I found a P25 trunked system I can't identify.

[KD7HGK]

Control channels appear to be 408.7125 and 410.1125. I found a voice channel of 408.225. It comes in loud and clear and very strong (99%) when sitting in the Clinton Highway, Walmart parking lot. I can't hear it where I live (south of that Walmart) and it comes in strong again down on Kingston Pike from the Men's Wearhouse to the Shoney's down by Walker Springs Walmart. After that it drops off again. Even at full signal strength it does not give an SID or a site number. It just says "R002"

I've actually got several TG's. Some of them was just a guy doing a 5 count and one of them was talking about a van going through a gate. The Talk Groups are:

1303
1308
1311
1315
65501

None of the Talkgroups were encrypted at the time I heard them.
I checked the 400 MHz Oak Ridge system here on RR and none of those frequencies I've found go to it.

What do I have here?

[MtnBiker2005]

Digital audio talkgroups... Try to grab the NAC code if you can next time.

[ChrisP]

The "R002" that you are seeing indicates that you are picking up Site #2 of a trunked system. The Oak Ridge P25 system in the database shows a Site 1 and Site 4. Could they have added an additional site to the current system?

As MtnBiker suggested, see if you can catch the P-25 NAC code on the voice channels. That will help ID the system.

- Chris

[jfhtm350]

Seems you have stumbled upon something. I cant pick up the control channels from here, if that helps any.

[jfhtm350]

I found a clue of what you may be hearing.

LasVegasScan: June 2010

That is Las Vegas, but scroll down through there and see what they are. Remember about 4 months ago when those people breached the security of Oak Ridge Labratory and there was a big uproar. If I remember correctly, they changed security personel and now they may have a new comm setup.

Of course that may not be the case, but at least you have a clue now.

[jfhtm350]

Oh if you click the link on the items in that page it will bring you to RR database on that and maybe you can compare SID and NAC codes with whatever comes up on your scanner.

Also today around 5pm I heard the Lifestar dispatcher tell the helipilot there was alot of military aircraft at some airport (dont remember what he said, seems like it started with an F) and there was a no fly zone around it. I assumed it was close if he told him that. That may be another clue or part of the same thing.

[n4yek]

Chris P is most likely correct is his assumption that it is this system:
Oak Ridge National Laboratory (Project 25) Trunking System, Oak Ridge, Tennessee - Scanner Frequencies

[codeplug]

Since the system is P-25 will the decode SW be able to decode the system and the neighbor sites on UHF.
Give that a try and see what you can find.
In my opinion from looking at other sites, if they have a site 1 and a site 4 then they should have a site 2 & 3.
If that doesn't work try and scan/search the UHF bad from 406.0000 - 411.0000 and see what you find.
There should be two more control channels if they have two more sites.
Each site will have their own control channel / alt. control channel and their own set of frequencies.
That looks like a multi-site / multi-cast system. Similar to the one in Calhoun County AL. ANAD.
The Calhoun County system is a 3 site multi-cast system but is not P-25, there running an analog CC with P-25 voice.
Looks like they are running narrow-band freq.'s also.

[Unitrunker]

The Oak Ridge system is incorrect as listed in the database. The system type says it's a P25 control channel but the system ID is four digits - suggesting a Motorola control channel. Either the system type is wrong or the system ID is wrong.

Someone please run Unitrunker to verify Motorola vs. P25 and submit to the DB.

[KD7HGK]

found a new voice frequency, 410.9125. I also have new talkgroups:

1300
1302
1304
1305
1306
1307

No NAC codes yet. This was as I was traveling in the Kingston Pike area and I couldn't hear the system long enough to get a NAC from the control channel.

[jfhtm350]

Head on back over to walmart and Id this system. You got to have groceries sooner or later. Hehe. Just kidding.

If I could pick it up I would run Unitrunker on it but I get nothing here.

[KD7HGK]

I made a special run to Walmart so I could ID the NAC off a voice channel. My battery was running low (PSR-500 seems to chew through rechargeable's in 3 or so days. I listen alot) so I only got 10-15 minutes of listening time before the scanner died. Whoever it is, they must not work on Sunday or at least not this late. So I didn't catch anyone talking. However, in positioning the car, the signal seemed to be strongest with the nose of the car pointed northeast (the car has a built-in compass).

[jfhtm350]

They may have got wind that you were listening and decided to mess with you. Hehe. Well at least you know your probably not going to be hearing them on Sundays. If you had a laptop you could connect your scanner to it and use the Unitrunker program to get all that info from the control channel in just a matter of minutes. Have you thought of riding up towards oak ridge and watching the signal. Dont they have a park on Sharps Ridge you can park at on high ground and get a better signal maybe?

[ChrisP]

On the PSR-500, if you use the TUNE function, just enter the control channel frequency, and it will show you the NAC without having to wait for someone to talk.

- Chris

[milf]

Additional things to consider: As mentioned earlier, they have a site 1 and site 4, this means they have also sites 2,and 3. CC's will be active 24/7 no matter what day or time. Are any of the voice traffic you recieved clear or all encrypted like the rest of the ORTRS traffic? As for definite ID'ing the CC should decode and tell you if it is P-25, or an older Moto 2 with digital tg's. Another little wrench in the works possibly.... A LOT of fed systems are upgrading from Moto 2, and EDACS to P-25 so you can find both at some locations. Though a HUGE clue is the tgid's. Moto ID's MUST be divisable by 16, where P-25 ID's do NOT. So your tgid's are indicating P-25.

[KD7HGK]

finally got the NAC:

002

[KD7HGK]

new TG's heard today:

1312
1316

I guess the person who does the database feels pretty confident in what I found. The DB was updated with the new site today.

[jfhtm350]

That NAC code is pretty high up the chain. Check it out.
Federal NAC Codes - The RadioReference Wiki

Do they give any clues as to who they are or just sparatic conversation?

They have it as site 002 instead of NAC 002 in the database. Are you sure it was a NAC code or a SID number?

[ecps92]

The NAC on a TRS is not usually helpful in identifying the Agency.

On a Conventional Channel, Yes, but not a Trunked System

Originally Posted by jfhtm350

That NAC code is pretty high up the chain. Check it out.
Federal NAC Codes - The RadioReference Wiki

Do they give any clues as to who they are or just sparatic conversation?

They have it as site 002 instead of NAC 002 in the database. Are you sure it was a NAC code or a SID number?

[KD7HGK]

heard some conversation today. A guy made reference to "the Bull Run Train" Could this be the Bull Run Fossil Plant, aka Bull Run Steam Plant? It's in Anderson County along with the Oak Ridge Nuke Plant. Does TVA operate trunked systems on 400MHz?