YONKERS PD: Moving to 700mhz???

Like the YFD, are they too required to move from UHF 450's to the 700 MHz band??
Everybody else is required to transition to 700mhz at some point???
FYI: Motorola just was approved for a $ 500K YPD radio upgrade.

Also, what are these brief R2D2 noises being transmitted on 453.475??

Many Thanks

Nobody is required to move to 700 MHz.
Yes, anyone in the T-Band (470-520 MHz) is required to move off it, but not necessarily to 700.
(although in reality, 700 is about the only place with available spectrum in some areas).

Edit: I just looked at the DB and Yonkers PD isn't even T-Band.

YPD not required and have not heared about any moves to 700mhz. R2D2 could be encryption they do have it and can use it at times.

The 500k looks to be upgrading old equipment on the radio sites.
Scope: Phase I Communications System Upgrade - a Two Channel Simulcast Astro Conventional System upgrade to replace outdated radio/dispatch equipment at five sites including the main site at Cacace. The other sites to be upgraded are the 1st Precinct, the 2nd Precinct, the 4th Precinct and Public School 5

no mandate to vacate T band as of yet. Most coordinators expect the freeze to be lifted soon as the plan for it, will not come to realization.

radio259 said:

no mandate to vacate T band as of yet. Most coordinators expect the freeze to be lifted soon as the plan for it, will not come to realization.

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There most certainly IS a mandate for public safety licensees in t-band. Passed in Feb of 2012.
http://www.npstc.org/download.jsp?t...TBand_APCO_Presentation_130821.pdf&page=NPSTC

Congress could, of course, reverse course. But as of now, it is the law.

interesting. Amazing how many different articles on this. Do not know which to believe. Here in our area, system upgrades on T band continue along as planned.

getting off topic! YPD not T-band so no need to worry

I was told by a friend of mine who follows this stuff very closely that the major metropolitan areas (NYC\NJ, Boston, Los Angeles) are lobbying their congressional representatives very heavily on this subject. My friend had breakfast with his Congressman some time before the new new year and was told that legislation to repeal the D Block law would likely be filed in the new session of Congress.

Time will tell, but there is an awful lot of money tied up on UHF-T band equipment and no one wants to have to buy new radio systems unless there is grant money to pay for it.

Thunderknight said:

There most certainly IS a mandate for public safety licensees in t-band. Passed in Feb of 2012.
http://www.npstc.org/download.jsp?t...TBand_APCO_Presentation_130821.pdf&page=NPSTC

Congress could, of course, reverse course. But as of now, it is the law.

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Now Yonkers has only one frequency in the T-band and that's the FD, but NYPD that has hundreds in NYC who basically told the FCC to F off, they weren't narrow banding or leaving T-band. To quote the comment by Chief Dodd "What are they going to do take our radio's away". It was a bad law and still is, it's another unfunded mandate just like PTC for the Railroads. Mandate something that uses radio and not fund it or support it with available spectrum. The telco cartels should be the ones going out and buying licenses not public safety, as is the case of many departments buying up old IMTS and paging channels at huge costs like 1 million dollars for a channel!!
There is still the issue of what to do with 40% to 60% of the radio users that are non Public Safety on T-band, and are not covered by this law. Is the FCC going to just cancel or take away licenses to these users? Where would you put them if you take those frequencies away, and if they do so without some relief it would be a first. Just another typical Obama shove it down your throat law which will never stand up to legal challenges.
I have heard the same thing about repealing the law as with others that should have never been enacted by you know who. Actually the right thing is to take the T-band frequencies away from the TV broadcasters and make it a PS only band with users from other services grandfathered as is the case now.
So I wouldn't hold my breath about T-band going away anytime soon. Not unless the Feds want to pay out billions to replace the systems already in place on T-band with 700 that doesn't even have enough bandwidth to cover the change.

Back in the early 1990s, when the big push was on in this area to move public safety to 800 trunking, I said that it would make far more sense to reserved the frequencies below 512Mhz or so for public safety use. Move the commercial users off of VHF and UHF to 800 Mhz where the coverage issues would be far less of a problem.

Of course no one took me seriously then, but I still think it's a good idea.

radioman2001 said:

Actually the right thing is to take the T-band frequencies away from the TV broadcasters and make it a PS only band with users from other services grandfathered as is the case now.
So I wouldn't hold my breath about T-band going away anytime soon. Not unless the Feds want to pay out billions to replace the systems already in place on T-band with 700 that doesn't even have enough bandwidth to cover the change.

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yonkers police

live in yonkers i been listing to yonkers police for years there never going to change anything any more theybought a new digital system that cost big money to keep the same freq that they had for years

radioman2001 said:

Now Yonkers has only one frequency in the T-band and that's the FD, but NYPD that has hundreds in NYC who basically told the FCC to F off, they weren't narrow banding or leaving T-band.

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One of the reasons why the NYPD gave for not narrowbanding was that the narrowbanding itself would cost the city millions, and that they would have to move to 700 in x-number of years anyway and buy all new equipment. I also understand that the city's 700 mhz license has been approved and they are testing on them now.

To quote the comment by Chief Dodd "What are they going to do take our radio's away".

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True...probably not.

But what they CAN do is issues fines to the departments still on the "old" frequency until they get off of it. Don't think so? Ask some people who worked in the FDNY during the rip-roaring 1970s, when the radio never stopped. As bad...and well-publicized...the fire duty was then, the FCC issued fines of some appreciable amounts to the FDNY for not announcing the call-signs and time periodically. Initially, the dispatchers thought it was a joke, but the bosses' enforcement of it was not. The dispatchers made the call signs part of the individual "personalities" on the radio (when the FDNY HAD dispatchers with "personalities"), so they got use to it.

But don't underestimate the power of the Federal Government.....!

New York City has more lawyers than there are Congressmen. All they have to do is send a team down and wear out Congress with that New York City is the number 1 terrorist target in the world and the like. That's how they got the upper T-band to start with. Chief Dodd did say those remarks and it was printed, and If you like I'm sure I can dig it up.
Fining an agency for not ID'ing is not the same as for being forced to vacate a frequency, and just imagine the bad Obama press over that.
NYPD probably will never use the 700mhz system as it is a center based radio system, meaning one or more transmitters located throughout the boroughs. Right now the 470 is a precient based system with the transmitters located within the precient or locally within blocks. Motorola tried to get NYPD to go 800 in the 80's they didn't go for it for a number of reasons. One is the controller could never handle the number of channel request made at any moment on a normal day never mind during an incident like 911, and I know I was there working for mother M. Another is what I just described as having a transmitter/receiver blocks or miles away trying to pick up a 1 or 3 watt portable inside an apartment or basement it will never work.
Also as I have stated before there isn't enough bandwidth in the 700 band to make up for the 42 mhz of T-band that MAY have to be given up.
The battle of the Titans is coming on this one New York City against the Broadcasters.

Folks,lets remember why this all came about. Private businesses and the media were complaining they did not have enough space in the radio spectrum. This "law" was passed before most of the current politicians were in office. It would cost more money to relocate Public Safety to another band than it would to have businesses complain. Also Chuck Schumer,who personally I hate was one of the politicians who voted against the law. Now that he is slated to replace Harry Reid maybe they will tell private businesses to go screw off. Remember folks,private businesses can operate off of cellphones and such, they don't need 2 way radios as where public safety does need 2 way radios.As for the media they have more frequencies than they need and they work in the 450 Mhz band.


Mike
Retired FDNY/EMS
Haz-Tac

Yes, there are plenty of Business users who could use a phone, however to lump them all into that category is ... like ... selling off T-Band There are many user who do need two-way and it is not just Public Safety

I think this thread has gone way off the original topic

mike4164 said:

Folks,lets remember why this all came about. Private businesses and the media were complaining they did not have enough space in the radio spectrum. This "law" was passed before most of the current politicians were in office. It would cost more money to relocate Public Safety to another band than it would to have businesses complain. Also Chuck Schumer,who personally I hate was one of the politicians who voted against the law. Now that he is slated to replace Harry Reid maybe they will tell private businesses to go screw off. Remember folks,private businesses can operate off of cellphones and such, they don't need 2 way radios as where public safety does need 2 way radios.As for the media they have more frequencies than they need and they work in the 450 Mhz band.


Mike
Retired FDNY/EMS
Haz-Tac

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It will be far more effective to lobby their Seantors and Congress Critters than going to DC to try to intimidate the Congress. Since most of the Senators and Congress Critters aren't from New York, they don't much care about New York City lawyers. Get the NY delegation on board, they'll talk to the delegations from CA and MA and NJ.

Trying to intimidate Congress is a fool's errand. Use the process.

radioman2001 said:

New York City has more lawyers than there are Congressmen. All they have to do is send a team down and wear out Congress with that New York City is the number 1 terrorist target in the world and the like. That's how they got the upper T-band to start with. Chief Dodd did say those remarks and it was printed, and If you like I'm sure I can dig it up.

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Maybe the topics off course, but the information does actually have to do a lot with happens to agencies going or not to 700.

Quote"Trying to intimidate Congress is a fool's errand. Quote'

Worked in the past, many times. When you show up at their offices en mass they notice. Just look what happened when NYC terrorist funding was cut, 2 days later reinstated. Don't belittle NYC's power in the U.S. all of corporate America lives and works there or nearby.

I am sure the lobbying is going on now,but a few choice news casts about whats going on does wonders. Why do you think Chucky Smucky Schumer has his news conferences on Sunday's. It's always a slow news day so he is insured his message of the week gets out.

Like the YFD, are they too required to move from UHF 450's to the 700 MHz band??
Everybody else is required to transition to 700mhz at some point???
FYI: Motorola just was approved for a $ 500K YPD radio upgrade.

Also, what are these brief R2D2 noises being transmitted on 453.475??

Many Thanks
Archie: As someone who is disabled I frequently listen to YPD & other agencies on my Motorolas to pass time. I have a more sophisticated version of the Motorola XTS-2500 HT that YPD currently uses. Not sure of what R2D2 noises you are hearing sometimes but I have heard unpleasant digital screeches time to time when two officers "key up" at the same time & "step on eachother". In the last century when they were analog you'd just hear both sides of the communication at once. Not sure if this simple explaination defines what you were hearing but it's my educated guess. Appreciate your comment as well as all the others here. Stay well !!!

Again - NO

UHF = 450-469.9875
T-Band = 470-512

T-Band is the only one (at this time) part of the Move process and there is nothing that even says they have to go to 700, altho they are being suggested to move to 700, if they find 453/460 Freqs or even VHF Go for it

stantech said:

Like the YFD, are they too required to move from UHF 450's to the 700 MHz band??
Everybody else is required to transition to 700mhz at some point???
FYI: Motorola just was approved for a $ 500K YPD radio upgrade.

Also, what are these brief R2D2 noises being transmitted on 453.475??

Many Thanks
Archie: As someone who is disabled I frequently listen to YPD & other agencies on my Motorolas to pass time. I have a more sophisticated version of the Motorola XTS-2500 HT that YPD currently uses. Not sure of what R2D2 noises you are hearing sometimes but I have heard unpleasant digital screeches time to time when two officers "key up" at the same time & "step on eachother". In the last century when they were analog you'd just hear both sides of the communication at once. Not sure if this simple explaination defines what you were hearing but it's my educated guess. Appreciate your comment as well as all the others here. Stay well !!!

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