Learn something new all the time

I found out I was mistaken in the belief that Marine Band was not going to go narrowband.. They in fact have been narrowbanded with the rest of the VHF world. Found the new US VHF Plan put out by USCG and was like... Wait, what is this?....
And then saw the link to the narrowband listing....
https://www.navcen.uscg.gov/?pageName=vhfnb
https://www.navcen.uscg.gov/?pageName=mtVhf

So will have to redo my stuff in my maritime scanner to list the new numbering etc... Of course by the time I get to go near coastal area again, they might have put the 6.25 spacing in lol.

Was shaking my head as well, with your posting.

Not much fan-fare to announce it
I did find this web page New VHF Marine Frequencies Coming Into Use in 2017

Due to the increased need of more marine VHF channels for VTS, commercial requirements, and port operations, a recent ITU World Radio Conference has authorized and developed a new channel plan for the VHF marine radio frequencies. This new channel plan will take effect January 1, 2017

What changes will we see in North America?
Well to start, beginning January 1, 2017.

In the United States
All "Alpha Channels" will drop the "Alpha" and will change their designations to (4) digit channel numbers beginning with "10" and then the old channel number.
Here are the changes:
Channel 01A becomes 1001, 05A becomes 1005, 07A becomes 1007, 18A becomes 1018, 19A becomes 1019, 20A becomes 1020, 21A becomes 1021, 22A becomes 1022, 23A becomes 1023, 63A becomes 1063, 65A becomes 1065, 66A becomes 1066, 78A becomes 1078, 79A becomes 1079, 80A becomes 1080, 81A becomes 1081, 82A becomes 1082, and 83A becomes 1083.
This looks more onerous than it actually is. The frequency of the "Alpha" channel and the new "10nn"(4) digit channel does not change. The problem is for persons with older radios having to take the time to determine what channel to switch to when asked to switch to channel 1018.

The following channels will be available for "VDSMS" (VHF Digital Small Message Services): 1007, 10, 11, 1018, 1019, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 68, 69, 71, 72, 1078, 1079, 1080, 84, 85, 86, 87, and 88.

Channels 27, 87, 28 and 88 may be used for testing of new AIS applications.

The frequency 160.9 MHz (a spare Coast Station transmit frequency between channels 65 and 66) may be used for testing of new applications. This will be known as channel 2006.

In Canada
For the great majority of boaters in Region 2, these changes should have little or no impact to their normal VHF communications requirements.

milf said:

I found out I was mistaken in the belief that Marine Band was not going to go narrowband.. They in fact have been narrowbanded with the rest of the VHF world. Found the new US VHF Plan put out by USCG and was like... Wait, what is this?....
And then saw the link to the narrowband listing....
https://www.navcen.uscg.gov/?pageName=vhfnb
https://www.navcen.uscg.gov/?pageName=mtVhf

So will have to redo my stuff in my maritime scanner to list the new numbering etc... Of course by the time I get to go near coastal area again, they might have put the 6.25 spacing in lol.

Click to expand...

ITU has been talking about this for a while.

A good idea, I guess. Narrow band makes sense, but it's going to take a long time for all those old 25KHz radios to fall out of use.

The 6.25 digital stuff, again, for recreational users, it's going to take a while to trickle down that far.
Last time I looked, I didn't see any specs on how they were going to do 6.25, specifically, what mode they were going to use.

In reality, there are some areas where more channels are needed, and narrow band makes sense. Not sure I see the need for 6.25, though. That's a lot of channels for a limited amount of usage and 25 watts or less.

mmckenna said:

ITU has been talking about this for a while.

A good idea, I guess. Narrow band makes sense, but it's going to take a long time for all those old 25KHz radios to fall out of use.

The 6.25 digital stuff, again, for recreational users, it's going to take a while to trickle down that far.
Last time I looked, I didn't see any specs on how they were going to do 6.25, specifically, what mode they were going to use.

In reality, there are some areas where more channels are needed, and narrow band makes sense. Not sure I see the need for 6.25, though. That's a lot of channels for a limited amount of usage and 25 watts or less.

Click to expand...

Are they going tu use NXDN 6.25 digital ?

KA9JYO said:

Are they going tu use NXDN 6.25 digital ?

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Never found anything that spec'd out the standard.
6.25KHz channel width, digital, that was it.

NXDN, PDMR, maybe a yet to be defined mode.

Radios would need to be 12.5KHz analog capable, likely 25KHz analog capable to.
It would be an expensive proposition to require all marine VHF users to swap out their radios. Considering not all countries are as wealthy or advanced, it would be a long time before it all gets done.

You can do analog voice all the way down to 3 kHz channel width, so there is no reason to expect a move to digital on marine bands.

I have never heard anyone on VHF refer to the "new" channel numbers, either.

So what does all this mean? What will I need to do with my scanner? Bcd996p2

DaveNF2G said:

You can do analog voice all the way down to 3 kHz channel width, so there is no reason to expect a move to digital on marine bands.

Click to expand...

Not very well with 3KHz, audio would be pretty low fidelity, and that can be an issue in high noise environments.

ITU specifically said 6.25KHz digital. It's not an assumption.. https://www.itu.int/dms_pubrec/itu-r/rec/m/R-REC-M.1084-5-201203-I!!PDF-E.pdf

Add in the ability to send radio ID's and GPS location along with each transmission, and it makes some good sense.

There's also some suggestions in the ITU documents about being able to bond up to 4 adjacent 25KHz channels together to supply 100KHz wide data channels.

Various mentions of TDMA, C4FM, but no specific mention of a mode.

cajunjerry said:

So what does all this mean? What will I need to do with my scanner? Bcd996p2

Click to expand...

Nothing, not right now. Your radio should handle the 12.5KHz channels just fine.

If/when they do go to 6.25KHz digital, then it'll be something to think about, but you've probably got many years before needing to cross that bridge, if the bridge ever gets built.

C4FM

mmckenna said:

Nothing, not right now. Your radio should handle the 12.5KHz channels just fine.

If/when they do go to 6.25KHz digital, then it'll be something to think about, but you've probably got many years before needing to cross that bridge, if the bridge ever gets built.

Click to expand...

I use DMR and C4FM, both great modes, but I prefer C4FM because is simpler to program your radio. Also works good on VHF, would be a good possibility for Marine VHF.

Interesting thread. This is the first time I have heard of these marine band changes. Thanks for information.

The RadioReference.com database still has the old 1A through 88A channels, and mentions the narrow band 201-287 channels, but no details.

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?aid=7748

It appears it needs some attention.

Why in the world would they narrowband marine channels? (Yes, I know to fit more channels in the given band plan but why? Most parts of the country there is hardly any traffic on VHF marine band..)

BCC mandate

pinballwiz86 said:

Why in the world would they narrowband marine channels? (Yes, I know to fit more channels in the given band plan but why? Most parts of the country there is hardly any traffic on VHF marine band..)

Click to expand...

First, is FCC mandate for all rf systems. If you are in congested marine areas like Miami, LA, N.Y. or even the Panama canal, you will agree with going narrow band.

The FCC cannot mandate anything for the Panama Canal, which is now located within a sovereign nation. Any mandate would have to come from ITU and apply at least within a Zone.

No... the FCC did not mandate for ALL 'RF' systems.

Low Band is one example

KA9JYO said:

First, is FCC mandate for all rf systems. If you are in congested marine areas like Miami, LA, N.Y. or even the Panama canal, you will agree with going narrow band.

Click to expand...

DaveNF2G said:

The FCC cannot mandate anything for the Panama Canal, which is now located within a sovereign nation. Any mandate would have to come from ITU and apply at least within a Zone.

Click to expand...

And funny you mention ITU.. They have made the narrowband mandate for maritime VHF. Link is also in that info the USCG put out. And also referenced in the post by mmckenna.

It has been a while since I looked at this (it really isn't new), but my recollection is that the new 12.5 channels would be authorized interleaved between existing 25 channels, but their was no requirement that existing licensees cease use of the word khz channels.

Wow, good info. I did not realize that they became narrowed. But is that on all new radios now or just a select few to test it out?

NB seems like a bad idea for maritime, when you consider the reduced footprint of a signal. (Like US public safety had to adjust to, in 2013.)

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