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8 ohm speaker, amp is rated for 11 ohms???

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lion2479

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Have an 8 ohm 100 w speaker got from Sirennet, the carson air horn amp is rated for an 11 ohm speaker which is the industry standard for sirens. Would like to know and get help how to hook up the 8 ohm speaker without blowing up the under the hood amp or even the 8 ohm speaker? Any help would be appreciated. Called Carson directly, spoke to the tech and he said to lower the voltage going to the 8 ohm speaker from the battery. Well that didn't help. Had to buy another speaker 11 ohms to be certain I wouldn't destroy the amp.

So guys and gals...If you have an 100w 8 ohm speaker and the amp is rated for 11 ohms, how can I use it. Can I buy resistors? and hook them up in series? Step buy step instructions would be very helpful .

All the best and looking forward to an answer from some of you that are experienced in installation of sirens and or airhorns, etc.

Regards
 

BFGJeep

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Curious if you ever figured this out. I have the opposite issue - I have an 11ohm 100W speaker and am trying to figure out what amp I can use to amplify the signal from my CB (using the speaker as a PA).
 

prcguy

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I don't see any problem running an 8 ohm speaker on an amp or siren rated for 11 ohms since the speaker impedance will vary some anyway across the audio spectrum. Speakers are usually rated for impedance at 1000Hz. The amp or siren mfr probably wants you to buy their specific speaker to make a few extra $$.

At 100w with an 11 ohm speaker the amp would be putting out about 33V and the speaker would be drawing around 3A. The same 100w into an 8 ohm speaker would be about 28V out of the amp and 3.5A of current. If the amp is that critical then its not very well designed and its gonna break anyway.

Not that it would matter much but you could use a 3 ohm resistor in series with the 8 ohm speaker and call it a day. The resistor would be dropping about 5V at .5A which is 2.5W, so a 5W resistor or maybe a 10W would be fine. You would loose a little SPL from the speaker and if you are using cheap speaker wire like 22ga, you already have a couple of ohms resistance between the amp and speaker.
prcguy
 

rescue161

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Put the leads of an Ohm meter on the speaker leads (out of circuit). The meter will display the value.
 

jackj

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You can't get an accurate impedance reading using an ohmmeter. An ohmmeter sends a DC current through the device you want to measure but impedance is a measurement of the device's opposition to an AC current. That opposition will vary with the applied frequency. The DC resistance of the coil is only one portion of the actual impedance.
 

rescue161

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If you take a brand new 8 Ohm speaker and you use a digital multimeter and place the leads on the speaker leads, it will read close to 8 Ohms.
 

krokus

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Close, but it is not an accurate representation of the impedance.

I have seen speakers with a 16 Ohm impedance that show a DC resistance below 2 Ohms.

Sent via Tapatalk
 

rescue161

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If you had a 16 Ohm speaker that was reading 2 Ohms, then I'd say you had a bad speaker.
 

jhooten

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You cannot measure the AC impedance of a speaker with a DC resistance measuring device. You need an Audio impedance meter (google it). A cheap one runs about $170. A good one for someone who makes their living installing audio systems can run near $1k.
 

rescue161

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I realize what you all are saying, but you can get close enough with an Ohm meter. It'll just read a little low. There is no need for a person to spend $170 to check a siren driver. If he measures an 8 Ohm driver and it reads 6.5 Ohms, then it is good. If it reads 20 or 30 Ohms, then it is bad.

If you are doing this for a living, then yes, by all means buy the right equipment. But if a person asks how to check the Ohmic value of a speaker, then a multimeter will suffice.
 

jackj

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I stand by my original statement, you can't measure impedance using an ohmmeter. An ohmmeter will tell you if the voice coil is open but it won't tell you anything about the speaker's impedance. Some low power speakers MIGHT use a wire gauge that will show a DC resistance close to it's impedance but a speaker designed to handle over 100 watts RMS will use larger gauge wire. So the same number of turns around the core will generate the same impedance but show a much smaller DC resistance.
 

jhooten

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Just measured a couple with a DC ohm meter. RadioShack 8 ohm 100 watt horn with 12 feet or 14 gauge zip cord on the work truck 2.3 ohms. Whelen 11 ohm 122 Siren "speaker" 3.7 ohms at the speaker leads, no other wire connected. Both in service and working correctly. Not even close to the rated impedance.
 

rescue161

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I just measured an 8 Ohm 100 Watts driver and got a whopping 6 Ohms. OP, you should do as the others are suggesting and go buy a bunch of expensive equipment to make sure you driver is really what it is. A multimeter is useless... :roll:
 

iamhere300

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I have no experience with this, other than owning a Motorola MSS for a number of years, upfitting hundreds if not thousands of vehicles, and still in the business (although trying to get out and retire or something)

Just hook it up. 3 ohms difference will not make a long squat of difference - that falls well within the engineered variance of both the speaker and the multimeter. With a multimeter you also must consider the resistance of the cables and probes, as well as the parallel resistance of the meter itself.

Hook it up. You will have no problem.
 

krokus

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ok just got my new speakers in, the are supposed to be 200 watts and 11 ohms, i bought this meter

Amazon.com: INNOVA 3320 Auto-Ranging Digital Multimeter: Automotive

put on speaker wires and says 7 ohms on both speakers that i bought

where can i buy a resister that is 4 ohms that will handle 200 watts so i dont blow up my new siren i just got

I see no reason to add a resistor. Speakers with a DC resistance of 7 Ohms could easily have am impedance of 11 Ohms.

If you really want to add resistors, check with the electronic mail order companies, DigiKey, Newark, Jameco, Parts Express and MCM Electronics are good places to deal with. You will want a non wire wound, to not have inductance issues. A 4 Ohm audio dummy load could be an option, but get a large one, that you can use the screw hole mounts to anchor it to your vehicle.

Sent via Tapatalk
 

n5ims

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ok just got my new speakers in, the are supposed to be 200 watts and 11 ohms, i bought this meter

Amazon.com: INNOVA 3320 Auto-Ranging Digital Multimeter: Automotive

put on speaker wires and says 7 ohms on both speakers that i bought

where can i buy a resister that is 4 ohms that will handle 200 watts so i dont blow up my new siren i just got

You're getting ohms (AC) and ohms (DC) confused. While they may appear to be quite similar, they're not.

Your speakers (that 11 ohms rating) is the impedance rating (Speaker Impedance Explained - Ohms). To measure this, you need an instrument that measures impedance. This isn't the same as DC resistance.

Your new meter is designed to measure volts (both DC and AC using different settings) and DC resistance. It is not designed to measure impedance.

The 7 ohms you got on your speakers is the DC resistance of the wire that makes up the voice coil (a long string of thin wire wrapped in a coil that's generally placed around a magnet). When an AC signal (nearly always an audio signal) is sent through this coil, it causes a magnetic field to be generated, causing the attached paper speaker cone to vibrate in sync with this signal so you can hear that audio signal.

Had that signal been DC (like when using your meter), the coil will simply move one way or the other, depending on the polarity of the voltage. While you may hear a single thud, you won't hear much else. It's likely that you won't hear much of a thud unless your voltage is fairly strong and if it's too strong, you could easily burn out the voice coil (it's not designed to handle DC).

Yea, it's a shame that both DC resistance and AC impedance both use the term "Ohm", but that's the way it is. If you want more proof that an ohm isn't always an ohm (and additional proof that your multi-meter isn't designed to measure the impedance style ohms), take a good piece of scanner coax and make sure that you just have coax being measured (connectors are OK, but no scanner, no radio, no antenna) and put your multi-meter across the coax. Your 50 ohm coax (or perhaps 75 ohm if you use TV coax) should measure infinite resistance (or an open connection). Short the other end of the coax and you'll get zero ohms (or a very small value depending on how long - how much DC resistance the wire has). That doesn't indicate bad coax, just your tool is measuring something else entirely.

See this for a more detailed explanation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_impedance). With DC, you only have resistance along a straight line, so it's a simple measurement (generally E = I R, solving for R you get R = E / I). With AC, you have resistance, reactance (both inductive reactance and capacitive reactance), and the phase angle between voltage and current causing a much more complex equation (see the link for them, the math is too complex for me to show here, especially the part where they include both the real and imaginary parts of the number system).
 
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scottyhetzel

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I do this kind of work for a living, the bottom line is you need to read what ohm of a speaker the amp can handle, ohms change when voice coils. The lower the ohms the more the speaker outputs. You want to run the lowest ohm speaker your amp can handle. Analog amps get hot when they run low impedance speakers. You can also run to 11 ohm speakers in parallel to lower the ohms down to a 6 ohm level. Most siren speakers are usually 8ohms. Speakers are generally 8 or 4 ohms. The manufacture will always tell you the lowest ohms the amp/siren can handle. Running too low of an impedance(ohm) will make the amp run very hot and make the siren sound loud , however the amp will eventually fail due to over loading. I hope this makes sense.
 

prcguy

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In addition to the good info on speakers being rated in AC resistance, or impedance and not measurable with an ohm meter, here is something else to consider.

Speaker impedance is almost always measured at 1KHz and will vary around some with frequency, especially a speaker system with crossover, etc. So, an 8 ohm rated speaker will be 8 ohms impedance at 1KHz but may be 5 ohms at another frequency or 15ohms or more somewhere else.

Many sirens are fixed level output and need to operate into a specific impedance speaker to meet power output specs. For a typical 100w siren intended to be used with an 11 ohm speaker the amplifier would be putting out around 33 volts of audio and the 11 ohm speaker would draw around 3 amps which equals 100w.

Change the speaker to 8 ohms and the siren is still outputting about 33 volts of audio but the 8 ohm speaker is drawing around 4.1 amps, which is now about 134 watts. The amplifier will probably be fine and it will be a little louder with everything else equal.

Tack on a 4 ohm speaker to a 100w siren with a fixed output level of 33 volts and the speaker will try to draw about 8.3 amps or 275 watts from the amplifier, which is not going to happen. It will get loud and distorted due to the amplifier clipping and not being able to produce the power or current needed and it might even fail within a couple of minutes.

So, if your siren calls for an 11 ohm speaker its mostly because its designed to feed an 11 ohm speaker and of course a little to do with making sure you can only buy a speaker from them for extra profit.

If the siren is going in a public service vehicle I would never deviate from the recommended speaker type If it were my personal vehicle and I only had an 8 ohm speaker I would not hesitate to use that.
prcguy

Edit:
I failed to read the entire thread and now see I posted basically the same info 6mo ago. Oops. Well, here is something I can add to post # 16 about installing a 4 ohm resistor, which is not needed but if it was you would not need a 200w version.

If the speaker actually was 7 ohms and not 11 and you added a 4 ohm resistor to compensate, the resistor would only be dissipating about 36 watts. With a total of 11 ohms and 100w you have about 3 amps of current. A 7 ohm speaker would drop about 21 of the 33 volts and the 4 ohm resistor would be dropping about 12 volts, 12 volts X 3 amps is 36 watts. A 50 watt resistor would be fine in that scenario.

But you don't need to add a resistor because your new speaker is rated at the recommended 11 ohms impedance. Hook it up and be happy.
 
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