I have setup my first mobile radio to use inside my house and now need to install an antenna for it. I am new to all this and not sure where to start. The radio is 50W and dual band of 2m/ 70cm. I have seen dipoles, j-poles, beams and others and not sure what is best? Do I attach these to the side of my house or do I need a mast? If I need a mast, what is recommended? Thanks for the help.
Antenna help/ suggestions
- Thread starter bkspear
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A lot of possibilities... Much of it depends on how your house is set up, how far and what line of sight you have to the repeaters you use, and if you have future plans for more than local repeaters.
Currently I have a magmount dual band antenna on top of a filing cabinet in the corner of my office, corner of the house. I can get three local repeaters without any apparent interference. At my last house I mounted a ten foot pole mast to a 4x4 support on the second story deck with a 5/8 wave ground plane. Both houses were rentals, so options were somewhat limited, but the setups got me satisfactory coverage.
Currently I have a magmount dual band antenna on top of a filing cabinet in the corner of my office, corner of the house. I can get three local repeaters without any apparent interference. At my last house I mounted a ten foot pole mast to a 4x4 support on the second story deck with a 5/8 wave ground plane. Both houses were rentals, so options were somewhat limited, but the setups got me satisfactory coverage.
Thanks for the reply. My house is not a rental if that helps at all. I only have line of sight to a couple repeaters that I know of, but I can hit several repeaters already with my HT and mobile when I am in my truck. What do you mean by future plans? HF? I will possibly want to get on HF, but not anytime soon. Thanks again.
Tripod on the roof or 20-30 foot pole starting at ground level attached to the side of the house are 2 common methods...
mmckenna
I ♥ Ø
Got a chimney? I use a TV antenna strap mount on my chimney with a 10 foot pole. Antenna is mounted on top. Works well for smaller antennas. Mine has been up for about 12 years now with zero issues.
Folks, if you don't have anything to say which will answer the OPs question or help him solve his problem, then please keep your comments to yourselves.
KC4RAF
Member
Of those antennas you mentioned,
one is directional (beam), and the other two are Omni-directional (full 360 degree tx/rx). If you go the beam route you will or should use a strong mast or tower, and a rotator to scan all directions. You can get by without a rotator if you will be tx/rx from one station only, (assuming there is only 1 station in that direction). But being a amateur radio operator, you'll want full coverage, all 360 degrees.
The J-Pole is a pretty rugged antenna, can be built by anyone, or purchased, (eBay has them for ~30 dollars or so). I built one for my 2900R base and have received great reports.
That antenna can be mounted to your house using a "J" mounting bracket.
hth
73s
one is directional (beam), and the other two are Omni-directional (full 360 degree tx/rx). If you go the beam route you will or should use a strong mast or tower, and a rotator to scan all directions. You can get by without a rotator if you will be tx/rx from one station only, (assuming there is only 1 station in that direction). But being a amateur radio operator, you'll want full coverage, all 360 degrees.
The J-Pole is a pretty rugged antenna, can be built by anyone, or purchased, (eBay has them for ~30 dollars or so). I built one for my 2900R base and have received great reports.
That antenna can be mounted to your house using a "J" mounting bracket.
hth
73s
When I first moved into my current house (a single story bungalow), I mounted a dual-band vertical on a 10 foot mast. I mounted it vertically with one end on the ground and the other side fastened to the eve. At 10 feet, it allowed the antenna to clear the peak of the house.
It worked well. I live on the flat prairie and could hit repeaters 20 - 30 miles away using a 5 Watt handheld.
You might consider a 'base' style antenna rather than one designed for mobile use. If it's within your budget something like the Diamond X30a would be a good choice. ~ X30A Dualband Base/Repeater Antenna Diamond® Antenna
It worked well. I live on the flat prairie and could hit repeaters 20 - 30 miles away using a 5 Watt handheld.
You might consider a 'base' style antenna rather than one designed for mobile use. If it's within your budget something like the Diamond X30a would be a good choice. ~ X30A Dualband Base/Repeater Antenna Diamond® Antenna
The rule of thumb is: the higher the better and the more in the clear the better, especially with VHF/UHF communications. For maximum distance (i.e. being able to communicate through the most repeaters), I would install a dual band (2/440) as high as possible. If you have trees close to the house, you're in luck. All my antennas use trees for support. I have a dual band Slim Jim antenna (Google it, it's similar to a J-Pole, but with a lower angle of radiation). Speaking of angle of radiation, get an antenna that suits your needs. If you have a lot of repeaters nearby, a Slim Jim is a good choice (and they're cheap, cheap, cheap to buy - look for "N9TAX Slim Jim". This guy builds and sells very well made Slim Jim antennas that perform VERY well. For a bit higher angle of radiation, i.e. repeaters farther out, but you may miss some closer in ones, go for a J-Pole (again, Google is your friend). The highest angle of radiation is a standard ground plane antenna, which are easy to find at Ham Radio Outlet, AES Ham, Ham City, Giga Parts, etc. (again, Google).
Putting an antenna indoors vs outdoors depends on your situation. Where do you live? Are you in an area rich with nearby repeaters? If so, you might be able to use any type of antenna made for outdoor installation indoors. Here's the test - if you can hit the repeaters you want to hit with your antenna indoors, then do that. However, consider that things change over time. I would suggest opting for an outdoor installation if possible regardless of circumstances. I would also suggest that you get your antenna as high as possible.
I use a Slim Jim at just under 75'. It's easy to get an antenna up that high (if you have trees that high), but it requires 2 people. Buy a good quality sling shot and a decent fishing reel. Mount the sling shot to a short piece of broom handle (mine is 11") at one end. Mount the fishing reel at the other end. Obviously, both the sling shot and fishing reel should be facing the same direction. Put a heavy sinker on the fishing reel. Using the sling shot, shoot the sinker wherever you want the support rope for the antenna (over a sturdy branch, of course). Let the sinker drop to the ground. Cut off the sinker and tie the fishing line to a spool of kite string. One person should hold the handle of the kite string while the other reels in the fishing line (leave at least 12" outside the reel so you don't lose the fishing line inside the reel). Cut the fishing line from the kite string and re-attach the sinker to the fishing line (again, you don't want to lose that line inside the reel). The kite string step IS important. Don't skip it. Fishing line isn't strong enough to reel in the rope itself. The kite string is an interim step to get a stronger line that will be used to bring the rope up into the tree. Tie the kite string to the rope that will be used to support the antenna. Wind the kite string back onto it's spool, bringing the rope up over the limb. You will now have a rope over a limb. Use a rope that is strong enough to handle the weight of the antenna (or antennaS) and that will withstand the elements (i.e. UV resistant, etc.). Again, look at HRO, AESHam, etc. to find appropriate rope. Assemble your antenna, tie it to the rope, connect the coax, waterproof the coax connection, put some strain relief on the coax, then haul it all up in the tree using the free end of the rope. Once you've got the antenna at the maximum height, temporarily tie off the rope to do some testing (i.e. does it work, etc.). Once you're sure everything works correctly, tie the rope permanently. Some people like to use 2 ropes - one to hold up a pulley, then a second one to hold up the antenna. Using a pulley system ensures that you don't have a rope that is constantly rubbing against tree bark which will eventually break the rope. I NEVER use a pulley system. Instead, I replace the rope every few years. This ensures that the rope is always in good condition.
Some people will tell you that the sling shot system doesn't work, isn't accurate enough, etc. As with everything in life, practice makes perfect. I've used the slingshot system for over 10 years. It took some practice, but I can now put the rope exactly where I want it 9 out of 10 times on the first shot. However, sling shot systems are limited. If you have really high trees, or need to shoot the line over multiple trees, you might want / need to consider a pneumatic tennis ball launcher (Pneumatic Antenna Launchers). This will give you far greater distance than a sling shot.
So...lots of options.
73 - David, AG4F
Putting an antenna indoors vs outdoors depends on your situation. Where do you live? Are you in an area rich with nearby repeaters? If so, you might be able to use any type of antenna made for outdoor installation indoors. Here's the test - if you can hit the repeaters you want to hit with your antenna indoors, then do that. However, consider that things change over time. I would suggest opting for an outdoor installation if possible regardless of circumstances. I would also suggest that you get your antenna as high as possible.
I use a Slim Jim at just under 75'. It's easy to get an antenna up that high (if you have trees that high), but it requires 2 people. Buy a good quality sling shot and a decent fishing reel. Mount the sling shot to a short piece of broom handle (mine is 11") at one end. Mount the fishing reel at the other end. Obviously, both the sling shot and fishing reel should be facing the same direction. Put a heavy sinker on the fishing reel. Using the sling shot, shoot the sinker wherever you want the support rope for the antenna (over a sturdy branch, of course). Let the sinker drop to the ground. Cut off the sinker and tie the fishing line to a spool of kite string. One person should hold the handle of the kite string while the other reels in the fishing line (leave at least 12" outside the reel so you don't lose the fishing line inside the reel). Cut the fishing line from the kite string and re-attach the sinker to the fishing line (again, you don't want to lose that line inside the reel). The kite string step IS important. Don't skip it. Fishing line isn't strong enough to reel in the rope itself. The kite string is an interim step to get a stronger line that will be used to bring the rope up into the tree. Tie the kite string to the rope that will be used to support the antenna. Wind the kite string back onto it's spool, bringing the rope up over the limb. You will now have a rope over a limb. Use a rope that is strong enough to handle the weight of the antenna (or antennaS) and that will withstand the elements (i.e. UV resistant, etc.). Again, look at HRO, AESHam, etc. to find appropriate rope. Assemble your antenna, tie it to the rope, connect the coax, waterproof the coax connection, put some strain relief on the coax, then haul it all up in the tree using the free end of the rope. Once you've got the antenna at the maximum height, temporarily tie off the rope to do some testing (i.e. does it work, etc.). Once you're sure everything works correctly, tie the rope permanently. Some people like to use 2 ropes - one to hold up a pulley, then a second one to hold up the antenna. Using a pulley system ensures that you don't have a rope that is constantly rubbing against tree bark which will eventually break the rope. I NEVER use a pulley system. Instead, I replace the rope every few years. This ensures that the rope is always in good condition.
Some people will tell you that the sling shot system doesn't work, isn't accurate enough, etc. As with everything in life, practice makes perfect. I've used the slingshot system for over 10 years. It took some practice, but I can now put the rope exactly where I want it 9 out of 10 times on the first shot. However, sling shot systems are limited. If you have really high trees, or need to shoot the line over multiple trees, you might want / need to consider a pneumatic tennis ball launcher (Pneumatic Antenna Launchers). This will give you far greater distance than a sling shot.
So...lots of options.
73 - David, AG4F
Thanks for all the great info so far. Maybe this will help clarify what I am looking for. I do want a base style antenna and not a mobile antenna. I am pretty sure I want a multi directional antenna to hit more repeaters, rather than a beam with a rotator. I do have a chimney, but I am in a single story house and do not want to mount it inside. Thanks again!
Blackswan73
Active Member
Google Ed Fong antenna. I have one, and I can hit repeaters in Indianapolis, over 50 miles away. My antenna is only 25 feet off the ground. Excellent antenna that won't break the bank.
The Diamond X30A is a colinear ground plane and will exhibit considerable gain over a 1/4 wave ground plane antenna. In fact, there are several 2M/70cm dual-band Diamond base antennas. They are respected, high-performance amateur radio antennas. A full comparison chart is here and you may want to consider one with higher gain that is only slightly longer: the X50A -
Diamond® Antenna ~ Base Station Antennas
Popnokick,
The Diamond X50A sounds great for me!! Back to some of my original questions tho, how would I mount this antenna? Is attaching it to my chimney sufficient? Do I need to build some type of mast? Attach it to my house some other way?? Thanks.
The Diamond X50A sounds great for me!! Back to some of my original questions tho, how would I mount this antenna? Is attaching it to my chimney sufficient? Do I need to build some type of mast? Attach it to my house some other way?? Thanks.
The Diamond "X" series antennas mount on a mast. Even though they are commonly used, chimney mounts are not a good idea. Over time they wear down the chimney and will come loose or damage the chimney. A strong wind storm can cause trouble as well. I prefer eave mounts and a simple 10 foot (or two 10 foot sections.... if you dare). To see pics of what I'm writing about just search for "eave mount antenna bracket" and you'll see scads of them on Amazon and elsewhere. Used to be you could buy them in your local home / hardware store but I've had no luck with that in my last two installations this year. Had to order my eave mount online... and could only find a single 5 foot piece of mast from the local hardware store. Are people not putting up TV antennas anymore? Seems like no one knows anything about how to do it... and do not have the parts necessary. Fortunately everything you need can be ordered online. The other advantage of an eave mount is that it's a straight run for not only the coax, but also the ground conductor down the side of the house. If you're lucky you'll have an outside ground rod near your meter / service entrance and can attach to that ground. BTW - My last eave mount was a Diamond V2000A because I operate 6M as well as 2M / 70cm.
For a lightweight, short antenna like the Diamond X-30, an old satellite dish "J-mount" might work for a quick and simple installation. The small satellite dish people also have under-eave mounts if that suits you better.
KC4RAF
Member
What 'popnokick' posted about
a chimney mount. Not a good idea.
What 'W9BU' posted about the "J-mount". Those work pretty good for small light weight antennas.
a chimney mount. Not a good idea.
What 'W9BU' posted about the "J-mount". Those work pretty good for small light weight antennas.
Chimney antenna mounts are common and cheap. Basically, you have stainless steel straps that you wrap around the chimney and tighten down. There are provisions for mounting a mast on the straps. You put the antenna on the mast.
You can get them most anywhere... Heck, Home Hardware sells them. Just Google "antenna chimney mount".
Also, go to YouTube and enter the same search words. There are dozens of videos showing you how to mount an antenna on your roof. Most will be for TV antennas, but a small dual band base antenna is pretty well equal as far as wind load goes to a regular 'over the air' TV antenna. It can be mounted the same way.
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The reason i dont like chim. Mounts is that your antenna gets covered in soot etc. And if you go high enough to avoid that, the long pipe puts a lot of stress on your brick work...
Diamond x-50 is a great choice !
Diamond x-50 is a great choice !
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