BPL or "Smart Grid" ?

[poltergeisty]

So you've probably seen that commercial with the scarecrow from Wizard of Oz dancing around power lines saying "If I only had a brain." Now it doesn't take a genius to figure out that a "smart grid" requires some sort of data transmission over the power lines. Just like now with certain air conditioning setups, etc.

Now what I want to know is how bad will the interference be if something like this actully takes control of your home?


YouTube - Scarecrow - a GE ad Focuses on Smart Grid Technology

YouTube - Are you ready for BPL in your neighbourhood?

YouTube - A Smart Grid for Intelligent Energy Use <<< Offer it to China!

[zz0468]

How is that different from the PLC that the power companies have been using for many many years? I would hope that the bandwidth requirements aren't nearly what they are for BPL.

[SEMTTP]

I can tell you that it will have its consequences. Already and for the last few years the world of Amateur Radio has witnessed first hand the interferences that it causes. Not a good thing....not a good thing at all...

[davidmc36]

Looks like from the demos that HF transmissions will be nearly impossible if BPL gets very widespread. What about on other bands VHF/UHF. Does it cause interference there too?

[zz0468]

Yes, BPL is a Bad Thing for ham radio, but that's NOT what we're talking about. I have yet to see anything authoritative that says a "smart grid" = BPL. The power lines have been using power line carrier equipment for ages. It's nothing new, and it doesn't destroy the ham bands. My question is, does this "smart grid" idea require huge amounts of bandwidth like BPL, or is it merely a more versatile use of existing PLC technology?

Let's understand some facts first before we come unglued about it.

[poltergeisty]

Originally Posted by zz0468

Yes, BPL is a Bad Thing for ham radio, but that's NOT what we're talking about. I have yet to see anything authoritative that says a "smart grid" = BPL. The power lines have been using power line carrier equipment for ages. It's nothing new, and it doesn't destroy the ham bands. My question is, does this "smart grid" idea require huge amounts of bandwidth like BPL, or is it merely a more versatile use of existing PLC technology?

Let's understand some facts first before we come unglued about it.

Yes, it looks like it may (if deployed) will use SCADA technologies. So low bandwidth is the likely scenario. We hope...

[wesct]

Originally Posted by SEMTTP

I can tell you that it will have its consequences. Already and for the last few years the world of Amateur Radio has witnessed first hand the interferences that it causes. Not a good thing....not a good thing at all...

Here's a link from the ARRL:

ARRLWeb: Engineering References - Electric Utility Communications, Applications and Smart Grid Technologies

There is a news story on QRZ:

Newly signed stimulus package may fund broadband over power lines expansion. - QRZ Forums

wesct

[kb2vxa]

The "smart grid" in some areas has been in place for many years but not what you think it to be. PLC is of limited use and no use at all where HV transmission is concerned, there fiber optic cables follow the power lines as they are immune to EMI. It's only now being advertised, just another bit of window dressing for the customers in a failing industry in a failing economy. Read between the lines where it is written; "Your bills are going up... again... and how! Hey, we gotta pay for this... er, YOU gotta pay for this. No government bailouts here, we're not a bank, we're the Electric Company."
(Jab at PBS and Sesame Street here.)

Now before wesct gets you all confused BPL is a separate issue and always has been. Blame it's promotion on the one you elected and his FCC appointee, both are big on the internet and down on Amateur Radio. You wanted change, you got change but failed to notice nobody ever stated what that change would be. You bought a pig in a poke hoping against hope, you made your bed now lay in it... SUCKERS.

Choking voters don't you think the Joker laughs at you? HEE HEE HEE HA HA HA HO HO HO!

[wesct]

Originally Posted by kb2vxa

The "smart grid" in some areas has been in place for many years but not what you think it to be. PLC is of limited use and no use at all where HV transmission is concerned, there fiber optic cables follow the power lines as they are immune to EMI. It's only now being advertised, just another bit of window dressing for the customers in a failing industry in a failing economy. Read between the lines where it is written; "Your bills are going up... again... and how! Hey, we gotta pay for this... er, YOU gotta pay for this. No government bailouts here, we're not a bank, we're the Electric Company."
(Jab at PBS and Sesame Street here.)

Now before wesct gets you all confused BPL is a separate issue and always has been. Blame it's promotion on the one you elected and his FCC appointee, both are big on the internet and down on Amateur Radio. You wanted change, you got change but failed to notice nobody ever stated what that change would be. You bought a pig in a poke hoping against hope, you made your bed now lay in it... SUCKERS.

Choking voters don't you think the Joker laughs at you? HEE HEE HEE HA HA HA HO HO HO!

I'am confused- Where did I confuse anybody. Point it out to me, but use NO gas...

wesct

[Ray_Air]

Here's an idea for the smart grid:
YouTube - Замыкание ЛÐ*П - 35 кВ палкой.35 kV power line short circuit.

[hotdjdave]

Originally Posted by wesct

I'am confused- Where did I confuse anybody. Point it out to me, but use NO gas...

LOL. I think he was joking. Besides, he wrote "before wesct gets you all confused...," not that you had already confused anyone.

I just hope BPL doesn't come here and ruin our lives.