Vhf radio use while beach fishing

[mmckenna]

Of course there is: the FCC rules are stupid and out of date with their de facto policy

I could agree about 50% with this. None the less, ignoring rules because one feels they are "out of date" still isn't a good reason. Anyone can submit a request to the FCC to get things changed, yet it rarely happens. What most fail to remember is that there are very good reasons for these rules. They don't understand the reason, therefore the rules get called stupid and out of date. Would be wonderfully refreshing if people took the time to read and understand the rules and think long and hard about why they exist.

Currently teaching my son to drive. I'm glad he'll learn from someone who will teach him the rules of the road, rather than the attitude that many radio hobbyists seem to have.

 

[mmckenna]

The nice thing here is that the OP has several legal options, and based on his history, I know he'll do the right thing. Learning the correct way to do things makes for a good foundation for the future.

 

[hill]

MURS is fine for short range communications, but that's no reason to use it illegally, as our ham radio friend suggested.

I agree with with Mckenna on this.

Also think this tread went down a wormhole and most likely time to close it.

 

[ka3aaa]

i think the op should forget about the radio and enjoy the vacation and his fishing time.

 

[AA4TX]

You would not be covered by the Part 80 rules for this sort of application.

Calling for help from the USCG would result in them responding with an expensive and noisy helicopter or boat. They will not be amused to find you sitting on the beach with a radio. They'll help you, then you'll get a talkin' to.

If you are on land, even wading in the surf, the local agencies will be able to respond much faster. Use a cell phone as that will get you to the local 911 answering point, and they'll see your location and know exactly who to send (might even be the USCG, but let the professionals decide that…)

If you are out of range of cellular service, and do that sort of stuff regularly, and expect to be in an emergency situation (you should always assume that you will be), then get one of the following:
A cell phone that will do SMS via satellite. Some of the newer iPhones and I think Samsungs will do that.
Get a Garmin InReach or similar device.

Unless you specifically have a human on the other end of the radio that is expecting you to call for help in an emergency, don't expect to get help via ham radio, GMRS, CB, FRS or anything else. Use the correct tool for the job.

The OP was not clear as to whether he arrived at the beach by his boat or other means. If he arrived at the beach by his boat, and the handheld is associated with his boat, the following exception would apply:

The FCC has, with the Report and Order adopted on August 30, 2016, and released on September 1, 2016, modified the use of Marine radios on shore. In addition to allowing those with a Coast License to use marine radios on shore, the FCC has added the following:

§ 80.115 Operational conditions for use of associated ship units.

(a) Associated ship units may be operated under a ship station authorization. Use of an associated ship unit is restricted as follows;
1) It must only be operated on the safety and calling frequency 156.800 MHz or 156.525 MHz or on commercial or noncommercial VHF intership frequencies appropriate to the class of ship station with which it is associated.
(2) Except for safety purposes, it must only be used to communicate with the ship station with which it is associated or with associated ship units of the same ship station. Such associated ship units may be used from shore only adjacent to the waterway (such as on a dock or beach) where the ship is located. Communications from shore must relate to the operational and business needs of the ship including the transmission of safety information, and must be limited to the minimum practicable transmission time.
(3) It must be equipped to transmit on the frequency 156.800 MHz or 156.525 MHz and at least one appropriate intership frequency.
(4) Calling must occur on the frequency 156.800 MHz or 156.525 MHz unless calling and working on an intership frequency has been prearranged.
(5) Power is limited to one watt.
(6) The station must be identified by the call sign of the ship station with which it is associated and an appropriate unit designator.

 

[nd5y]

Does that apply to recreational and small boats that don't have or require a ship station license?

 

[AA4TX]

Does that apply to recreational and small boats that don't have or require a ship station license?

Here is the discussion from the announcement. Since it mentions:

"Such limited onshore use will promote flexibility in the use of marine radio equipment in a manner that furthers maritime safety by encouraging more boaters to a carry a VHF radio. Specifically, as suggested by ACR, we will permit use of portable marine VHF radios only in areas adjacent to the water, such as docks and beaches."

I took it to refer to non compulsory vessels, since compulsory vessels do not need encouragement; they are all ready required to carry VHF radios.

From REPORT AND ORDER Adopted: August 30, 2016 Released: September 1, 2016:

G. Portable Marine VHF Radios on Shore

25. Section 80.115(a)(2) of the Commission’s Rules prohibits the use on shore of a portable marine VHF radio associated with a vessel. The GMDSS Task Force proposed that the rule be amended to allow persons on shore within three miles of the water to use portable marine VHF radios to communicate with the vessel that is subject to the ship station authorization. The Commission, however, noted that limitations on the use of maritime frequencies are intended to minimize interference to maritime communications (particularly distress and safety messages), and tentatively concluded that permitting the use of portable marine VHF radio transmitters on shore would not further the public interest. We questioned the practical enforceability of a three-mile rule, and asked whether shore parties’ communications needs could be met by commercial mobile radio service (CMRS) or PRS options. The Commission also asked commenters supporting the proposal to discuss what limitations would be appropriate to minimize the impact on maritime communications.

26. The GMDSS Task Force acknowledges that CMRS options likely will be preferred in areas with reliable coverage, and asserts that this makes it unlikely that use of low-powered portable marine VHF radio radios on land will interfere with maritime communications. It also argues that permitting such use will further the public interest by encouraging more boaters to a carry a VHF radio, which has safety benefits not available from CMRS or PRS options because marine VHF channels can be used to contact the Coast Guard and other nearby vessels in a distress situation, for bridge-to-bridge communications, and to receive maritime safety information broadcasts.

27. We agree with commenters that the public interest will be served by allowing the use of portable VHF radios ashore, so long as it is limited to enhancing the usefulness of marine VHF radios without negatively affecting maritime communications. Such limited onshore use will promote flexibility in the use of marine radio equipment in a manner that furthers maritime safety by encouraging more boaters to a carry a VHF radio. Specifically, as suggested by ACR, we will permit use of portable marine VHF radios only in areas adjacent to the water, such as docks and beaches. In addition, as suggested by RTCM, and consistent with our requirements for offshore use, onshore communications using such radios must relate to the operational and business needs of the associated vessel, and must be limited to the minimum practicable transmission time. We amend Section 80.115 accordingly. We caution operators that the Commission’s Enforcement Bureau will continue to investigate complaints against operators who improperly use marine VHF radios, particularly any violation that concerns unauthorized transmissions on 156.800 MHz (VHF Channel 16).

 

[KK4JUG]

Ya there’s a lot of good MURS Radios they can buy so times you RRR people get to stuck on the FCC LAWS. Look it’s MURS not police officers frequencies no one is going to get killed if someone used a non MURS RADIO ON 154.6000 okay people let’s get back to helping people out with solutions

Do you have the same attitude about your amateur radio usage? If other ham operators fail to get "stuck on the FCC laws," how long before you start complaining?

 

[AK_SAR]

Here is the discussion from the announcement. Since it mentions:

"Such limited onshore use will promote flexibility in the use of marine radio equipment in a manner that furthers maritime safety by encouraging more boaters to a carry a VHF radio. Specifically, as suggested by ACR, we will permit use of portable marine VHF radios only in areas adjacent to the water, such as docks and beaches."

I took it to refer to non compulsory vessels, since compulsory vessels do not need encouragement; they are all ready required to carry VHF radios.

From REPORT AND ORDER Adopted: August 30, 2016 Released: September 1, 2016:

G. Portable Marine VHF Radios on Shore

25. Section 80.115(a)(2) of the Commission’s Rules prohibits the use on shore of a portable marine VHF radio associated with a vessel. The GMDSS Task Force proposed that the rule be amended to allow persons on shore within three miles of the water to use portable marine VHF radios to communicate with the vessel that is subject to the ship station authorization. The Commission, however, noted that limitations on the use of maritime frequencies are intended to minimize interference to maritime communications (particularly distress and safety messages), and tentatively concluded that permitting the use of portable marine VHF radio transmitters on shore would not further the public interest. We questioned the practical enforceability of a three-mile rule, and asked whether shore parties’ communications needs could be met by commercial mobile radio service (CMRS) or PRS options. The Commission also asked commenters supporting the proposal to discuss what limitations would be appropriate to minimize the impact on maritime communications.

26. The GMDSS Task Force acknowledges that CMRS options likely will be preferred in areas with reliable coverage, and asserts that this makes it unlikely that use of low-powered portable marine VHF radio radios on land will interfere with maritime communications. It also argues that permitting such use will further the public interest by encouraging more boaters to a carry a VHF radio, which has safety benefits not available from CMRS or PRS options because marine VHF channels can be used to contact the Coast Guard and other nearby vessels in a distress situation, for bridge-to-bridge communications, and to receive maritime safety information broadcasts.

27. We agree with commenters that the public interest will be served by allowing the use of portable VHF radios ashore, so long as it is limited to enhancing the usefulness of marine VHF radios without negatively affecting maritime communications. Such limited onshore use will promote flexibility in the use of marine radio equipment in a manner that furthers maritime safety by encouraging more boaters to a carry a VHF radio. Specifically, as suggested by ACR, we will permit use of portable marine VHF radios only in areas adjacent to the water, such as docks and beaches. In addition, as suggested by RTCM, and consistent with our requirements for offshore use, onshore communications using such radios must relate to the operational and business needs of the associated vessel, and must be limited to the minimum practicable transmission time. We amend Section 80.115 accordingly. We caution operators that the Commission’s Enforcement Bureau will continue to investigate complaints against operators who improperly use marine VHF radios, particularly any violation that concerns unauthorized transmissions on 156.800 MHz (VHF Channel 16).

I think this clearly shows that the rules are not "..... stupid and out of date with their de facto policy". The rules and policies are meant to promote maritime safety. Everyone should take a deep breath and exercise some common sense. A couple of real world examples:

At one time, we kept a 28 ft boat in Seward. When I took the dinghy ashore I always carried my Marine VHF HT, but rarely used it. On one occasion, I was on the beach giving the dog a run, and my wife called regarding a boat systems issue. We used proper maritime VHF procedures (call on 16, move to a working channel). I was standing on the beach, next to the dinghy, with the waves lapping against my boots. Although the issue ultimately turned out to be minor, it was clearly related to the safe operation of our vessel.

Later, we sold the boat, but I still do a fair bit of sea kayaking. I always carry my Marine VHF HT, mostly to get NWS Marine Weather info. However, on rare occasions I've used it while standing on the beach, to talk to our water taxi to check on our pick-up when the weather was getting a bit rough on the beach. Again, clearly related to safe maritime operations.

Common sense is that if you are using a marine radio to attend to maritime safety issues, for boats large or small, you are unlikely to get hassled by either the USCG or the FCC, even if standing on the beach. (Assuming you are following proper procedure, hail on 16 then move to a working channel.) However, regarding the OP, standing on a beach fishing does not relate to the operation any vessel, so using a marine radio in that situation is clearly inappropriate.

 

[poxten]

I carry VHF nearshore "just in case". For instance let's say you see an oblivious boat run over a kayaker. Of course AFTER dialing 911 you could try to hail that boat on CH9 or CH16 to turn around and provide assistance, or other nearby vessels. Just an example but in my mind having extra communication is never a bad thing.