Prince William County

Chris45 · Apr 21, 2015

It seems that the database for Prince William County (P25) is no longer downloadable for the Pro-106 and other similar scanners.

I do not know if this means if the County is now considered TDMA yet, as I can still receive other services on the Pro-106 except for Fire.

If PWC is not yet TDMA, why would the database support be refused?

Chris

troymail · Apr 21, 2015

Chris45 said:
It seems that the database for Prince William County (P25) is no longer downloadable for the Pro-106 and other similar scanners.

I do not know if this means if the County is now considered TDMA yet, as I can still receive other services on the Pro-106 except for Fire.

If PWC is not yet TDMA, why would the database support be refused?

Chris

What tool/software are you using to download to the PRO-106?

Chris45 · Apr 21, 2015

Using...

The software is Win500 which has worked great, and for that matter it still does. The scanner is a Pro-106.

I have a paid subscription for the database. The thing is the only time I have been shut out is now. everything works fine for the other jurisdictions, and it is only PWC where the download support is denied.

The only conclusions I have is that maybe RR.Com is only supporting a TDMA version of PWC now. On the scanner PWC PD is running fine, but Fire appears dead less an occasional, weak and garbled dispatch.

The message I receive states: THIS SYSTEM ITYPE IS NOT SUPPORTRD BY THE PSR-500.
TRUNKING INFO WILL NOT BE TRANSFERRED, BUT YOU CAN IMPORT IN NON-TRUNKRD CONVENTIONAL MODE. DO UOU WANT TO DO THIS?

Any idea?

troymail · Apr 21, 2015

I suspect Win500 is detecting the Phase 2 setting for the Prince William system and blocking the import since the PRO-106/PSR-500 doesn't do Phase 2. Assuming that's the cases, it's unfortunate this occurs since many systems that are labeled Phase 2 are really Phase 2 compliant/ready but operating as Phase 1. On the other hand, if the system were allowed to be imported, some folks might start to think their radio is broken because they would not hear everything they think they should be hearing.

You could always add/program it manually - even use a little cut 'n paste magic to avoid typing everything in....

Chris45 · Apr 21, 2015

Good Points

I have used my Pro-106 relentlessly because it was the safest bet while driving. It still has a lot of life for the non-TDMA applications. Time to crank up my WS1080. I did a quick load this evening and on the 1080 did receive PWC Fire. Having said that, your logic seems confirmed regarding the download problem.

Hopefully others may find this helpful. It will be a bummer for Volunteer Fire & Rescue folks considering the average cost of the TDMA Unidens and others.

Chris

yank108 · Apr 22, 2015

TDMA is now in effect and I'm picking it up on my Home Patrol 1. What I did notice for the last three nights is major silence for very long extended periods of time.

troymail · Apr 22, 2015

yank108 said:
TDMA is now in effect and I'm picking it up on my Home Patrol 1. What I did notice for the last three nights is major silence for very long extended periods of time.

On your Home Patrol 1 ???

If you're hearing it on the HP-1, it's Phase 1 not Phase 2 (TDMA). A talkgroup will revert to Phase 1 if a non Phase 2 radio switches to that talkgroup.... when they leave the talkgroup, the talkgroup will likely revert to Phase 2 and it will get quiet (on a non Phase 2 scanner).... That's probably the long periods of silence you're noticing.

kb8bmy · Apr 22, 2015

So another words, I have a radio that doesn't work with their system?

IfI want to receive public service, the short answer is I need to get a new radio? And if so, what do I look for in the specifications?

troymail · Apr 22, 2015

kb8bmy said:
So another words, I have a radio that doesn't work with their system?

IfI want to receive public service, the short answer is I need to get a new radio? And if so, what do I look for in the specifications?

P25 Phase 2 capable.

PSR-800
WS-1080
PRO-668
HP-2
BCD436HP
BCD536HP
BCD996P2
BCD325P2

kb8bmy · Apr 22, 2015

Thanks.

yank108 · Apr 24, 2015

Troy, thanks for that information. I will switch to Home Patrol 2 if and when they convert over to Phase 2. Not happy about charging that particular unit with a cable cord vs. regular plug.

troymail · Apr 24, 2015

yank108 said:
Troy, thanks for that information. I will switch to Home Patrol 2 if and when they convert over to Phase 2. Not happy about charging that particular unit with a cable cord vs. regular plug.

I assume you mean USB vs. normal AC plug.... Actually, you have much more flexibility with USB power and you can get a cheap adapter to plug the USB into your AC outlet (or use your PC or an adapter/cig lighter in your vehicle...)

As for as Phase 1 vs. 2 -- if you want to see if and how much Phase 2 is in use for yourself, I recommend grabbing a copy of Pro96Com and look at the system.

Finally - if it's possible, find someone that has a Phase 2 scanner in your area and see how well things work. P25 reception/decode (for Phase 1 or 2) quality ranges widely on the different radios and also can vary depending on where you are as related to the towers/transmitter sites. You may find one model works better for your situation than another.

Chris45 · Apr 25, 2015

So far...

I live in Prince William County. It seems that Phase 2 is still being finalized with the Fire Department.

The police are still being received on the Pro-104 so they are not yet Phase 2.

The Fire Department simulcast for Dispatch is both in Phase 1 and Phase 2. However, the Phase 2 talk groups sound both low power and sometimes intermittent. Not being familiar with TDMA, I do not know what is normal, but I would suspect the talk groups will improve.

beastieboy101 · Apr 27, 2015

I run Pro96Com on this new system daily. Mostly to note any new changes.

I have a PSR-500 & Pro-668.

PWCPD isn't using phase 2 right now at all; neither is the PWCFD.

As of now only the School Buses & School Security are using TDMA Phase 2 exclusively.
4 Different TDMA Voice Channels in use.

851.17500/0
851.17500/1
852.72500/0
852.72500/1

I did hear some radio tech traffic on 3047 last week. They mentioned testing and changing some equipment out at the County HQ at Independent Hill.

This morning I have seen talkgroup 3132 pop up a few times. Don't know what it's used for yet.

Chris45 · Apr 27, 2015

Thats interesting

The RR Database apparently thinks otherwise, having indicated that some TDMA talk groups are already in use. Secondly, the RR Database has pulled it's programing support in the Win500 program for the Prince William P25 System. In addition, when I programmed the WS-1080 for Prince William Fire and Police, the RR Database gave me both the Motorola and P25 Systems for the county. I am using the WS-1080 and Pro-106 to monitor this county at the same time. Dispatch is only Fire talk group heard on the Pro-106, and Police are normal. Talk groups for both County Fire and Police are heard on the WS-1080.
The Fire talk groups, less Dispatch and exhibiting TDMA characteristics.

beastieboy101 · Apr 27, 2015

Is it really that hard for some people to program a system without the import feature?

I have programmed 2 different digital scanners with Win500. Never have used the Import feature.
I have more confidence with what I can program. I started with manually programming a pro-96 for the old motorola smartzone pwc system.

Chris45 · Apr 28, 2015

The point is, that some folks prefer the import feature versus manually programing everything. Also, with limited exception, such as with Whistler scanners, we are paying RR for the service, and all have paid for the programing software. Each to their own. The opposite is likely true that their are fewer folks desiring to go the manual programing way, less small amounts of editing.

beastieboy101 · Apr 28, 2015

I always had a different definition of "manually" programming a scanner.

Before the 800mhz rebanding; my pro-96 would work fine just by typing in the cc's.

That is what I called manually programming before the rebanding started. Now it is virtually impossible to program a scanner without a pc. I feel bad for the people that have mac's since they have very limited support for scanner's compared to pc's.

Chris45 · Apr 28, 2015

Pro-96

I still have my Pro-96 and really enjoyed it. It is a shame that they will not build others with the quality and easier operability of that scanner.

beastieboy101 · May 27, 2015

Noticed something new today monitoring the PWC P25 system with Pro96Com.

The PWC System ID = 4EC & WACN = BEE00
The Fairfax P25 System ID = 3C9 & WACN = BEE00

The PWC P25 system is currently showing 1 Adjacent Site;

Site ID = 101 (T0101); SysID = 3C9; Ch. 00-0841; Freq. 856.26250; Status = Connected, Stale.

I can't receive the Fairfax Co. P25 system from where I am located in far SE PWC; so I can't confirm if the Fairfax system is showing the PWC system as an adjacent site.

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