G4/G5 or Scanner ?

Scanner user since 1985 here. Used them/had them all. Radio Shack, Bearcat, etc. Also Amateur Tech class holder, owned Alinco's and Yaesu's over the years. Not "my first hay ride" when it comes to radios.

With that said, I get fatigued pretty quickly trying to keep up with the recent trunking scanners. I like the home patrol but the purist in me says the radio in my palm should be field programmable, not require I be close to a USB port to listen to a frequency. And if I have no real choice, I want the radio to work as expected.

My "target" is Dallas-Ft Worth area public safety, mostly FIRE, because if it is "big" they will send a fire truck. I am not interested in listening to law enforcement prowler calls or gas drive-offs at 7-11, in between major incidents. My primary system will be Denton County (link: https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=8438), note the following disclaimer:

The new system uses P25 Phase II modulation, and requires a newer digital type of scanner that can decode radio traffic on this system. Currently, the following scanners can decode P25 Phase II and Motorola X2-TDMA systems:

* GRE PSR-800
* Radio Shack Pro-668
* Uniden BCD436HP, BCD536HP, HomePatrol-2, BCD325P2, BCD996P2
* Whistler WS1080, WS1095

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I am intrigued by the G4/G5 device, what do you guys recommend

Thank you

i got the G5 VHF last year paid $660 for it and was the BEST money spent YEA its NOT a scanner does NOT do things like a scanner if you program the zone and 8 channels like you want your be happy THEN theirs the Uniden SDS100 that came out think the price is $649?

The Unication units work great, however they are not field programmable like scanners are, unless you travel with a laptop.

I also major scanner owner/user even have a number of feeds up 9 to be exact. A year and couple of weeks back decided to put the money out for a G-5/VHF.....

Not a scanner but the best money I ever put up, I even have mine set up by zones/channels pretty much does what I want.

G4/G5 or Scanner?

Been scanning since 1974. Whenever I use my WS1080 from Whistler? I am reminded WHY I bought a Unication G5 Pager and Amp/charger. Especially in the car. Even my 2004 Pro96 is BETTER at P25 but lacks the 700mhz and phase II we have here. The Whistler failed miserably wherever I took it for P25 and especially Phase II traffic. It was handled strangely too, the Phase II transmissions on the Whistlers are 2X the volume for some reason. Unication G5-vhf pager has been a delight. Perfect reception, no outside antenna needed wherever I went. Love it.
They could easily turn the Pagers into a small scanner by having a auto-scan feature *hinted at on their site for the future* where you scan knob positions whether it's P25 digital or VHF/UHF. I'd love to see that. The right tool for the right job is best. That's why I use the G5 pager 99% of my scanning.

Since this appears to be a simucast P25 Phase II system, your only real choices are the Unication G4/5 pager or the brand new Uniden SDS100 scanner. No other trunking monitor radios (not counting two-way radios) are designed to receive LSM P25 simulcast systems. You are lucky. A few months ago you would have had almost no options. The G4/5 pagers did not work with Phase II until a few months ago and the SDS100 is been out for less than a couple of months. Given the limited systems you want to monitor, I think the Unication pager would be a good choice. As long as you don't have to have field programming and understand its limitations, as it is *not* a scanner, it should work well for you. The SDS100 has just been released and uses a different design than past scanners. Like all new products that are extremely complex, it is still going through growing pains and firmware updates. Although it works well for many people, it does not currently work well for everyone, everywhere. YMMV!!!

I've been testing an SDS-100 over the last week and a half (loaned to me for that purpose) - seems to work well most of the time on a nearby county simulcast system while in county, up to a few miles out, and further with some careful specific placement at my home (which is along near a body of water where the signal carries fairly well). However, it doesn't work well at all on the local non-simulcast sites of NC VIPER in my area - almost never sees the control channel - and the towers are only 7 miles or so from my house.

From posted reports, the SDS-100 isn't working well on simulcast systems for everyone.

My G5 receives both systems in my area (simulcast and non-simulcast) very well without issue - and that's the reason I buy a radio - to listen... not to fight with it.

It is true - the Unications are not scanners but they do provide the basic scanning functions you probably need. It is also true that you cannot programming without a computer but that hardly means they are "locked in stone" once you program them. I've programmed mine over and over since receiving it -- sometimes for travel and other times just to continue to tweak the programming that allows me to "scan" large numbers of talkgroups at one time but then switch to a specific talkgroup (as in "hold") when there is activity of interest on one (or a small specific group) of those talkgroups. As with everything that has limitations, you find a way to get what you need from it.

If you know what you want to listen to, the G4/G5 is a great option. I also have an SDS-100 and it works well up here in NE Ohio.

If I need scanning capability (e.g., new place, want to listen to new talkgroups), I grab the SDS-100. Otherwise the G4 comes along because it's simple to use once programmed, is much more durable than the SDS-100 and the battery life is amazing (especially when compared with the SDS-100).

One big downside (to me) is that it doesn't mute encrypted traffic, so listening to a TG that has both gets annoying really fast.

In my experience, the G4 also crashes more often than the SDS-100 and requires either the 3-finger reset or pulling the battery.

BigWonton said:

In my experience, the G4 also crashes more often than the SDS-100 and requires either the 3-finger reset or pulling the battery.

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Which firmware are you using? I haven't seen crashes in quite some time - definitely not since using the latest firmware (T08 that was installed during the upgrade).

troymail said:

Which firmware are you using? I haven't seen crashes in quite some time - definitely not since using the latest firmware (T08 that was installed during the upgrade).

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I'm using T08 as well which was installed at the factory during the Phase II update. I also reflashed the firmware in hopes that would fix it.

It doesn't happen often though - I think I've had 3 or 4 crashes since the update.

Unication vs SDS100

I know I'm going to be slammed, but there's a third option for receiving simulcast systems called OP-25. The downside is that runs only on Linux so it's not as convenient as other options. At one time it required a high-end computer and was difficult to install, but that's no longer the case. Some people now run it on a RPi3. I run it on a low-end Dell 11" laptop , which I can also use in my car. The advantage of using a small laptop is that it has an audio out jack that I use to connect to my car's audio system.

I also own and use a Unication G4. There are advantages and disadvantages of both. The laptop I use is a Dell 3179 so it can be used a as normal laptop or you can fold the top over to be a tablet. The downside is that it's a little large for a car and requires a cigarette lighter power supply, external antenna, and external RTL-SDR (TCXO) stick. Then again, it's half the cost of either a G4/5 or SDS100 and can be used as a regular laptop when not used as a scanner. It has near perfect decodes on both Phase I and II simulcast systems. It has an option to automatically mute encrypted audio, although I have no way to test that feature on the system I monitor. It also has a 3 second delay so you don't miss as many conversations as you would on other devices. If you're wanting something to use only at home you should definitely check it out (there are many threats under the Software Defined Radio section). I posted a picture of what it looks like.

I also like the G4 when used in my car because it's so convenient. The downside is that without the delay I miss parts of conversations, especially when the trunk groups I monitor get busy. The biggest downside to the G4/5 is the lack of an audio out jack, so they use Bluetooth instead. The problem with that is that's difficult to find the old 2.1 Bluetooth standard the radio supports, which makes the Bluetooth feature practically worthless (lots of threads on this subject). If Unication were to release a firmware update to support Bluetooth 4.0 and eliminate all the "call ended" voice prompts it would be nearly perfect for mobile use. It's difficult to hear over road & engine noise at highway speeds using the internal speaker due to the distortion I get when trying to use it at higher volumes.

As far as the SDS100, you may want to hold off for a little while. The price will probably come down once Whistler releases their version of the SDS100 and the firmware gets better.

billpritjr said:

My "target" is Dallas-Ft Worth area public safety, mostly FIRE, . My primary system will be Denton County (link: https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=8438), note the following disclaimer:

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I am very familiar with the areas you have mentioned. I program and maintain a GRE PSR-800 for a friend in that area. While there is no question the G4/G5 will out perform listening quality of any scanner, you need to also think carefully of the Unication limitations versus what you really want to listen to. As you know, the area your are referring to has the Denton P-25, PAWN-P25, Frisco P25, Dallas P-25 and the Ft Worth P25 systems. YOU CANNOT LISTEN TO ALL OF THOSE SYSTEMS AT THE SAME TIME WITH A UNICATION. So if you wish to listen to only one at a time then the Unication is great. My friend's experience has not been good since those system mentioned have moved to Phase II. Some days great other day don't bother listening because of LSM. I have no experience with the new Uniden SDS-100 but I sure would not buy one without talking to someone in your area as to their experience. You really should post your question in the Texas forum..

I don't listen to Denton county, but I do listen to the Ft. Worth Regional Radio System, a P25 Phase I system (mainly) that suffers badly from simulcast distortion on Uniden equipment that I've owned. The thing that I love about my G5 is that it just works. That's the main benefit to me. Here are the pros and cons of the Unication from my experience.

Pros:
- Battery life is long. (All day.)
- Small and easily portable.
- Small antenna that performs great.
- Durable. Really durable.
- Waterproof and dust proof.
- Quality construction. You can feel it all over. No loose knobs or cheap plastic.
- It just works. Period.
- Unication support (in my experience) is beyond excellent.

Cons:
- It's not a scanner. You can only listen to one site at a time.
- If you monitor a TG that includes encrypted traffic, it won't mute the encrypted traffic.
- You can't monitor all bands. You can choose models that monitor some conventional bands, but limited.
- You can't easily program it on-the-go. It requires a computer connection.

I guess the primary point for me is that the "cons" for the G5 are a product of what it's designed for. It's designed as a pager for first responders, and that's the primary consumer of this device. Hobbyists account for a very small percentage of Unication sales.

On the other hand, the cons for the Uniden are functional ones. Primarily, they still seem to suffer when monitoring simulcast systems. I don't own an SDS100, but I see a lot of threads from people who are still working through all of the hocus pocus to try and deal with LSM. If you own a Unication, you don't have to deal with any of that.

Jim

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