Say hypothetically speaking you have a radio or repeater that is powered directly off deep cycle batteries. What would be the best type of battery charger to limit or eliminate the electrical noise usually/often times associated with charging systems?
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Best Battery Charger
- Thread starter BlueDevil
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mmckenna
I ♥ Ø
A charger specifically designed for that task. Any charger/power supply designed for communications use should be just fine. The batteries will act like big filtering capacitors anyway.
Switching or transformer designs, doesn't matter. I've run both.
If you are going to have batteries sitting on "float" charge like this 24x7, then you need to make sure it has a couple of things to do it right:
-accurate voltage control. The batteries should have specifications for a "float voltage" range. You really want to keep the voltage in spec to keep the battery fully charged and to avoid outgassing or overheating.
-temperature compensation. As the battery temperature changes, so does the ideal float voltage value. Usually these systems will have a temperature probe that gets mounted on the battery. If the battery is getting warm/hot, it'll throttle back the charge voltage. If it's cold, it will increase it slightly.
-Low voltage disconnect. This is a circuit that will watch the battery buss voltage. When the battery reaches a voltage specified by the manufacturer, it will disconnect the battery from the system. This will prevent them getting discharged too far and can prevent the repeater from going "wonky" in an under voltage situation.
-Fuses or circuit breakers as appropriate.
One good option is to ask the battery manufacturer about their recommendations.
I work on many large DC power systems at work and I've been trained by a few different manufacturers on this stuff. Our current (no pun intended) system of choice is the Alpha Technologies "Cordex" line. They don't make a 12 volt version of this as it's mainly designed for 24volt Cellular, -48 volt telecom or 135vdc utility switching systems.
Check into NewMar as an option. They make systems that will cover these requirements. We've used a few of their 12 volt systems for a few of our radio sites. A bit big and bulky, but they've done well over many years.
Switching or transformer designs, doesn't matter. I've run both.
If you are going to have batteries sitting on "float" charge like this 24x7, then you need to make sure it has a couple of things to do it right:
-accurate voltage control. The batteries should have specifications for a "float voltage" range. You really want to keep the voltage in spec to keep the battery fully charged and to avoid outgassing or overheating.
-temperature compensation. As the battery temperature changes, so does the ideal float voltage value. Usually these systems will have a temperature probe that gets mounted on the battery. If the battery is getting warm/hot, it'll throttle back the charge voltage. If it's cold, it will increase it slightly.
-Low voltage disconnect. This is a circuit that will watch the battery buss voltage. When the battery reaches a voltage specified by the manufacturer, it will disconnect the battery from the system. This will prevent them getting discharged too far and can prevent the repeater from going "wonky" in an under voltage situation.
-Fuses or circuit breakers as appropriate.
One good option is to ask the battery manufacturer about their recommendations.
I work on many large DC power systems at work and I've been trained by a few different manufacturers on this stuff. Our current (no pun intended) system of choice is the Alpha Technologies "Cordex" line. They don't make a 12 volt version of this as it's mainly designed for 24volt Cellular, -48 volt telecom or 135vdc utility switching systems.
Check into NewMar as an option. They make systems that will cover these requirements. We've used a few of their 12 volt systems for a few of our radio sites. A bit big and bulky, but they've done well over many years.
K3EP
Member
We use the Xantrex Truecharge 40 at our repeater sites. We have two of them and they have been running for 24 years. mmckenna is correct on getting a charger that maintains them correctly.
Here's the newer model:
Truecharge Battery Charger | Truecharge2 20A, 40A, 60A | Xantrex
We have the older, taller yellow model that can be found on a google search.
I have the older version of the Truecharge 20 powering the batteries for my shack.
Here's the newer model:
Truecharge Battery Charger | Truecharge2 20A, 40A, 60A | Xantrex
We have the older, taller yellow model that can be found on a google search.
I have the older version of the Truecharge 20 powering the batteries for my shack.
prcguy
Member
I've seen lots of people make the mistake of attaching a charger to batteries that are always powering equipment and unless the charger is designed for backup battery use it will usually cook the batteries over time.
If you don't have a specific power supply/charger made for the purpose you can use a high current relay with 120v coil as a backup switch. When the relay is energized from the same circuit that powers the charger and power supply it routes the power supply to the repeater, When AC power fails the relay switches in the battery bank which has been isolated and charging in the background.
You still need a high quality charger like the Xantrex or Newmar mentioned above to keep the batteries in good condition.
prcguy
If you don't have a specific power supply/charger made for the purpose you can use a high current relay with 120v coil as a backup switch. When the relay is energized from the same circuit that powers the charger and power supply it routes the power supply to the repeater, When AC power fails the relay switches in the battery bank which has been isolated and charging in the background.
You still need a high quality charger like the Xantrex or Newmar mentioned above to keep the batteries in good condition.
prcguy
mmckenna
I ♥ Ø
That Xantrex looks like a decent unit.
Here's how I design our power systems:
Repeater maximum current draw + Battery recharge current + "N+1" + reasonable overhead for future needs.
Ideally you'd have enough rectified AC power available to run your repeater just off AC. That way you are not constantly dipping into your batteries.
--and--
You need to have enough additional current capacity to recharge your batteries after an extended power outage. Often battery manufacturers will provide a spec for "capacity / 20 hours". This is the amount of current you need to recharge your battery plant from a complete discharge to fully charged in 20 hours. The time to full recharge can be adjusted based off your needs.
--and--
Reasonable accommodations for future growth. Often this can be covered in the excess capacity of the system. Sometimes you'd want to add additional capacity to reduce recharge time on the batteries, cover future equipment or additional site tenants.
--and--
"N+1". All my systems have this N + 1 built in. That way if a rectifier module fails, you can absorb that failure into the system and fix it later. Makes those late night failures something you can put off until the morning.
One thing I've had to start doing at all our sites is to add additional capacity to run an inverter. As more and more radio system are either IP enabled or use IP as a management interface, you need to consider providing power to a router/network switch on site. Most networking equipment won't handle 12 volts DC. Most of the higher end stuff will handle 24 to 48 volts DC. In many of our 12 volt sites, we just install a rack mount pure sine wave 12vdc - 120vac inverter to run the network gear.
I've used these at some of our smaller sites:
12V, 24V or 48V DC | 11-40 amps | Built-In Battery Back-Up | Integrated Power Systems
Just remove the internal battery and hook up your own to the rear power pole connection.
If your site is big enough:
DC Power Systems | 12V, 24V or 48V DC | 150 watts - 14 kilowatts
--or--
12V, 24V, and 48V DC | Rackmount DC Power Systems | Fully Engineered and Integrated by Newmar
If you do go with one of these larger systems, make sure you hook up the remote alarms or get an Ethernet interface. Being able to remotely monitor/control these systems is really handy.
Here's how I design our power systems:
Repeater maximum current draw + Battery recharge current + "N+1" + reasonable overhead for future needs.
Ideally you'd have enough rectified AC power available to run your repeater just off AC. That way you are not constantly dipping into your batteries.
--and--
You need to have enough additional current capacity to recharge your batteries after an extended power outage. Often battery manufacturers will provide a spec for "capacity / 20 hours". This is the amount of current you need to recharge your battery plant from a complete discharge to fully charged in 20 hours. The time to full recharge can be adjusted based off your needs.
--and--
Reasonable accommodations for future growth. Often this can be covered in the excess capacity of the system. Sometimes you'd want to add additional capacity to reduce recharge time on the batteries, cover future equipment or additional site tenants.
--and--
"N+1". All my systems have this N + 1 built in. That way if a rectifier module fails, you can absorb that failure into the system and fix it later. Makes those late night failures something you can put off until the morning.
One thing I've had to start doing at all our sites is to add additional capacity to run an inverter. As more and more radio system are either IP enabled or use IP as a management interface, you need to consider providing power to a router/network switch on site. Most networking equipment won't handle 12 volts DC. Most of the higher end stuff will handle 24 to 48 volts DC. In many of our 12 volt sites, we just install a rack mount pure sine wave 12vdc - 120vac inverter to run the network gear.
I've used these at some of our smaller sites:
12V, 24V or 48V DC | 11-40 amps | Built-In Battery Back-Up | Integrated Power Systems
Just remove the internal battery and hook up your own to the rear power pole connection.
If your site is big enough:
DC Power Systems | 12V, 24V or 48V DC | 150 watts - 14 kilowatts
--or--
12V, 24V, and 48V DC | Rackmount DC Power Systems | Fully Engineered and Integrated by Newmar
If you do go with one of these larger systems, make sure you hook up the remote alarms or get an Ethernet interface. Being able to remotely monitor/control these systems is really handy.
Thanks for all the great advise! I am working on a few different projects including building a portable repeater for use on wildland fires where it may need to be deployed quickly and designed to be self contained and operable for a few days before having to worry about charging it or changing batteries.
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