Chasing fire trucks to their destination
- Thread starter lpt423
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. READ what you just typed, and think about it. Listen to a scanner and just stay home. 73, n9zas
scover5555
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I can think of two reasons right away not to do it. One, they have their hands full dealing with the call without some lookie-loos at the scene. Two, If they get called to several arsons and they see common people at these scenes, be ready to get hauled downtown for some thorough questioning.
mmckenna
I ♥ Ø
OK to listen to the scanner.
OK to drive on the streets.
Not OK to interfere. Usually states have laws against interfering.
If you are truly NOT interfering in the eyes of the PD/Fire/EMS, then you are "legally" OK.
But, it's important to realize that you may have one opinion of what interference is, and public safety may have a different one. Usually bystanders are not welcome and are an additional resource drain. Someone has to keep bystanders safely away. Those people could be doing something else.
Here's another point of view:
You or someone you love is experiencing a medical emergency. It's quite possibly the worst day of your life. Everything is going wrong. Maybe a loved one is dying. Maybe a loved one is already died.
And then you realize that bystanders are viewing all this as a form of entertainment.
This falls under the heading of "not cool".
Here's another bit of info:
At major fires, it's not uncommon for someone from the PD or Fire Department to be taking lots of photos. Not necessarily of the fire, but often of the bystanders. Often arsonists will hang around because they enjoy watching the action.
Not saying you are an arsonist, but you will attract a lot of attention if you repeatedly show up at incidents. No, you are not technically doing anything wrong, but you might get questioned. You will be remembered.
It really is best to stay away. While you might think you are not interfering, you may be.
However, if you are -really- interested in a career in public safety, I can understand the desire to see what's going on. Usually not good to become a known person this way. There are better ways of learning the trades.
Just stay safe.
It used to be a real problem in the past when most departments were operating in analog channels and your local news buff, hard up for cash doctors and lawyers, used to to ambulance chase to get potential clients. Now adays you just don't see that as much anymore. Is it legal, maybe ( depending on where you live with laws,etc). Is it ethical, moral or just the right thing to do.. Well in my opinion NO! Also people do think on here it leads to departments who weren't planning on encrypting to more towards that step. Also in my opinion I don't necessarily think that would be a reason, but certainlly can add a building block to the reasoning behind it. Also it never looks good when police, fire ( especially) and EMTs keep seeing you at the scene. You actually might find yourself wrongfully a suspect of fowl play and can end up worse for you then ever.
12dbsinad
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- 1,953
You don't go unnoticed following emergency personal and "responding" to the scene. Trust me. It may seem no harm no foul but in reality you are just adding to the chaos of an emergency scene. Like what was already mentioned, just stay home and enjoy listening. Some day it's possible that you won't be able to, and YOU don't want to be one of the reasons why. For the sake of the hobby, just stay low key and enjoy. That goes to everyone not just you.
Having done scene photography for over 30 years, for training journals, department investigations, and other purposes, I find the answers that have already been provided here to be short sighted and prejudicial.
My first question is why do you do it? Are you hoping to go into public safety and are trying to get a better insight? Are you just drawn to the excitement? Do you have a "thing" for EMS professionals or firefighters? The answer is important to provide a proper answer to you.
Second, please define "interfere." Do you stay back a safe distance, going out of your way to not obstruct in any way, or do you get close enough that you're able to see everything going on, but not so close that the crews are tripping over you or have to change their path to get away from you?
Have you looked into resources in your area? There may be a fire buff group or volunteer canteen that has like minded individuals that can show you the proper way to get involved. If there isn't anything organized, I'm sure there are fire buffs that would be willing to show you the right way to go about this.
I have been a volunteer firefighter (1984-1995,) police dispatcher and special officer (1987-1990) and an EMT (1993-present,) with the last 19 of those at Boston EMS. I have encountered many buffs at scenes over the years while working, and they have generally not been a problem, since they understand scene operations better than the general public. There have been some overzealous types, but I have found that gentle suggestion of where to go so as not to be intrusive works a lot better than screaming or asking the police to deal with them. Do not get discouraged by the answers given above, there are as many people working in public safety that understand the buff mentality and do not discourage it as there are that don't.
The rules to always remember:
You are not an emergency vehicle, you cannot go through red lights, stop signs, pass by crossing over the center line, etc.
Park far enough away that if additional resources are required at the scene, you will not negatively affect their access.
Respect everyone on scene-EVERYONE. Do as your told, stay behind the yellow tape or designated line.
Be seen and not heard. Although you may be intrigued, excited, confused or some other emotion by what you see, do not allow yourself to blurt out what you may be thinking. Someone will invariably take it the wrong way. If you have questions, save them for after the incident, and ask some one-someone in the department that you may have established a relationship, or online-facebook has many public safety groups that can help you understand what you saw.
If you take photos, consider what you're doing. Gore shots serve no purpose. You may be photographing a fire scene where the owner has lost everything and directs anger towards you. Knowing how to diffuse these situations is an art that can only be honed over time, and the bigger part is knowing when to just put your camera away and leave.
NEVER argue with the police when they tell you something and just do it. Over time, you will be known as the person who doesn't cause a problem and may find that you get better access in the future as they get to know you. Yes, you may raise some eyebrows initially, but if you're doing nothing wrong, there's no reason to worry.
This article might help you a bit: http://www.fireengineering.com/articles/fire_life/articles/2016/01/the-buffs-across-the-street.html
If you're doing it for an adrenaline rush or because you're a badge bunny, my advice is to just stop now.
My first question is why do you do it? Are you hoping to go into public safety and are trying to get a better insight? Are you just drawn to the excitement? Do you have a "thing" for EMS professionals or firefighters? The answer is important to provide a proper answer to you.
Second, please define "interfere." Do you stay back a safe distance, going out of your way to not obstruct in any way, or do you get close enough that you're able to see everything going on, but not so close that the crews are tripping over you or have to change their path to get away from you?
Have you looked into resources in your area? There may be a fire buff group or volunteer canteen that has like minded individuals that can show you the proper way to get involved. If there isn't anything organized, I'm sure there are fire buffs that would be willing to show you the right way to go about this.
I have been a volunteer firefighter (1984-1995,) police dispatcher and special officer (1987-1990) and an EMT (1993-present,) with the last 19 of those at Boston EMS. I have encountered many buffs at scenes over the years while working, and they have generally not been a problem, since they understand scene operations better than the general public. There have been some overzealous types, but I have found that gentle suggestion of where to go so as not to be intrusive works a lot better than screaming or asking the police to deal with them. Do not get discouraged by the answers given above, there are as many people working in public safety that understand the buff mentality and do not discourage it as there are that don't.
The rules to always remember:
You are not an emergency vehicle, you cannot go through red lights, stop signs, pass by crossing over the center line, etc.
Park far enough away that if additional resources are required at the scene, you will not negatively affect their access.
Respect everyone on scene-EVERYONE. Do as your told, stay behind the yellow tape or designated line.
Be seen and not heard. Although you may be intrigued, excited, confused or some other emotion by what you see, do not allow yourself to blurt out what you may be thinking. Someone will invariably take it the wrong way. If you have questions, save them for after the incident, and ask some one-someone in the department that you may have established a relationship, or online-facebook has many public safety groups that can help you understand what you saw.
If you take photos, consider what you're doing. Gore shots serve no purpose. You may be photographing a fire scene where the owner has lost everything and directs anger towards you. Knowing how to diffuse these situations is an art that can only be honed over time, and the bigger part is knowing when to just put your camera away and leave.
NEVER argue with the police when they tell you something and just do it. Over time, you will be known as the person who doesn't cause a problem and may find that you get better access in the future as they get to know you. Yes, you may raise some eyebrows initially, but if you're doing nothing wrong, there's no reason to worry.
This article might help you a bit: http://www.fireengineering.com/articles/fire_life/articles/2016/01/the-buffs-across-the-street.html
If you're doing it for an adrenaline rush or because you're a badge bunny, my advice is to just stop now.
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DJ11DLN
Member
It may seem a fun thing to do and going to the scene is probably in itself not illegal. But many times people do this and park in the way, preventing additional apparatus from easily getting to the scene. And then you have the souvenir hunters who want to get too close. Throw in a few who have had a bit to drink and you have a situation bordering on chaos. I've been there and seen it all too often.
If you try to keep up with an emergency vehicle, you are probably going to be violating a number of traffic regulations that are in place for good reasons. You'll endanger yourself and others. If you make it there in one piece, a fire/emergency scene is by definition a dangerous place for people who aren't familiar with how things are done. Again, you put yourself in danger, and because the personnel on scene have plenty to do but will feel compelled to protect you from yourself, you put them in danger as well. And there is always the possibility of police intervention. I can't speak for other states, but here we have an "Interfering with the Duties of a Firefighter" statute...it's pretty broad, and the penalties are severe. You could wind up facing serious time in the can.
Stay home, listen to your scanner, and follow the news feeds. Let the people on the scene do their jobs. You'll hear all about it on the evening news.
If you try to keep up with an emergency vehicle, you are probably going to be violating a number of traffic regulations that are in place for good reasons. You'll endanger yourself and others. If you make it there in one piece, a fire/emergency scene is by definition a dangerous place for people who aren't familiar with how things are done. Again, you put yourself in danger, and because the personnel on scene have plenty to do but will feel compelled to protect you from yourself, you put them in danger as well. And there is always the possibility of police intervention. I can't speak for other states, but here we have an "Interfering with the Duties of a Firefighter" statute...it's pretty broad, and the penalties are severe. You could wind up facing serious time in the can.
Stay home, listen to your scanner, and follow the news feeds. Let the people on the scene do their jobs. You'll hear all about it on the evening news.
W8RMH
Feed Provider Since 2012
In most states it is illegal to follow an emergency vehicle or stop within the block of the incident. It would also be illegal to speed and run red lights/stop signs along with said emergency vehicles.
Now if you heard a working fire and drove normally to the area, parked legally more than a block away from the fire without blocking traffic, etc. that wouldn't be so bad. But "chasing" an emergency vehicle will get you arrested. As a former LEO I made numerous arrests over the years for such activity.
If you are really that interested go take the Fire Department exam.
Now if you heard a working fire and drove normally to the area, parked legally more than a block away from the fire without blocking traffic, etc. that wouldn't be so bad. But "chasing" an emergency vehicle will get you arrested. As a former LEO I made numerous arrests over the years for such activity.
If you are really that interested go take the Fire Department exam.
Amazing that so many public safety officials are against this. There never seems to be opposition when I bring photos to the station, or get someone's photo into a magazine. There doesn't seem to be any opposition to the buffs that staff the canteen with the hot coffee at that 3AM 3 alarm fire in 3 degree weather, the union protest for a fair contract outside a city hall or the LODD funeral.
How do you know he hasn't? How do you know he isn't old enough to take the exam? Instead of giving him direction to seek out a volunteer organization or explorer program, you just tell him to "take the exam" as if he is nothing if he isn't a paid member of a department?
I know if I made this post and saw these replies, it would say that just about everyone in public safety is a jerk who discourages any interest in their profession.
lpt423, send me a PM and I'll give you a free membership to Firepics.net. where there are several thousand firefighters and buffs that have a much more open mind to someone with an interest that will be willing to offer constructive options to get more involved rather than tell you to just stay home and listen to the scanner.
How do you know he hasn't? How do you know he isn't old enough to take the exam? Instead of giving him direction to seek out a volunteer organization or explorer program, you just tell him to "take the exam" as if he is nothing if he isn't a paid member of a department?
I know if I made this post and saw these replies, it would say that just about everyone in public safety is a jerk who discourages any interest in their profession.
lpt423, send me a PM and I'll give you a free membership to Firepics.net. where there are several thousand firefighters and buffs that have a much more open mind to someone with an interest that will be willing to offer constructive options to get more involved rather than tell you to just stay home and listen to the scanner.
phillydjdan
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- Jan 27, 2011
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- 2,075
Citywide, good points. I do scene photography and video and often respond to scenes. As long as you don't break traffic laws and stay out of the way you should be ok. Just use common sense. I know I, for one, always consider where I park. I once parked in a parking lot near a fire and as it went to the 2nd and 3rd alarms about 3 or 4 water supply lines were dropped across the entrance and I ended up being stuck there until they took up those lines. I now always consider the incident growing in size and park so that I don't get blocked in my hoses. While I am always a go-getter and look for a better angle, I always maintain a double collapse zone just in case. These are some of the things people should keep in their minds.
I see all too many "cellphone media" out there. They stand way too close and end up getting yelled at. Don't be that idiot. If you act properly you will not attract undue attention and may even be a help to them. I've been asked a couple of times for my pictures and video by fire marshals. If they ask for it, it's a good idea to supply it to them. They may give you better access next time because they know you will help them.
If you are just doing it to watch, I would not suggest doing so. Like stated, people will start to think you are up to something.
I see all too many "cellphone media" out there. They stand way too close and end up getting yelled at. Don't be that idiot. If you act properly you will not attract undue attention and may even be a help to them. I've been asked a couple of times for my pictures and video by fire marshals. If they ask for it, it's a good idea to supply it to them. They may give you better access next time because they know you will help them.
If you are just doing it to watch, I would not suggest doing so. Like stated, people will start to think you are up to something.
CrabbyMilton
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- Jul 28, 2008
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Everyone has made pretty much the same outstanding points and observations.
If it's a big one, just stay at a safe distance perhaps a nearby parking lot. These folks aren't doing this for our entertainment so once you keep that in perspective, you'll have a better appreciation of LE and Fire fighters and what you can see at a safe distance and under no circumstances, get in the way and follow instructions by police of fire personnel and not be a jerk about it.
If it's a big one, just stay at a safe distance perhaps a nearby parking lot. These folks aren't doing this for our entertainment so once you keep that in perspective, you'll have a better appreciation of LE and Fire fighters and what you can see at a safe distance and under no circumstances, get in the way and follow instructions by police of fire personnel and not be a jerk about it.
ecps92
Member
+1 , still no like button YET 
Ed, perfect response, for the young and newer folks to the hobby (not just Scanning)
We might just be giving advise to the next (36, 44, 45, 95 or even 76 of the world)
Ed, perfect response, for the young and newer folks to the hobby (not just Scanning)
We might just be giving advise to the next (36, 44, 45, 95 or even 76 of the world)
Well, first of all, thank you for all of the replies. I really love hearing everyone's input. I always stay back at a safe distance and even a little bit more. Also, if this is illegal, can someone cite an Ohio/Lucas county/Toledo law regarding the matter. Scene photography is the best. I really love what they are doing. I don't chase police calls to anything, as those can escalate quickly.
bee
Member
Don't do it.
Several months ago, a female victim of a mva rollover was being transported to our trauma center, when it was noticed that the mother of this victim who arrived at the scene of the 10-50 was following the rig about 50' back. The mother apparently heard the call on her husbands scanner, after her daughter just left home, and decided to check... At any rate the medic driving the rig tapped the brakes and even flashed the loading overheads, but she wouldn't take the hint. The mothers vehicle was struck and flipped at the intersection the rig just went thru by a Ups truck coming south. A call was made for responders to that scene while the ambulance with the first victim continued on to the trauma center. Later it was learned that mother sustained severe head injuries and didn't survive, however her daughter was in satifactory condition. It's never a good idea to follow behind responders in traffic. 73, n9zas
73, n9zas
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