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cb antenna

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retiredmich

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Question about my cb antenna. When installing my cb antenna on top of my p u, is it safe to put my cb antenna on one side of the roof driver side & my scanner antenna on the passenger side, will there be any interference between the 2 ?
 

mmckenna

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Unlikely if you are running a "legal" or nearly legal CB radio.
Stock CB radios should be putting out 4 watts or less. Being generous and saying a full 4 watts, probably 3 of that makes it to the antenna.
Having a foot or so of separation would probably be plenty. The amount of coupling you'd see with antennas, even spaced that close, would put very little power into the scanner.

Worst thing you might experience is that the scanner would lose reception when you were transmitting.

I'm confident you are OK with that setup.
 
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retiredmich

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Thanks for the info, yes I will be, haven't got my cb as yet but wanted to ask 1st.
 

mmckenna

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Thanks for the info, yes I will be, haven't got my cb as yet but wanted to ask 1st.

If this is a new install, then my recommendation would be to place the CB in the center of the cab roof where it will have the advantage of the better ground plane. Put the scanner antenna out on the edge, it isn't as critical. A good CB antenna properly mounted with a good ground plane will really help it's performance. I used to install Larsen NMO-27 CB antennas on vehicles. Smack center of the cab of a truck or SUV would always result in good performance, low SWR and a professional look. As is often said, I'd rather have a $20 radio and a $100 antenna than a $100 radio and a $20 antenna.
 
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retiredmich

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Thanks for the info on the location for the antenna, it really makes that much of a diff for the location for the antenna ?
 

mmckenna

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Thanks for the info on the location for the antenna, it really makes that much of a diff for the location for the antenna ?

I think it does.
Most antenna designs require a ground plane. Even some of the ones that don't technically require a ground plane will work better WITH one.
1/4 wavelength is generally what is accepted to be a suitable ground plane for an antenna that requires one. On CB, that's about 108 inches all the way around the antenna base if you want it to be truly omnidirectional. Since you won't get 108" in all directions, you should at least attempt to give it as much as you can, hence the center of the roof.

When you shift an antenna off to one side of the available ground plane, you make the radiation pattern favorable opposite the existing ground plane. So, if you shifted your CB antenna off to the left side of the truck, the antennas radiation pattern would be more pronounced to the left. That can be useful in some cases, but for a mobile radio it might be problematic.

Take all this with a grain or two of salt. It is CB and you are looking at 4 watts of power into compromise antennas/ground planes on a service that isn't necessarily favorable to technically adept users. Taking a few steps to improve your CB performance will put you way out in front of the rest of the users. When many are concerned about power output numbers, "swing", modulation, linear amplifiers, peaked and tuned radios, golden screwdriver treatments, etc. you can actually do a whole lot better by focusing on a really good antenna install.

4 watts can be enough to talk around the world with a proper antenna under ideal conditions. Just ask an amateur radio operator who's worked QRP. Put a poor antenna on it and you'll be lucky to get 2 miles.
 
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retiredmich

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Thank you so much for all that info, I really appreciate it, I thought I could just slap the antenna on top of the truck & call it good. Thanks again
 

mmckenna

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Thank you so much for all that info, I really appreciate it, I thought I could just slap the antenna on top of the truck & call it good. Thanks again

You absolutely could, and it would work.
However, it'll work better with a bit of extra effort. Probably noticeably better in some instances.

Were you going to try a magnetic mount or are you going to go permanent mount?
 
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retiredmich

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Well I'm not sure witch way would be better, I like my scanner antenna on top in middle of cab, but not sure where to put the cb antenna now after what you told me about the location of the antenna for the cb, is a stick antenna a better way to go ?
 

mmckenna

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Well I'm not sure witch way would be better, I like my scanner antenna on top in middle of cab, but not sure where to put the cb antenna now after what you told me about the location of the antenna for the cb, is a stick antenna a better way to go ?

By "stick" antennas, are you referring to the fiberglass antennas?

I think you need to ask yourself which radio is the most important to your own personal needs. That antenna should get the best location.

Mounting the scanner antenna on the cab roof should work just fine, doesn't just need to be in the center. Try to avoid mounting it all the way out at the edge, give it some ground plane to work with if you can, but don't get too hung up on it. Getting the antenna up high and in the clear will give you the best performance. The higher it is the better it can "see" the signals. When you hide it down behind the cab, you are blocking what it can "see". Same thing goes for mounting it off the fender, there is going to be some blockage from the cab.

The CB antenna will work in most places and it could be that you wouldn't necessarily notice the differences. Putting any CB antenna directly behind the cab is going to give you issues. The proximity to the metal of the cab is going to detune the antenna. Probably the worst place you can put an antenna on a pickup is directly behind (and shielded by) the cab.

I always had bad luck with the fiberglass stick antennas. They'd work fine for a while, but then it would seem like they were having issues. Checking them with an SWR meter usually indicated that they were way too short. This was likely caused by the fiberglass bending enough to damage the thin wire wound around the fiberglass core. I would usually end up replacing those fiberglass antennas every year for one reason or another.

When I got my amateur license, I started reading more about antennas. I learned about having them high and in the center of the ground plane. I invested in the tools to do permanent NMO mounts. After that point, all my antennas when on the cab roof. I started installing antennas for others, including a lot of CB antennas. I quickly noticed the improvement of putting a CB antenna on the truck roof, up high and centered on the ground plane. The stainless whip stood up to tree branch strikes a whole lot better. Aesthetically it looks better. They lasted longer, too. In fact, once I started mounting the antennas up there with a decent NMO mount, I never had to replace one.

I'll almost always recommend a Larsen NMO-27 CB antenna with a permanent NMO mount. I've installed enough of them over the years that I'm completely sold. never had an issue with them, and never had an issue getting them down to the 1.1:1 SWR.
I've looked at and tried many of the "consumer" grade CB antennas and I won't recommend them. Doesn't matter what others say, when you work with commercial gear you'll notice the difference.

I'd say use a good CB whip on the center of the cab roof. Stick the scanner antenna off to one side. That will give you the best overall performance.

Also, if you go with a standard NMO mount, you can swap antennas around all day long and never have an issue. Nice thing about standardized mounts like this is that you have a huge selection of antennas to pick from. If your interests change down the road and you decide to get into amateur radio, you can easily unscrew the CB or scanner antenna and screw on one that will do the amateur frequencies. Putting an NMO mount or two on the roof will give you a lot of possibilities. Also, you'll know you did it right the first time and won't ever second guess yourself. Sort of built in peace of mind.
 

prcguy

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I think you have the ground plane effect backwards, the best signal will be in the direction of the most ground plane. If the antenna is on the left rear side of the truck the best signal will be off the right front, etc.

I've found if an antenna like a 9ft whip is mounted a foot or so behind the cab on the top of the bed rail the pattern is not too bad, you don't notice much change in signal even if you drive around in a circle.
prcguy

I think it does.
Most antenna designs require a ground plane. Even some of the ones that don't technically require a ground plane will work better WITH one.
1/4 wavelength is generally what is accepted to be a suitable ground plane for an antenna that requires one. On CB, that's about 108 inches all the way around the antenna base if you want it to be truly omnidirectional. Since you won't get 108" in all directions, you should at least attempt to give it as much as you can, hence the center of the roof.

When you shift an antenna off to one side of the available ground plane, you make the radiation pattern favorable opposite the existing ground plane. So, if you shifted your CB antenna off to the left side of the truck, the antennas radiation pattern would be more pronounced to the left. That can be useful in some cases, but for a mobile radio it might be problematic.

Take all this with a grain or two of salt. It is CB and you are looking at 4 watts of power into compromise antennas/ground planes on a service that isn't necessarily favorable to technically adept users. Taking a few steps to improve your CB performance will put you way out in front of the rest of the users. When many are concerned about power output numbers, "swing", modulation, linear amplifiers, peaked and tuned radios, golden screwdriver treatments, etc. you can actually do a whole lot better by focusing on a really good antenna install.

4 watts can be enough to talk around the world with a proper antenna under ideal conditions. Just ask an amateur radio operator who's worked QRP. Put a poor antenna on it and you'll be lucky to get 2 miles.
 

mmckenna

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I think you have the ground plane effect backwards, the best signal will be in the direction of the most ground plane. If the antenna is on the left rear side of the truck the best signal will be off the right front, etc.

I've found if an antenna like a 9ft whip is mounted a foot or so behind the cab on the top of the bed rail the pattern is not too bad, you don't notice much change in signal even if you drive around in a circle.
prcguy

You could be right. I'm pretty sure it goes opposite the ground plane, since it acts like a reflector, but I've been wrong before (just ask my wife).

A 102" whip behind the cab will have most of the antenna above the cab, so the shielding isn't noticed as much. If you are using a shorter antenna, it becomes a bit more pronounced.

When I said "I almost always recommend the NMO-27", the exception to that was the 102" whip. Hard to beat a full 1/4 wave on a mobile. Kind of hard to do on a truck cab roof, though. They work well off the bed rails
 
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retiredmich

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Gentle men thanks for all the heads up on this I greatly appreciate all the info, will keep all this in mind when I get ready for my cb & antenna, thanks again.
 

prcguy

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Antenna radiation pattern around close obstacles is more of a frequency dependent thing and not the physical size of the antenna. A 9ft whip and 2ft whip mounted in the same place behind the cab of a pickup truck would have similar radiation pattern distortion.

Go from a full size 1/4 wave antenna at 27MHz to 146Mhz where the cab is now much larger in wavelengths and then you will see more blockage from the cab, etc.
prcguy

You could be right. I'm pretty sure it goes opposite the ground plane, since it acts like a reflector, but I've been wrong before (just ask my wife).

A 102" whip behind the cab will have most of the antenna above the cab, so the shielding isn't noticed as much. If you are using a shorter antenna, it becomes a bit more pronounced.

When I said "I almost always recommend the NMO-27", the exception to that was the 102" whip. Hard to beat a full 1/4 wave on a mobile. Kind of hard to do on a truck cab roof, though. They work well off the bed rails
 
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retiredmich

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3 piece antenna for cb

will this antenna work with a CB ? if so how do you set the SWR's being this antenna is a 3 piece, don't wont to spend a lot of $$$ on a antenna.This antenna is being used for my PRO 106 & it works great. Thanks in advanced .
 
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madrabbitt

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Simple answer, no.

Complicated answer, No, that is probably a multi-band scanner antenna and will *likely not have usable performance on 27 mhz.

As far as tuning, in theory, tuning lengthens and shortens the antenna. You could adjust one or all of the sections until the SWR gets close to the ideal 1:1.
 

KC4RAF

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Antenna, antenna, antenna.

Use the proper antenna for what it's designed for! As posted, you could damage your CB; or at the least, not hear or transmit worth a darn. Spend some dollars for a GOOD CB antenna. You can take a crappy CB transceiver and connect it to a great antenna and you'll be happy.
 

Clubguy

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So are you all in agreement that a Larsen NMO-27 mount with antenna on your roof is better than a Firestick FS on the side of your vehicle or better than a magnet mounted Wilson Lil Wil antenna?
 
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