neilbell
Member
When programming a P25 Phase I Moto type system can I just enter the control channels or do I enter all the freqs listed in the RR database for that system? System is SF bay area and called EBRCS.
When programming a P25 Phase I Moto type system can I just enter the control channels or do I enter all the freqs listed in the RR database for that system? System is SF bay area and called EBRCS.
This scanner scans faster than uniden because it doesn't get bogged down on a control channel checking the entire system during scanning. I have both radios.
donirving - I use a ICOM R30, even though its NOT a Trunking scanner ...
The scanner checks the control channels you have entered for activity corresponding to the talkgroups you have programmed. When it picks this up (decodes it), it switches to the frequency the activity is taking place on and unmutes. Data on the voice channel indicates if it should stay on that frequency and wait for more activity during delay or switch to another frequency; once the convo has ended it resumes scanning, i.e. checking the control channels you have entered as well as zipping through whatever conventional frequencies you have programmed. If you have more than one site/control channel plus alternate programmed, this will slow things down. Likewise it has to periodically scan the conventional channels you have programmed and it can't do that and watch the CC at the same time. So no, techinically it doesn't scan without the CCs...I suppose you could just program all the frequencies used by the TSYS sites in range and scan those conventionally, but it would be hit and miss trying to follow a conversation as the sites often roll frequencies between transmissions. You would need to have delay set to 0 to have any chance of following a comm.Great, a cool old school approach using the venerable R30 - I love it. Is there public safety only on your systems or do you have to listen to public works, animal control, etc?
And I would love to hear from anyone (ynot58, others?) how the TRX-1 accomplishes scanning without control channels. Does it just stop when it hears the desired talk groups then quickly scan again to pick up each reply? I almost bought one and still might get the TRX-100 when it comes out. Not that I really need LSM right now - I don't think our Silicon Valley "SVRCS" system is using simulcast yet, but their dozen or so new FCC site licenses for building tops and hill tops paint a picture of the future.
Don
Great, a cool old school approach using the venerable R30 - I love it. Is there public safety only on your systems or do you have to listen to public works, animal control, etc?
And I would love to hear from anyone (ynot58, others?) how the TRX-1 accomplishes scanning without control channels. Does it just stop when it hears the desired talk groups then quickly scan again to pick up each reply? I almost bought one and still might get the TRX-100 when it comes out. Not that I really need LSM right now - I don't think our Silicon Valley "SVRCS" system is using simulcast yet, but their dozen or so new FCC site licenses for building tops and hill tops paint a picture of the future.
Don
The scanner checks the control channels you have entered for activity corresponding to the talkgroups you have programmed. When it picks this up (decodes it), it switches to the frequency the activity is taking place on and unmutes. Data on the voice channel indicates if it should stay on that frequency and wait for more activity during delay or switch to another frequency; once the convo has ended it resumes scanning, i.e. checking the control channels you have entered as well as zipping through whatever conventional frequencies you have programmed. If you have more than one site/control channel plus alternate programmed, this will slow things down. Likewise it has to periodically scan the conventional channels you have programmed and it can't do that and watch the CC at the same time. So no, techinically it doesn't scan without the CCs...I suppose you could just program all the frequencies used by the TSYS sites in range and scan those conventionally, but it would be hit and miss trying to follow a conversation as the sites often roll frequencies between transmissions. You would need to have delay set to 0 to have any chance of following a comm.
Ideally just having one site/CC + alternate entered and no conventional channels, you should hear everything you have programmed for that site. But that's not a realistic way to employ an expensive radio, IMHO.
My experience with a 436 and several predecessors of the TRX series (PSR800/900 pattern) is that the Uniden seems to dwell on sites even when there is no signal present (i.e. far out of range), where the GRE/RS/Whistlers seem to treat the CCs like conventional objects, i.e. they don't dwell if there's no signal present. That makes them seem to scan faster than the Uniden. This entire last paragraph is speculation on my part, based on using the radios in question and if I'm incorrect I'll be happy to hear what is really happening with these things.
donirving - I live in the SF bay area , so I have the Nine Counties region programed into all my scanners.
my Whistler scanner(s) are quite selective in what an Listen to, its all a matter of Programming.
however with the ICOM has smaller memory 2000 CH max and there is no Database Programming, I have to enter Frequencies manually but software should be available later. so the ICOM can listen to all the same stuff as Whistler but everything is manual. but I have been Programming this way for Decades, I used to have a Pen and Paper frequency list that I compiled from " Police call " books. but Radio Reference database makes programming easier.
In order to monitor specific talkgroups on a system you must program control channels. By not programming (or scanning as some other user was suggesting) the control channels, you are subject to listening to everything and anything on the system, police, fire, dog catcher, street sweeper, maintenance workers and you would have to chase frequencies if you want to follow a conversation.
If the few seconds held onto a trunked system during scans with conventional frequencies also is too much that you never get to hear the conventional, then you should be using separate scanners for each, otherwise you can listen to all of it and put up with the limitations stated above.
The voice channel has to carry some data so that the subscriber radios know whether to stay on the same frequency or roll to another one; I'm presuming that trunking scanners use this data also. Neither subscriber equipment nor scanners can watch the CC while passing VC audio.Ok, you're saying that there is is indicator data on the voice channel whether to stay or switch ? I figured that the system would drop the voice channel instantly to free it, then if there is a reply the replying unit would have to make a new request to from scratch CC for a channel. I would be interested in reading more about things like this if you or anyone is willing.
And I can report that the SDS100 does not dwell significantly on our more remote (for me) "South" site if it can't reach it. If I am holding the scanner in front of me the site indicator may not annunciate "South" or flashes briefly - not much longer than a conventional scan-over flash. But if I hold the scanner up over my head to get more signal it is more likely to dwell.
Ok, so there are no scanner-detectable talk group indicators available in the traffic channels, and you have to listen to everything. It sounded like Whistler had some special way of selecting talk groups from traffic channels - guess not.
I have more handheld scanners (PSR500s), so I may wind up using multiple again. I can also increase delay on the conv channels so that at least once it stops there there will be more chance of still being there for the reply instead of missing it.
Thanks again,
Don
I have a Whistler TRX-1 and on Motorola , EDACs, P25, and LTR systems you can "follow a talkgroup". The terminology is "hold or pause" on that talkgroup and the scanner will follow no matter what frequency that talkgroup moves to, that's if you have the system properly programmed as a trunked system.
You cannot follow DMR , or NXDN in the same way as they do not decode the control channel on those types of systems, that being said I have local DMR and NXDN systems as conventional and have no problem following talkgroups, however they are not busy systems.
Can you confirm something for me about the TRX-1?
For P25, I presume that in order for the scanner to be properly programmed for trunking it needs to scan the control channel in order for it to jump immediately and correctly to each next assigned voice channel?
Without the control channel wouldn't the scanner just resume its scan of the voice channels and stop blindly on the next one it hears - same talkgroup or not?
That's what people seem to be telling me.
I guess the answer hinges on the question of whether there is data available in the voice channels that can identify the talk group. I'm trying to learn that.