LA-RICS Discussion Thread

Status
Not open for further replies.

RadioSquad

Completely Banned for the Greater Good
Banned
Joined
Jan 2, 2015
Messages
53
I wanted to start this new thread and not hijack the main LA-RICS Mater Thread.

As people were speculating months ago about if the birdie beep is going to transfer over to the P25 Phase II TDMA system. Well the answer is absolutely NO at this point. By the way LA FLYER is describing tonight about the testing phase with LASO and LACOFD in the clear this is not a good sign for LASO not hearing the birdie beeps. The reason why years ago that LASO incorporated the beeps is so people would not be able to listen to units in the field on scanner radios. Of course not this is old technology and is not an option on these newer trunking systems.

So if you were hearing LASO dispatch and field units this means that LASO has about a 99 percent chance that they will be fully encrypted. Sorry to break the bad news to everyone. I know this is only speculation since it’s the testing phase but it does not look good. There is no way that LASO is going to allow dispatch and field units in the clear. They are not going backwards at this point moving forward. They will probably follow suit with the way PSEC has setup their Law Enforcement talkgroups and lock them all down. Now with regards to LACOFD these talkgroups will stay in the clear as well as other non law enforcement talkgroups.

If you have seen the trend in the last six months with Law Enforcement agencies joining ICIS then the answer is plastered all over the wall. Encryption is built into those new radios and it will surely be used fulltime.
 

PaulNDaOC

Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2009
Messages
598
Radio Guy, are you referring to the LASD dispatch channel busy tone.

The reason I ask is if it's the busy tone you speak of, it's beginning. had nothing to do with cutting out scanner listeners.

The busy tone got it's beginning back when LASD dispatched on VHF-Low between 39.00 and 40.00 mhz. Back in those days repeated transmissions on this band were only allowed in an emergency(the patch) , not for routine radio traffic, so LASD added the beep to let the field know the channel was already in use.

Up until the FCC began allowing repeaters on VHF-Low CHP was in the same boat at 42
MHZ, minus any busy tone.

The busy tone stuck around with the implementation of the 480 system in the late 80's. Though I worked at SRC (as it was known prior to 1991) I couldn't tell you why dispatch is still not repeated, but I can tell you it does not have anything to do with eavesdropping

Anything confidential gets handled by MDC or phone anyways. In all my years I never heard of any discussion about scanner being a problem. The big problem was/ at least in the past was people using ham radios to interfere with LASD communications. Some of those transmissions were very X-rated.

I don't know if there will be full encryption or not, I do know there is a provision in the specs for the new radio system that a busy tone be part of the package.
 

RadioSquad

Completely Banned for the Greater Good
Banned
Joined
Jan 2, 2015
Messages
53
Thanks for the clarification. I always assumed that the birdie dispatch beep was so people could not listen with consumer grade equipment including scanners and ham radios. Well I guess time will tell on what will happen with locking down their system.
I am just curious why they would provision to incorporate the old dispatch beeps into the state of art P25 TDMA system. In my times of listening to new systems this does not happen on a trunk system. Not sure why they would want to carry on old tradition and not sure if Motorola could even incorporate this old technology and certify it to work properly. Not sure if this would be even best practices to do?


With Homeland Security breathing down people’s necks and cities and counties becoming more paranoid on people listening I would not be surprised that this new system will have some heavy encryption right out of the gate. Thought it would be a good discussion to get prepared to what is to come so it’s no surprise.


Paul: I bet you are able to listen to the current system in OC probably since the old tower placements are able to reach that part of the county. As to the new P25 system those towers are not able to reach OC I guess until more tower placement are built closer to the LA OC border.


Do anybody know or have the spec sheet on where all of the tower placements will be for LA-RICS?
 

LAflyer

Global DB Admin
Moderator
Joined
Mar 4, 2009
Messages
1,827
Location
SoCal
The LA-RICS contract called for 88 LMR radio sites and 232 LTE sites across the county plus additional site on wheels capability

The eventual build likely will be less as some cities have already opted out and denied LA-RICS site access for their proposed sites.
 

RadioSquad

Completely Banned for the Greater Good
Banned
Joined
Jan 2, 2015
Messages
53
The LA-RICS contract called for 88 LMR radio sites and 232 LTE sites across the county plus additional site on wheels capability

The eventual build likely will be less as some cities have already opted out and denied LA-RICS site access for their proposed sites.

Wow!!! That's alot of LMR sites. Well thanks for the info.

Question?

I am right on the fringe of hearing anything for LA-RICS. Are those dispatch talkgroups operating fulltime now or is it just testing here and there during normal weekday business hours?
 

PaulNDaOC

Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2009
Messages
598
The recently expanded PHN site (Puente Hills Nike in the Brea Hills) should eventually be worked into the new system. This site is currently used on Disp 13 and 14 and booms into most of North and Central OC.

I don't know if the busy tone will carry over to the new system whenever it is implemented, but there is one thing most anybody close to the department can tell you is LASD doesn't spend a whole lot of time copying or worrying about what other agencies are doing, they pretty much march to their own beat unless the politics get too hot to handle.
 

Starman918

Member
Joined
Mar 12, 2004
Messages
206
Location
Highland, California
I don't know if the busy tone will carry over to the new system whenever it is implemented, but there is one thing most anybody close to the department can tell you is LASD doesn't spend a whole lot of time copying or worrying about what other agencies are doing, they pretty much march to their own beat unless the politics get too hot to handle.[/QUOTE]

You are so correct, Paul. That is why it took them so long to get actual computers in the radiocars.
 

scottyhetzel

Member
Joined
Nov 3, 2011
Messages
1,409
Location
Palm Springs Area / OrCo
The recently expanded PHN site (Puente Hills Nike in the Brea Hills) should eventually be worked into the new system. This site is currently used on Disp 13 and 14 and booms into most of North and Central OC.

I don't know if the busy tone will carry over to the new system whenever it is implemented, but there is one thing most anybody close to the department can tell you is LASD doesn't spend a whole lot of time copying or worrying about what other agencies are doing, they pretty much march to their own beat unless the politics get too hot to handle.


Hi Paul, it's actually Hacienda hills, on Rio Hondo Police Academy campus...cadets run to that hill during P.T.. It's all about the details...
 

dgower

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Jan 2, 2003
Messages
162
Location
Long Beach, CA
PHN is a different site than the Rio Hondo site.
Rio Hondo currently houses part of the LARICS system that's on the air now. PHN was recently upgraded and has lots more room.
 

RadioSquad

Completely Banned for the Greater Good
Banned
Joined
Jan 2, 2015
Messages
53
I was thinking the same thing when reading that post. Rio Hondo already has a site up working on LA-RICS right now. There are alot of LACOFD fire stations that surround the LA and OC borders and was thinking they will need more sites along these borders
 

PaulNDaOC

Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2009
Messages
598
PHN is on the list of county owned LA_RICS sites.

http://file.lacounty.gov/bos/supdocs/86641.pdf

It's a great site providing coverage to La Mirada, La Habra, Cerritos and East Whittier.

County Fire currently uses it for Blue 13 and LASD simulcasts Disp 13and 14 and the corresponding L-Tac's as well as a receive only site for Disp 6 and 8 to name a few.
 

jrholm

Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2006
Messages
580
Location
Big Bear
Any radio system for LASD will eventually have to reach into Orange, San Diego, San Bernardino, Riverside, and Ventura Counties as we have units that patrol those areas.
 

PaulNDaOC

Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2009
Messages
598
and if LASD retains the Metrolink contract

The Metrolink contract is going nowhere. MTA, Metrolink, and LASD recently agreed to reorganize and combine operations, and will merge into a new division (Transit Policing Division).

TSB and Metrolink had been separate operations, though I think the Watch Commander at TSB acted in the same role for the deputies policing the big trains for pursuits etc..

I hadn't heard that there was any any grumbling from Metrolink, as opposed to MTA which is belly aching all the time. MTA has been griping about response times and units spending time on non-transit related incidents.

LASD needs to find a better way to track response times for other stations that roll on MTA calls, and incorporate it into the data MTA gets since the closest unit regardless of station would also be sent to emergent and most priority calls and demonstrate to MTA that assisting other stations is a two-way street.

The may complain, but MTA is going nowhere too. It would take 500 plus sworn officers to replace LASD, and I can't think of who would want or be able to take that on.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top