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South Carolina Radio Discussion Forum Forum for discussing Radio Information in the State of South Carolina.

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Old 02-15-2011, 6:02 PM
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Default STATE WIDE Question

Many fire depts in the upstate are buying motoTRBO Digital radios and plan to use the Digital for "Fire Ground Comms" This mode will filter out background noise and make for safer fire fighting. BUT, one local fire dept, the largest in Greenville County has Dropped its 800 system, turned off its VHF simulcast Tone Out and now dispatches in motoTRBO Digital on UHF. MY QUESTION is this: Has any other Fire Dept in the state done the same. ???????
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Old 02-15-2011, 8:53 PM
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Richland and Lexington counties still use Pal8 for everything except fireground which are VHF and 800mhz simplex. So no, not here, not sure about elsewhere...
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Old 02-16-2011, 10:49 AM
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I haven`t heard of any changes for Spartanburg County. though my FD.
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Old 02-16-2011, 8:19 PM
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what other fire dept.s in the upstate other than parker are going that route?
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Old 02-16-2011, 8:37 PM
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Greenville Co has the most fragmented fire service than any other county I've ever studied. More so than Spartanburg, and that's saying something. Some are on VHF, some on UHF, some now on 800, some digital, some now MOTOTRBO. Some use centralized dispatch, some have their own dispatchers. What a mess.

I won't be surprised to see other fire departments to adopt MOTOTRBO or NEXTEDGE for their private repeater channels as more and more look to satisfy the narrowbanding requirement and fall prey to agressive sales people. But I would be surprised to see many FDs that use centralized dispatch and tone-out adopt any of the DMR systems.
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Old 02-16-2011, 8:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarrySC View Post
Many fire depts in the upstate are buying motoTRBO Digital radios and plan to use the Digital for "Fire Ground Comms" This mode will filter out background noise and make for safer fire fighting. BUT, one local fire dept, the largest in Greenville County has Dropped its 800 system, turned off its VHF simulcast Tone Out and now dispatches in motoTRBO Digital on UHF. MY QUESTION is this: Has any other Fire Dept in the state done the same. ???????

I think your seeing the combination of the financial fallout of lower tax base income and the slick sales presentation of a radio being presented as cheaper and does all. Is this the best route to go, only time will tell us that. It does cause the problem of talking to your neighbors on the radio if everyone doesn't go to the same style of radios. Nothing else can talk to a Moto TRBO except another TRBO programed with the same information.

Every department is having money issues right now. The FCC is mandating the narrow banding of the VHF and UHF radio systems that many departments are still using. In the door comes the radio shop saying we have the answer to all your radio cost problems. Here is a new radio that will do narrow banding, can do both analog and digital and is almost 1/10 to 1/3 less than the cost of your current radios. Don't you think that the chief will pay attention. What they don't hear is that they can't talk to anyone else unless they also use the same radios. What the chief doesn't think about is this really a good deal. All he can hear is the cost is so low. No thoughts as to is this a good move. No thoughts about asking the technical geeks about these radios. Just the cost is affordable, let's make the move.

So now we sit back and see just how well of a move this is for those departments. Don't get me wrong about not wanting an affordable radio. We all want that. It's just at what cost will the long term pan out to be. It would be more on the wise decision side to ask a pile of questions to other people other than the snake oil peddler that came through the door. Find a radio engineer that has no stake in what is going on and at least find out what this magical package is that the sales person is waving in his hand.
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Old 02-16-2011, 9:35 PM
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Thanks for all the replys. Since no one answered my question I assume that the Parker Secret Fire District is the only one in SC dispatching in motoTRBO. Yes "brian" it is a mess but 30 years ago I had to stock 23 different crystals just for GVL Co Fire. The county is slowly moving stations with volunteers to County dispatch, but, Parker has never had any volunteers and will never let anyone do their dispatching. Over a period of time, [10 more years], it should be all UHF.
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Old 02-17-2011, 9:22 PM
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Hey Larry:

I haven't heard of anybody else going complete TRBO in the upstate, but I wouldn't be suprised if you don't start seeing more.

Nozzle
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Old 02-21-2011, 8:58 AM
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greenwood uses simplex
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Old 02-21-2011, 12:41 PM
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Parker is the only department using TRBO that I know of.
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Old 03-02-2011, 5:32 AM
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I keep hearing rumors of more departments to come up there....Only UHF rural depts I know of is Aiken Co and Greenville Co stuff.... I heard Kershaw is considering Mototrbo for VHF
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Old 03-02-2011, 7:08 AM
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It has been stated correctly here that this is market driven, meaning the manufacturers and dealers are driving this whole narrow band mess. The dealers in my area are stating that the CDM and HT lines are discontinued when they are not. I even provided my department with the cancellation notices, and pointed out that the radios we have are still available.Still they are buying MOTOTRBO. The dealers want to sell MOTOTRBO, to make sure that whoever you sell to has to come back to you for more, and when an agency sees that the MOTOTRBO radio will fulfill the current narrow banding rules and the future ultra narrow, for the same price or lower as the CDM or HT line why wouldn't an agency go to it. Motorola has a hand in it also, I have seen this before, when Motorola didn't make an economical low band radio they told my local school board that low band was being discontinued. Discontinued? Motorola knows it has competition in the digital market, and wants to flood the market with MOTOTRBO so as to capture it, and hold it, like they did with DPL in the 70's, and 800 trunking type I and II in the 80's. It is always promoting something they have over something someone else doesn't. The purchasing agency doesn't look past the initial purchase as to the future costs involved.
BTW inter-agency comms should be in analog anyway, so that shouldn't be a problem.
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Old 03-02-2011, 7:40 AM
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About 1970 Greenville PD switched from VHF to UHF. Motorola told them no one could hear them unless they spent $4000 for a special radio. I ran an add in the news paper for BC xtal scanners for $139 and you want beleive the mess that started. When they found out I had a "Little Tiger" converter for $29 they had a stroke. I knew my position on the issue and the City of Greenville just withdrew all their protest and threats. Motorola dealers have always told their customers whatever they wanted.
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Old 03-02-2011, 8:31 AM
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Having worked for the drunken bat you really don't want to hear my horror stories.
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Old 03-03-2011, 8:41 AM
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The MOTOTRBO radios are lower cost than an HT or CDM. They are not higher. If you price out an HT with a 3 year warranty and an IMPRES Lithium Ion battery and charger, it will be higher than a MOTOTRBO portable. A CDM1550 was also higher than a MOTOTRBO mobile.

Some of the HT and CDM models have been discontinued. For example, the CDM1550 is only available now in Low Band. VHF Hi and UHF are gone.

The MOTOTRBO radios, even when used just for analog, are a much better radio than the HT and CDM series, in my opinion (from a technical perspective). The MOTOTRBO have much higher channel capacity, excellent audio quality, excellent battery life (portables), MUCH easier-to-use menus, and have functionality that the HT and CDM series doesn't/didn't/won't offer. And the MOTOTRBO portables are waterproof/submersible. End-user satisfaction has been extremely high for the MOTOTRBO radios.

From a 'business' perspective, the HT and CDM models have been around for over 10 years. Some models have already been discontinued. That model line is getting near end-of-life, there's no doubt about that. To me, it wouldn't make any sense to spend my money on an 'old model' radio, that will be discontinued in not-too-many months or years, when I can purchase a newer model, that offers more, for less money.

Your statement that "It is always promoting something they have over something someone else doesn't." is interesting, to say the least. Isn't that what all businesses try to do? They all try to set themselves apart from their competitors, in one way or another. Some offer lower prices than anyone else. Others offer products or services that no one else can offer. That's how business works. If a business didn't do exactly what you stated, they wouldn't be in business for very long at all. I own my own business and have done so for almost 33 years, so I know what I'm talking about.

You obviously have quite an 'axe to grind' with Motorola. With that said, that doesn't mean that I think everthing that Motorola corporate does is 'right'. I don't necessarily agree with how some of the direct-side
sales are handled. And I've seen salespeople from some Motorola dealerships that were/are quite 'unethical' in their business dealings. But that doesn't mean that every Motorola dealer out there is like that. There are good dealers that tell the truth and honestly try to guide the end-user towards the best options for their communications needs.

John Rayfield, Jr. CETma

Quote:
Originally Posted by radioman2001 View Post
It has been stated correctly here that this is market driven, meaning the manufacturers and dealers are driving this whole narrow band mess. The dealers in my area are stating that the CDM and HT lines are discontinued when they are not. I even provided my department with the cancellation notices, and pointed out that the radios we have are still available.Still they are buying MOTOTRBO. The dealers want to sell MOTOTRBO, to make sure that whoever you sell to has to come back to you for more, and when an agency sees that the MOTOTRBO radio will fulfill the current narrow banding rules and the future ultra narrow, for the same price or lower as the CDM or HT line why wouldn't an agency go to it. Motorola has a hand in it also, I have seen this before, when Motorola didn't make an economical low band radio they told my local school board that low band was being discontinued. Discontinued? Motorola knows it has competition in the digital market, and wants to flood the market with MOTOTRBO so as to capture it, and hold it, like they did with DPL in the 70's, and 800 trunking type I and II in the 80's. It is always promoting something they have over something someone else doesn't. The purchasing agency doesn't look past the initial purchase as to the future costs involved.
BTW inter-agency comms should be in analog anyway, so that shouldn't be a problem.
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