going on and was wondering if this could be affecting my reception?

bpckty1 · Sep 13, 2014

There's a solar storm going on right now. News reports showed the Northern Lights in the upper parts of the US. Two threads on RR:

http://forums.radioreference.com/off-topic-wireless/298150-solar-storm-hit-9-12-a.html

http://forums.radioreference.com/skip-tropospheric-ducting-forum/298214-solar-storm.html

Ed_Seedhouse · Sep 14, 2014

bpckty1 said:
There's a solar storm going on right now. News reports showed the Northern Lights in the upper parts of the US. Two threads on RR:

http://forums.radioreference.com/off-topic-wireless/298150-solar-storm-hit-9-12-a.html

http://forums.radioreference.com/skip-tropospheric-ducting-forum/298214-solar-storm.html

The magnetic storm lasted less than a day. It seems likely given the way he phrased things that his problems lasted longer than that.

Also magnetic storms rarely disrupt VHF communications much if at all. This one put lots of noise on the HF bands but at my location VHF was unaffected.

barefootdipole · Sep 14, 2014

look at your local/regional weather maps before looking at solar maps in trying to figure out changes in OTA tv reception......

look for tropo and temp inversions, especially over or near water paths....or look for the LACK of temp inversions that you unknowlingly were relying upon near water paths !

look for fog and rain or fronts passing

all the above can kill signals.....plus a hundred other things....

that ONE branch may have moved/grown out to block your signal path too !

good luck....

barefootdipole · Sep 14, 2014

funny, i had just been thinking this week that the ONE thing missing on RR Forums is a OTA TV FORUM ! <hint> <hint> for lots of folks to discuss tv antennas/amps...DTV reception problems/hints....etc....even TV DX....every other form of the hobby is covered except OTA TV....

gmclam · Sep 15, 2014

barefootdipole said:
funny, i had just been thinking this week that the ONE thing missing on RR Forums is a OTA TV FORUM ! <hint> <hint> for lots of folks to discuss tv antennas/amps...DTV reception problems/hints....etc....even TV DX....every other form of the hobby is covered except OTA TV....

I think that is a great idea. There are other sites out there for this though. One I like just for basic information (distance and compass direction) is antennaweb.org.

I think the most 'confusing' thing these days for the average joe when it comes to OTA TV is knowing the physical channel being used. For example in my area we have channel 3 on UHF (channel 35) and channel 6 on channel 9. If someone's antenna is UHF only (many so-called digital antennas are UHF only), they may not be able to get some local stations.

ka3jjz · Sep 15, 2014

Probably one of the best known clubs that is devoted to the subject of TV (and FM) DXing is the Worldwide TV FM DX Association (WTFDA). They're even on Facebook. It's a well established club, having been around now since 68. They've even got some SDR news, and they host an annual convention.

If you're interested in this side of DXing, it's one you really should check out. Here's the link

Worldwide TV-FM DX Association

Mike

nd5y · Sep 15, 2014

barefootdipole said:
funny, i had just been thinking this week that the ONE thing missing on RR Forums is a OTA TV FORUM ! <hint> <hint> for lots of folks to discuss tv antennas/amps...DTV reception problems/hints....etc....even TV DX....every other form of the hobby is covered except OTA TV....

Check this out. Over-The-Air (OTA) Digital Television - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums

bee · Sep 15, 2014

I know this is off topic but------Me and my Parents lived in South Bend 55 years ago, on Western Avenue. Great memories. Franklin Elementry School. Oh My!

barefootdipole · Sep 16, 2014

gmclam said:
I think that is a great idea. There are other sites out there for this though. One I like just for basic information (distance and compass direction) is antennaweb.org.

I think the most 'confusing' thing these days for the average joe when it comes to OTA TV is knowing the physical channel being used. For example in my area we have channel 3 on UHF (channel 35) and channel 6 on channel 9. If someone's antenna is UHF only (many so-called digital antennas are UHF only), they may not be able to get some local stations.

tv fool website does an excellent job of mapping ur tv stations with a TON of info, like distance, dB, virtual and rf channel numbers, etc etc....well worth a look....you can rpint out ur customized map centered on ur street address with 360 degree compass of tv reception signal strength....

barefootdipole · Sep 16, 2014

nd5y said:
Check this out. Over-The-Air (OTA) Digital Television - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums

thanks

AVS FORUMS has a great subsection on local/regional HDTV reception info from users....broken down into DMA markets.....it's a good thread to find out what other locals are experiencing.....

barefootdipole · Sep 16, 2014

ka3jjz said:
Probably one of the best known clubs that is devoted to the subject of TV (and FM) DXing is the Worldwide TV FM DX Association (WTFDA). They're even on Facebook. It's a well established club, having been around now since 68. They've even got some SDR news, and they host an annual convention.

If you're interested in this side of DXing, it's one you really should check out. Here's the link

Worldwide TV-FM DX Association

Mike

thanks mike...

used to be a member from back around 68 i think,same time i joined NASWA....haven't checked them out online....

i was just thinking about all the many various aspects of TV reception/equipment---not just DX---but physically OTA TV and how it seems to have fallen thru the cracks on RR......i think of RR as my "GO-TO" place for info for every other subculture of our varied interests....

sorta like this thread obviously had no place to go, and got started in "General Scanning" (scanning???)because there was no TV Forum.....that's all i was saying.....it just seemed a rare oversight on RR's part that could benefit from correction.

great job, by the way, mike...always specific and thorough info...thanks !

barefootdipole · Sep 16, 2014

ka3jjz said:
Probably one of the best known clubs that is devoted to the subject of TV (and FM) DXing is the Worldwide TV FM DX Association (WTFDA). They're even on Facebook. It's a well established club, having been around now since 68. They've even got some SDR news, and they host an annual convention.

If you're interested in this side of DXing, it's one you really should check out. Here's the link

Worldwide TV-FM DX Association

Mike

WOW...great website mike...thanks ! just on their homepage they had something i had been looking for, a list of settop boxes and dtv's that did manual tuning ! great site.....tnx agn....

DPD1 · Sep 17, 2014

gmclam said:
I think the most 'confusing' thing these days for the average joe when it comes to OTA TV is knowing the physical channel being used.

You'd maybe be surprised how few people even know OTA still exists. Between younger generations simply growing up with pay TV, and all the bad info regarding digital... many people literally don't know it's possible. Most people I've mentioned it to the last couple years, just looked at me funny. I myself was shocked to find my area now has about 60 channels, on nothing more than a table top antenna. I hope this renaissance continues.

gmclam · Sep 18, 2014

DPD1 said:
You'd maybe be surprised how few people even know OTA still exists. Between younger generations simply growing up with pay TV, and all the bad info regarding digital... many people literally don't know it's possible. Most people I've mentioned it to the last couple years, just looked at me funny. I myself was shocked to find my area now has about 60 channels, on nothing more than a table top antenna. I hope this renaissance continues.

"Funny" that you mention this. My daughter (who is ~30) just recently asked for my OTA TV recipe. I guess her cable bill just went up again. I get those ~60 channels, all for free, and record everything through a DVR before watching. Sometimes I feel guilty getting all the programming and never watching any commercials .. or not.

DPD1 · Sep 18, 2014

Yeah, I regret the days that we ever took this 'pay TV' path. On-air is by far the most economical and practical means of providing TV. It's funny that we have all this alleged technology, yet the picture quality has actually gone down over-all. I think the big networks originally thought they would fight off all the up and coming new channels, but... it didn't work. Rather than fight them, they should have offered them time on their broadcast infrastructure, and everybody would have made money. Oh well.

reconrider8 · Sep 18, 2014

kinda on topic kinda off topic but is there any sdr apps to receive ota stuff? i remember reading about it a while back but never got anything of it

gmclam · Sep 18, 2014

DPD1 said:
Yeah, I regret the days that we ever took this 'pay TV' path. On-air is by far the most economical and practical means of providing TV. It's funny that we have all this alleged technology, yet the picture quality has actually gone down over-all. I think the big networks originally thought they would fight off all the up and coming new channels, but... it didn't work. Rather than fight them, they should have offered them time on their broadcast infrastructure, and everybody would have made money. Oh well.

Multiple issues going on here....

Way back when many broadcasters were looking for a way to compete with cable's "500 channels". They came up with a way to multicast multiple programs on a single 6MHz channel. But to sell it to Congress, they called in High Definition. Some broadcasters could switch to HD, some more program streams, some attempt both.

But the real problem is that cable and broadcasters are now mostly the same. Viacom owns CBS, Comcast NBC, Disney/etc ABC/ESPN. To offer their most money making channels over-the-air is contradictory to their bottom line goals. Yeah I feel they could do it at a reasonable fee, but that would not go well with the providers. And that all leads down the road to "a-la-carte", which the industry is trying to avoid 'til their death.

DPD1 · Sep 19, 2014

Yeah, at this point, the big networks have just bought themselves into profit by monopoly.

There was a company based in Utah a number of years ago, that started offering cable channels through an on-air broadcast service. I can't remember the name. They said they were going to expand into other areas. I put myself on the list to be notified, but... it wasn't to be. I believe they had difficulty securing local broadcasters, for a deal to use their equipment. I think they even started some testing on freqs they had licensed in L.A. and other cities. That would have been great though.

gmclam · Sep 20, 2014

Yes there have been a couple of OTA options. One was using channel 55 to provide 8 "cable" channels. The problem in my opinion was that you needed their hand-held receiver.

If my memory serves me correctly the site in Utah was shut down because of legal issues. The few huge companies that make $$ from TV want their piece of the pie. If they don't get it, they'll sue you out of existence.

The heavy-handed attitude in the TV industry is going to force it down a road similar to what happened in music. The only things that might divert the direction include a-la-carte pricing, breakup of the vertical monopolies or something similar to Napster that significantly agitates the present status quo. Good luck on any of these happening any time soon, but they will eventually happen.

Terestial TV Reception

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