Frequency Range Question...

Hi. Trying to find an answer all over the internet, but no success so far.

Someone I know is using a Motorola SL300. The frequency they are using, as listed on the FCC website, is 000468.51250000. I know that the first three zeros and the last four don't count. So the frequency is 468.5125. So far, so good.

I have a Baofeng UV-5R5 and would like to tune in to that frequency. However, my Baofeng only has three digits behind the dot and I obviously need 4! So how come they have 4 digits, and I only have 3 behind the dot?

I tired 468.512 but I cannot hear them, nor can they hear me. However,I am pickup "something" up. It sounds like my radio wants to translate, decode or whatever it is called, the transmission, but it cant?!

thanks,

G

Thread moved to Budget and Entry Level Transceivers forum as the Baofeng isn't an amateur radio product.

Never mind... just saw the, "Thank you for posting! Your post will not be visible until a moderator has approved it for posting." comment. That explains everything. Sorry about that...

G

MikeOxlong said:

Thread moved to Budget and Entry Level Transceivers forum as the Baofeng isn't an amateur radio product.

Click to expand...

I now replied twice using TapaTalk, but my posts keep not showing up. So let me try it from a pc.

How can you say that the Baofeng is not an amateur radio? I thought it is the features that define the term amateur radio and not the price???

thanks,

KMD

Assuming you have a license to transmit on that frequency, you might want to check how you have the steps set up in the Baofeng. I am not certain if this radio is set for narrow band. If so the step would get the right frequency. But have to be licensed to transmit.

robertmac said:

Assuming you have a license to transmit on that frequency, you might want to check how you have the steps set up in the Baofeng. I am not certain if this radio is set for narrow band. If so the step would get the right frequency. But have to be licensed to transmit.

Click to expand...

Thanks for your reply. I am not planning on transmitting anything. Having said that. I found the settings for the "Steps", but I have no idea how to find out if the radio is set for narrow band?! What does that mean and how can I tell? I am sure there is a "short" term for narrow band in the radios settings... but what it is?

thanks,

Kmd

kmd1984 said:

How can you say that the Baofeng is not an amateur radio? I thought it is the features that define the term amateur radio and not the price???

Click to expand...

Price and features really have nothing to do with it.

Baofeng radios are marketed as commercial radios, not amateur radios therefore they belong in the Budget and Entry Level Transceivers forum.

You said, "They can't hear me". That would entice us to believe that you transmitted on that frequency.

468.xxx MHZ is not an Amateur frequency. That's smack in the middle of public service and business. I'd be real careful, if I were you.

This is just another reason why I think those BaoJunk radios should be banned. People buy them for 14 dollars at Amazon, with ZERO understanding of radio spectrum, and start randomly transmitting heaven knows where.

To answer your question, if the frequency has 4 digits after the decimal, it's a narrow-band frequency. If your radio is not narrow-banded, you'll never tune it in.

It's not "trying to decode something". It's just off frequency by .5 KHZ. You should probably try to get a basic understanding of radio before you start firing modulated signals into the ionosphere.

Without at least 1 of numerous possible licenses, you are allowed to transmit ONLY on the following frequencies:

40 CB Channels (around 27 MHZ)

5 MURS Channels (around 151.xxx and 154.xxx MHZ)

7 or 14 FRS Channels (around 467.xxx MHZ)

2 to 5 Marine Band Channels (around 156.xx MHZ, under VERY specific rules)

All of these will require you to know what exact frequencies, allowable power output, antenna limitations, rules for transmitting, etc., etc.

Your BaoFang is not approved for ANY of these, by the way.



Delta

MikeOxlong said:

Price and features really have nothing to do with it.

Baofeng radios are marketed as commercial radios, not amateur radios therefore they belong in the Budget and Entry Level Transceivers forum.

Click to expand...

I see... thanks.

Seven-Delta-FortyOne said:

You said, "They can't hear me". That would entice us to believe that you transmitted on that frequency.

468.xxx MHZ is not an Amateur frequency. That's smack in the middle of public service and business. I'd be real careful, if I were you.

This is just another reason why I think those BaoJunk radios should be banned. People buy them for 14 dollars at Amazon, with ZERO understanding of radio spectrum, and start randomly transmitting heaven knows where.

To answer your question, if the frequency has 4 digits after the decimal, it's a narrow-band frequency. If your radio is not narrow-banded, you'll never tune it in.

It's not "trying to decode something". It's just off frequency by 2.5 MHZ. You should probably try to get a basic understanding of radio before you start firing modulated signals into the ionosphere.

Without at least 1 of numerous possible licenses, you are allowed to transmit ONLY on the following frequencies:

40 CB Channels (around 27 MHZ)

5 MURS Channels (around 151.xxx and 154.xxx MHZ)

7 or 14 FRS Channels (around 467.xxx MHZ)

2 to 5 Marine Band Channels (around 156.xx MHZ, under VERY specific rules)

All of these will require you to know what exact frequencies, allowable power output, antenna limitations, rules for transmitting, etc., etc.

Your BaoFang is not approved for ANY of these, by the way.



Delta

Click to expand...

Delta,

1. Thanks for answering my question!

2. I hang out in a few forums, here and there, so I knew that it was just a matter of time, until someone was "pointing" the finger at me, focusing more on what I am doing "wrong", than actually trying to answer the question, ha ha. Well, you did both! Its all good thought.

3. I can see where you are coming from. To 99% you can tell by the question that something isn't "right". Well, in my case, I thing there is nothing "wrong" with what I am doing. Let me explain. (in no particular order...).

I live in a Hotel. Obviously they are using a lot of radio communications to communicate. I bought some Baofeng radios to take with me on vacation AND because I would like to get my HAM license sooner or later. I guarantee you that where I went, nobody cares about my radios. Actually, there was no one around for hundreds of miles...

Anyhow. Since I got to know everyone that works here very well, we chit chat all the time. One day someone dropped his radio and got all freaked out, thinking it broke. (I believe the radio he was using is in the $800 dollar range...). The radio was OK. I then simply asked why they would spend this much money on a radio and not just buy something "cheap", like my Baofeng radios? The reply was that they doubt they would work as well as the "expensive" ones. So we figured to give it a try.

Here is the part where I could be wrong, but I doubt it:

They "bought" a certain frequency. One that is obviously different, than the ones used by all the other Hotels nearby. I believe that their "license" is in regards to their frequency, and not their radios. In other words, as long as they use THAT frequency, they can use whatever radio they want. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Back to the test... So if I stand there with them, tuning in to 468.512 on my Baofeng radio and press the PPT button, and say, "Hello, Hello", I seriously see nothing wrong with that. Or even illegal. They have a license to use THAT frequency and they are giving me permission to "use" it... That is how I see it, not saying that this is how it is! So please correct me if I am wrong.

Anyway, I learned a lot from your post. I appreciate you pointing out the frequencies I am allowed to use without a license (please tell me that I got that part right, ha ha).

A few more question you might not mind answering:

If I can tune in my Baofeng to one of the frequencies you have listed above, why would my radio not be approved for ANY of those?
Is it illegal to own my Radio. I think not.
I believe only transmitting is illegal without a proper license, but not listening, correct?!

That should be it.

thanks,

Kmd

EDIT: I just looked at the MURS wiki and I can see one thing that would not allow me to use my radio, which is that it has to be limited to 2 watts. But what if I limit my power to 1 watt? Could I then use it on the MURS channels?

Most radios will tune to many frequencies but the radio might not be certified to use some of those frequencies because they don't meet certain technical standards for the type of radio service (ham or amateur radio, business radio, etc.). You don't "buy frequencies" but you are assigned frequencies for your license. Your license determines how much power and where you can operate the radios. You can listen to any frequency but you cannot transmit on any frequency. As mention above there are some frequencies that "licensed by rule" meaning if you follow the rules you are allowed to use the radio (assuming it it certified for use on those frequencies). Otherwise you will need an FCC license to transmit. To transmit on amateur radio frequencies you would need an amateur radio license. There may not be anyone near you but radio waves can travel long distances and you may be interfering with licensed users (police, fire, business, etc.) not near you.
And finally you may not be able to hear or transmit to each other because of other technical issues such as the wrong PL/DPL code, or the wrong repeater input frequency. Dig a little deeper in the FCC web site for more information on licensing.
BB

Well, I'd say you took that particular rag session pretty well. :lol:

To answer a few more of your questions, and keep in mind I don't work in the commercial radio sector:

Yes, if you have a LMR, or "business band", license from the FCC, that licenses both the frequency, and the equipment. For example, the license will dictate how many mobiles, portables, base stations, and repeaters, where they can be located, how much power, and antenna height. All radios used in this service, must be type accepted, (part 90).

So technically, even if they allowed you to use their frequency, you still would be required to use a radio that is type accepted. Are you going to get in trouble for it? No. The people who get in trouble are the ones who deliberately, or accidentally, interfere with other radio communications. Hence my suggestion to be very careful.

As far as using the BAoFang on MURS, it is not Part 95 type accepted, so it would technically be illegal. Will you get caught? Maybe, on this one, because MURS channels 4 and 5 are required to be narrow-banded, and the deviation has to be pretty tight, or you could cause interference outside of your channel. And this is THE workhorse public safety and business band. A lot of licensed users here.

It is certainly not illegal to own that radio, just to use it in a manner it is not approved for. The manufacturer has to meet a certain set of requirements, and then submit it for approval to the FCC, in order to obtain type acceptance. If they did not do that, then it is not type accepted.

Ham gear does not have to be type accepted. We can build and modify to our hearts content. But that is why our licensing is so technical. It's to make sure that we understand radio propagation, (behavior, basically), and where we can and cannot transmit, and how to KEEP our signal within our band limits.

Listening is legal everywhere that I know of in the US, except for a couple of states that prohibit or restrict it in vehicles. I don't live in one those, however.

Hope this helps.




Delta

WA0CBW said:

Most radios will tune to many frequencies but the radio might not be certified to use some of those frequencies because they don't meet certain technical standards for the type of radio service (ham or amateur radio, business radio, etc.). You don't "buy frequencies" but you are assigned frequencies for your license. Your license determines how much power and where you can operate the radios. You can listen to any frequency but you cannot transmit on any frequency. As mention above there are some frequencies that "licensed by rule" meaning if you follow the rules you are allowed to use the radio (assuming it it certified for use on those frequencies). Otherwise you will need an FCC license to transmit. To transmit on amateur radio frequencies you would need an amateur radio license. There may not be anyone near you but radio waves can travel long distances and you may be interfering with licensed users (police, fire, business, etc.) not near you.
And finally you may not be able to hear or transmit to each other because of other technical issues such as the wrong PL/DPL code, or the wrong repeater input frequency. Dig a little deeper in the FCC web site for more information on licensing.
BB

Click to expand...

BB,

Thanks for the input and the "tip" why I might not be able to even hear them!

Seven-Delta-FortyOne said:

Well, I'd say you took that particular rag session pretty well. :lol:

To answer a few more of your questions, and keep in mind I don't work in the commercial radio sector:

Yes, if you have a LMR, or "business band", license from the FCC, that licenses both the frequency, and the equipment. For example, the license will dictate how many mobiles, portables, base stations, and repeaters, where they can be located, how much power, and antenna height. All radios used in this service, must be type accepted, (part 90).

So technically, even if they allowed you to use their frequency, you still would be required to use a radio that is type accepted. Are you going to get in trouble for it? No. The people who get in trouble are the ones who deliberately, or accidentally, interfere with other radio communications. Hence my suggestion to be very careful.

As far as using the BAoFang on MURS, it is not Part 95 type accepted, so it would technically be illegal. Will you get caught? Maybe, on this one, because MURS channels 4 and 5 are required to be narrow-banded, and the deviation has to be pretty tight, or you could cause interference outside of your channel. And this is THE workhorse public safety and business band. A lot of licensed users here.

It is certainly not illegal to own that radio, just to use it in a manner it is not approved for. The manufacturer has to meet a certain set of requirements, and then submit it for approval to the FCC, in order to obtain type acceptance. If they did not do that, then it is not type accepted.

Ham gear does not have to be type accepted. We can build and modify to our hearts content. But that is why our licensing is so technical. It's to make sure that we understand radio propagation, (behavior, basically), and where we can and cannot transmit, and how to KEEP our signal within our band limits.

Listening is legal everywhere that I know of in the US, except for a couple of states that prohibit or restrict it in vehicles. I don't live in one those, however.

Hope this helps.




Delta

Click to expand...

Ha ha, thank you.

Again, thank you so much for all the info. This will make it only easier for me, to one day get my amateur license! I can now relate the information learned to the real word, instead of just trying to remember certain things when using a practice test...

I hope I can figure out how to at least listen to them. It would be a blast!

If the radio has a "step" function, it'll need to be set to "2.5KHZ". Then you should be able to tune it in. If you can't set the steps any lower, you probably out of luck.

Also, I believe I made a mistake on the MURS frequencies. It might be channels 4 and 5 are wide band, and 1-3 are narrow band. I'll have to go check.



Delta

Seven-Delta-FortyOne said:

If the radio has a "step" function, it'll need to be set to "2.5KHZ". Then you should be able to tune it in. If you can't set the steps any lower, you probably out of luck.

Also, I believe I made a mistake on the MURS frequencies. It might be channels 4 and 5 are wide band, and 1-3 are narrow band. I'll have to go check.



Delta

Click to expand...

My radio has a step function and I did set it to "2.5KHZ". It actually just says "2.5K". I can still not hear anything. I receive "something" once in a while, but it just sounds like a machine gun going off...

10-4 on the MURS frequencies...


Thanks,

Kmd

EDIT: I also switched to Narrow band. I now see a little 5 next to my frequency... so the frequency is not the problem anymore. It much be some other setting.

Narrow band doesnt really do anything on Baofeng except they claim on transmit which you stated earlier you wouldn't be doing. Maybe someday it will work

kmd1984 said:

My radio has a step function and I did set it to "2.5KHZ". It actually just says "2.5K". I can still not hear anything. I receive "something" once in a while, but it just sounds like a machine gun going off...

10-4 on the MURS frequencies...


Thanks,

Kmd

EDIT: I also switched to Narrow band. I now see a little 5 next to my frequency... so the frequency is not the problem anymore. It much be some other setting.

Click to expand...

If you hear a "machine gun", they are probably digital.

awasser1 said:

Narrow band doesnt really do anything on Baofeng except they claim on transmit which you stated earlier you wouldn't be doing. Maybe someday it will work

Click to expand...

Interesting and good to know... Thanks.

KevinC said:

If you hear a "machine gun", they are probably digital.

Click to expand...

I just looked at the specs of one of the radios they are using, the Motorola SL300 and it says that is does digital and analog, so you could be on to something. I bet my Baofeng cant do digital?! : (

Thanks,

Kmd

I just checked the manual and I found: R-DCS - Receiver DCS. Is this the "digital" you were talking about? I wonder if I can change this setting and hear them?

thanks,

G

kmd1984 said:

I just checked the manual and I found: R-DCS - Receiver DCS. Is this the "digital" you were talking about? I wonder if I can change this setting and hear them?

thanks,

G

Click to expand...

DCS is Digital Coded Squelch. Has nothing to do with Modulation.

I don't own a BaoFunk, but I seriously doubt they do any kind of Digital. Digital handheld radios run about 800 bucks new.




Delta