Battle Communications (NXDN – 173)

RF23 · Apr 16, 2018

In checking out Battle Communications (NXDN – 173) which is supposed to be NXDN NEXEDGE 4800 (NX4) but consistently reads on my 436HP as NX9. Perhaps it has changed since this info was published on RR.Com? It covers 6 counties in SEMO and NE AR (Stoddard, Butler, Bollinger, etc.).

In using the Excel formulas (as posted on an RR thread) for determining CH ID in NXDN it confirmed all but two of the posted CH IDs on RR.Com.

The two CH IDs that were different were:
1. 452.8875c (Miner, MO – New Madrid CO) was listed as CH ID of 0 (zero) but the formula said it should be 232.

2. 453.0125c (Zalma, MO – Bollinger CO) was listed as CH ID of 243 but the formula said it should be 242.

Of course the formula does not work in a lot of cases and this may be one of them.

If you get a chance check it out and see what you get.

kruser · Apr 17, 2018

N0UDG said:
In checking out Battle Communications (NXDN – 173) which is supposed to be NXDN NEXEDGE 4800 (NX4) but consistently reads on my 436HP as NX9. Perhaps it has changed since this info was published on RR.Com? It covers 6 counties in SEMO and NE AR (Stoddard, Butler, Bollinger, etc.).

In using the Excel formulas (as posted on an RR thread) for determining CH ID in NXDN it confirmed all but two of the posted CH IDs on RR.Com.

The two CH IDs that were different were:
1. 452.8875c (Miner, MO – New Madrid CO) was listed as CH ID of 0 (zero) but the formula said it should be 232.

2. 453.0125c (Zalma, MO – Bollinger CO) was listed as CH ID of 243 but the formula said it should be 242.

Of course the formula does not work in a lot of cases and this may be one of them.

If you get a chance check it out and see what you get.

Can you post a link to the thread the talks about the Excel Formula?

I found a thread pertaining to NXDN channel numbering but I don't think it mentioned Excel at all.

I do know that an accurate channel numbering formula is next to impossible for NXDN but if there is an Excel sheet out there, I'd find it interesting to see how they arrived at some of their assumptions.

Thanks!

RF23 · Apr 17, 2018

This is the Excel program I used:

https://forums.radioreference.com/u...grade-bcd436hp-bcd536hp-now-available-22.html

Post 434

Here are some others that you might find interesting:

https://forums.radioreference.com/v...equency-channel-numbering-scheme-nexedge.html

http://forums.radioreference.com/un...grade-bcd436hp-bcd536hp-now-available-23.html
Post 446

They are all dependent on a Standard NXDN Band Plan being used. Custom NXDN Band Plans cannot be determined this way.

buddrousa · Apr 17, 2018

System 173 Milner site today CC 451.650 LCN 133 RAN 7
Run the LCN Finder and it showed 133

RF23 · Apr 17, 2018

Interesting, so Miner’s CC has changed from what is posted on RR. This is probably one of the many reasons why the FCC database is so inaccurate.

I cannot get Miner at all here in Butler County and the ones besides Butler County (which is 5 bars but no one seems to be on it) are zero bars so too weak to depend on for reliable info from them.

I plugged 133 CH ID (LCN) into the Excel spreadsheet & it reports that that LCN corresponds to a freq. of 451.650. However, I will take the method you used over the formula any day.

Do you remember how strong the signal was?

Thanks for looking into this!

buddrousa · Apr 17, 2018

3 to 4 bars but I get 5 bars on the Sikeston MOWINS Site
I put all 9 Frequencies in the FCC Database for Milner Site ran LCN finder for 8 hours and only got a hit on 451.650

RF23 · Apr 17, 2018

Did you notice if your scanner registered it as an NX4 or NX9 site? I always get NX9 here and a number of people are claiming that on NX9 sites you will get increase in signal strength if you use FM instead of NFM for the modulation. Just something you might see if you can confirm are not if interested.

Thanks again for the help. I will be using the FCC database now too as I only had one frequency for Miner, indeed except for Dexter they all were a single frequency listing on RR.com.

buddrousa · Apr 18, 2018

NX9 and I have heard no traffic

kruser · Apr 19, 2018

N0UDG said:
This is the Excel program I used:

https://forums.radioreference.com/u...grade-bcd436hp-bcd536hp-now-available-22.html

Post 434

Here are some others that you might find interesting:

https://forums.radioreference.com/v...equency-channel-numbering-scheme-nexedge.html

http://forums.radioreference.com/un...grade-bcd436hp-bcd536hp-now-available-23.html
Post 446

They are all dependent on a Standard NXDN Band Plan being used. Custom NXDN Band Plans cannot be determined this way.

Thanks for the info!

semo · Apr 20, 2018

451.6500 is the new Malden Nexedge9600 Malden (Dunklin County) site 7 Ran 7. I have logged no users. It shows sites 2,3,4 as its neighbors. Its channel is 133 as stated above.

RF23 · Apr 21, 2018

Thanks! I will have to make some more changes to my growing database for this NXDN 9600.

So far on the Dexter NXDN 9600 in Stoddard County I have IDed 10 TGs on 4 freqs. but I have heard talk on 6 of the 7 Freqs., with a total of 90 hits & all were Ran 2. RSSI ranged from 82 to 276.

For Butler County I have IDed 7 TGs on 2 Freqs. (452.3375, LCN = 188 & 452.6875, LCN = 216) with a total of 241 hits & all were Ran 3. RSSI ranged from 200 to 390.

This was over two days for both sites.

Did you use Pro96Com to get the neighbors or did you use DSD+?

semo · Apr 21, 2018

I got it from DSD+.

This what I have from the Dexter site (173-2), I wonder if this correct?

channel frequency
173 452.1500
195 452.4250
495 461.1750 Control
579 464.2250
674 463.4124

RF23 · Apr 29, 2018

Some of my Proscan NXDN logging will be found in the attachment.

At present like you I am unsure if we have all the frequencies or not for any one site.

I think the Ran value corresponds to the Site #.

The ChIDs are given in this thread and by the formulae reference in this thread.

I think it is going to require a number of people monitoring, FCC Database, RR Database, & use of Formulae to determine what freqs. belong to what sites.

I still have a lot of monitoring to go and have a Yagi for 400MHz ordered to help with the low RSSI values on some freqs.

Some DMR Info:
There are three freqs. (Two are in Dunklin County) that are very active with as many as 15 or so TG per frequency.

Frequency ChID (used LCN Finder in the 436HP)
462.3000 - 3
463.2500 - 1
463.7875 - 1

Several times I have heard TGID 52 (I think) on all three frequencies with the same people talking on the same topic, so, they may be related in some way.

However, I have tried to program them as three sites under one department (no Voice), three frequencies under one site (90% of Voice missed), & each as a DMR OFT (No Voice heard).

If I program them as three separate MotoTRBOs FLs they trunk and I hear all conversations. (Still using only 1 Freq. per MotoTRBO FL).

Be warned that the language can be VERY “Salty” at times.

hkrharry · Apr 29, 2018

Keep in mind that some NXDN channels can be Super-Narrow (6.25Khz) Band, so the channel numbering will be different than a standard narrow-band (12.5Khz) channel. Also, the system operator can choose what the freq number can be. Usually, they start at the lowest frequency they have licensed and some just start at 450.0000 and go up. It is really up to the system operator where the channel numbering starts.
HH

zzdiesel · Apr 30, 2018

N0UDG said:
Some of my Proscan NXDN logging will be found in the attachment.

At present like you I am unsure if we have all the frequencies or not for any one site.

I think the Ran value corresponds to the Site #.

The ChIDs are given in this thread and by the formulae reference in this thread.

I think it is going to require a number of people monitoring, FCC Database, RR Database, & use of Formulae to determine what freqs. belong to what sites.

I still have a lot of monitoring to go and have a Yagi for 400MHz ordered to help with the low RSSI values on some freqs.

Some DMR Info:
There are three freqs. (Two are in Dunklin County) that are very active with as many as 15 or so TG per frequency.

Frequency ChID (used LCN Finder in the 436HP)
462.3000 - 3
463.2500 - 1
463.7875 - 1

Several times I have heard TGID 52 (I think) on all three frequencies with the same people talking on the same topic, so, they may be related in some way.

However, I have tried to program them as three sites under one department (no Voice), three frequencies under one site (90% of Voice missed), & each as a DMR OFT (No Voice heard).

If I program them as three separate MotoTRBOs FLs they trunk and I hear all conversations. (Still using only 1 Freq. per MotoTRBO FL).

Be warned that the language can be VERY “Salty” at times.

If my memory serves me right the two Freqs from Dunklin Co reminds me of the Malden tower.

mtindor · Apr 30, 2018

Battles Communications NXDN - Licenses / Map

For any of you interested in the Battle Communications stuff, I created a Google Spreadsheet and a Google Map representing all sites with 450/460 mhz licenses, licensed to Battle Communications Inc (FRN: 0003903200). Might help you all to figure out what sites may / may not be active in the System 173 trunked system and might help you to figure out what to scan.

Battle Communications NXDN (Sys 173) -- Licenses
Battle Communications NXDN (Sys 173) -- Google Map

There is absolutely no guarantee that any of these sites are online from my perspective, being that I'm in Ohio. I just made up the documents for those of you who can monitor sites in AR/MO. Use at your own discretion.

Keep in mind that Battles could have joined forces with one or more other radio shops to extend the system further, and if they have done that I would have no idea. The only information I gathered was for Battles-specific licenses / locations (on 450/460 mhz).

Based upon the above referenced licenses alone:

Site 1 - could be Blytheville AR or Zalma MO
Site 5 - could be Harrisburg AR or Marmaduke AR

Mike

zzdiesel · Apr 30, 2018

Thanks for the info, mtindor

jasonhouk · Apr 30, 2018

mtindor said:
For any of you interested in the Battle Communications stuff, I created a Google Spreadsheet and a Google Map representing all sites with 450/460 mhz licenses, licensed to Battle Communications Inc (FRN: 0003903200). Might help you all to figure out what sites may / may not be active in the System 173 trunked system and might help you to figure out what to scan.

Battle Communications NXDN (Sys 173) -- Licenses
Battle Communications NXDN (Sys 173) -- Google Map

There is absolutely no guarantee that any of these sites are online from my perspective, being that I'm in Ohio. I just made up the documents for those of you who can monitor sites in AR/MO. Use at your own discretion.

Keep in mind that Battles could have joined forces with one or more other radio shops to extend the system further, and if they have done that I would have no idea. The only information I gathered was for Battles-specific licenses / locations (on 450/460 mhz).

Based upon the above referenced licenses alone:

Site 1 - could be Blytheville AR or Zalma MO
Site 5 - could be Harrisburg AR or Marmaduke AR

Mike

Awesome maps as always Mike. Thank you for all you contribute to our community.

Houk

mtindor · Apr 30, 2018

jasonhouk said:
Awesome maps as always Mike. Thank you for all you contribute to our community.

Houk

Thanks, Jason. That's very kind of you to say. Ditto for all of your contributions in Ohio and for providing us all with a nice peek into the SDS100!

mike

mtindor · Apr 30, 2018

semo said:
I got it from DSD+.

This what I have from the Dexter site (173-2), I wonder if this correct?

channel frequency
173 452.1500
195 452.4250
495 461.1750 Control
579 464.2250
674 463.4124

Be careful when transposing

579 464.2250
674 463.4124

1. LCN 579 would be 462.2250 (which is licensed to that site) - already in db
2. LCN 674 would be 463.4125 (which is licensed to that site) - already in db

Mike

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