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BC346XTC Programming a Trunk System with a splinter frequency in it

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N737AA

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Just got a BC346XTC for Christmas and programmed in the entire Oklahoma State System

Oklahoma Wireless Interoperability Network (OKWIN) Motorola Trunking System, Various, Oklahoma - Scanner Frequencies

into the scanner and it works great except for one site. My local Owasso PD is on the following site with the following frequencies.

Site Name County Freqs
037 (25) Owasso Tulsa 851.43750 851.96250 852.88750 853.38750a 853.88750c

I am not receiving all of the transmissions on the site. I have noticed that the display "toggles" from the control channel frequency to another frequency (can't tell what it is because it just goes back and forth very quickly and then sometimes I will hear parts of a conversation all ready in progress. This leads me to believe something is not programmed in this site correctly.

The Oklahoma forum also had a recent thread that indicated that the following frequencies were added to this site (although the RR database doesn't list them...yet):

851.6375 852.4250 853.6375

So since I set this site up with the two control channel frequencies, the way I understand it I shouldn't have to add any of the other frequencies for the site...correct?

I have done alot of reading the last few days and if I understand things correctly the freq of 852.4250 is a splinter frequency...correct?

I went ahead and added all of the frequencies for this site and still am missing transmissions. This system is programmed as a normal 800/900 trunking system. I did try to switch it to a splinter system and got nothing when I did that. I have noticed that I am getting hits on two of the three new frequencies added to the site but never 852.4250. I suspect that my problem revolves around this frequency.

Now for the interesting part, the Owasso PD talkgroup also is transmitted on the Tulsa site (001) and when I monitor it on that site it seems I get every transmission. I assume it has to do with the fact that I have no problems on the Tulsa site and the Owasso TGID's are some sort of simulcast from the Owasso site. The problem with this is the Owasso TGIDs are not always active on the Tulsa site.

Being new to this multisite trunking systems theory I think it is because there are no radios from the Owasso site tuned to the Tulsa site so I only hear the Owasso TGIDs on the Tulsa site when an Owasso site radio is tuned to the Tulsa site....is this a correct assumption?

If I understand the way some systems work, I think this site might require some sort of band plan to track the traffic assigned to use the splinter freq of 852.4250.

Any ideas?

Note:
I've tried the Oklahoma forum, but haven't gotten any replies yet as it is one of the lessor monitored sites in the system. Thought someone from this forum could help in some fashion.

My BC346XTC says it has firmware v1.00.10 which I understand it the only version for the XTC model.

Thanks,

N737AA
Tulsa, Oklahoma
 

hiegtx

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Premium Subscriber
Joined
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Messages
6,115
Location
Dallas, TX
Just got a BC346XTC for Christmas and programmed in the entire Oklahoma State System

Oklahoma Wireless Interoperability Network (OKWIN) Motorola Trunking System, Various, Oklahoma - Scanner Frequencies

into the scanner and it works great except for one site. My local Owasso PD is on the following site with the following frequencies.

Site Name County Freqs
037 (25) Owasso Tulsa 851.43750 851.96250 852.88750 853.38750a 853.88750c

I am not receiving all of the transmissions on the site. I have noticed that the display "toggles" from the control channel frequency to another frequency (can't tell what it is because it just goes back and forth very quickly and then sometimes I will hear parts of a conversation all ready in progress. This leads me to believe something is not programmed in this site correctly.

The Oklahoma forum also had a recent thread that indicated that the following frequencies were added to this site (although the RR database doesn't list them...yet):

851.6375 852.4250 853.6375

So since I set this site up with the two control channel frequencies, the way I understand it I shouldn't have to add any of the other frequencies for the site...correct?
That's correct. You only need the control channel frequencies. However, it's also possible that one of those other three frequencies may occasionally be used as a control channel. All of the frequencies for that site can be found here.

I have done alot of reading the last few days and if I understand things correctly the freq of 852.4250 is a splinter frequency...correct?
That's not correct in your case. Splinter systems are those near the US borders. See farther below.

I went ahead and added all of the frequencies for this site and still am missing transmissions. This system is programmed as a normal 800/900 trunking system. I did try to switch it to a splinter system and got nothing when I did that. I have noticed that I am getting hits on two of the three new frequencies added to the site but never 852.4250. I suspect that my problem revolves around this frequency.

Now for the interesting part, the Owasso PD talkgroup also is transmitted on the Tulsa site (001) and when I monitor it on that site it seems I get every transmission. I assume it has to do with the fact that I have no problems on the Tulsa site and the Owasso TGID's are some sort of simulcast from the Owasso site. The problem with this is the Owasso TGIDs are not always active on the Tulsa site.

Being new to this multisite trunking systems theory I think it is because there are no radios from the Owasso site tuned to the Tulsa site so I only hear the Owasso TGIDs on the Tulsa site when an Owasso site radio is tuned to the Tulsa site....is this a correct assumption?
That's correct. The system is set up to carry traffic from units in each zone. Calls from other areas are not carried unless a unit from that zone is present, with radio tuned to their 'home' talkgroup. See this Wiki article for more information.

If I understand the way some systems work, I think this site might require some sort of band plan to track the traffic assigned to use the splinter freq of 852.4250.

Any ideas?

Note:
I've tried the Oklahoma forum, but haven't gotten any replies yet as it is one of the lessor monitored sites in the system. Thought someone from this forum could help in some fashion.

My BC346XTC says it has firmware v1.00.10 which I understand it the only version for the XTC model.

Thanks,

N737AA
Tulsa, Oklahoma
Your frequency of 852.4250 falls into the category of those that require a custom band plan due to rebanding. While the main Tulsa simulcast site (Site 1 on OKWIN) does not require custom tables, any site that does would need to be set up as Custom/Rebanded. As Owasso appears to include 852.4250, then it should not be set up as a 'standard' or 'normal'. If you use FreeSCAN, set that site to Mot Custom/Reband Type II. The custom tables that you need to enter, and how to do that via software, can be found here. If you are programming directly via the scanner's keyboard, see these directions from the 'Easier to Read' manual.
 

N737AA

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Joined
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Messages
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That's correct. You only need the control channel frequencies. However, it's also possible that one of those other three frequencies may occasionally be used as a control channel. All of the frequencies for that site can be found here.

That's not correct in your case. Splinter systems are those near the US borders. See farther below.

That's correct. The system is set up to carry traffic from units in each zone. Calls from other areas are not carried unless a unit from that zone is present, with radio tuned to their 'home' talkgroup. See this Wiki article for more information.

Your frequency of 852.4250 falls into the category of those that require a custom band plan due to rebanding. While the main Tulsa simulcast site (Site 1 on OKWIN) does not require custom tables, any site that does would need to be set up as Custom/Rebanded. As Owasso appears to include 852.4250, then it should not be set up as a 'standard' or 'normal'. If you use FreeSCAN, set that site to Mot Custom/Reband Type II. The custom tables that you need to enter, and how to do that via software, can be found here. If you are programming directly via the scanner's keyboard, see these directions from the 'Easier to Read' manual.
I don't have the USB1 cable for my laptop so I have been entering everything in manual from the keypad on the scanner. I understand how to enter a custom band plan but I am not sure how to determine the correct Base Freq (lower) Base Freq (upper) Offset Polarity Spacing entries needed for this site. How does one go about figuring that out. I entered band plan 1 to be 851.025/854.000/440/+/25khz respectivly and that didn't do the trick. I am still receiving some tranmissions but not sure what I am missing now if any.

This system has another site that requires a custom band plan:
015 (F) Vinita Craig 851.55000 852.08750c 852.58750a 853.22500 853.71250

The entries for that one are 851.000/858.000/560/-/12.5khz respectively. Not sure if that is relative or not.

Thanks,
N737AA
 

hiegtx

Mentor
Premium Subscriber
Joined
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Messages
6,115
Location
Dallas, TX
I don't have the USB1 cable for my laptop so I have been entering everything in manual from the keypad on the scanner. I understand how to enter a custom band plan but I am not sure how to determine the correct Base Freq (lower) Base Freq (upper) Offset Polarity Spacing entries needed for this site. How does one go about figuring that out. I entered band plan 1 to be 851.025/854.000/440/+/25khz respectivly and that didn't do the trick. I am still receiving some tranmissions but not sure what I am missing now if any.

This system has another site that requires a custom band plan:
015 (F) Vinita Craig 851.55000 852.08750c 852.58750a 853.22500 853.71250

The entries for that one are 851.000/858.000/560/-/12.5khz respectively. Not sure if that is relative or not.

Thanks,
N737AA
You need to enter both lines 1 & 2. The values shown on the Easier to Read site, as well as on the 'Software Support' page I linked previously are the same. That should work for Owasso. If, after entering both lines, it does not, then it's possible that a different custom plan is requried. For that, you would need to run a utility such as Unitrunker, using the control channel data to decode the data stream.

Vinita does appear to be an exception, documented in the Wiki. You can also 'add' an additional "Owasso" site (Owasso2), using the Vinita band plan, and see if that works. Might be worth a try. I haven't seen any other posts in the OK forum about reception problems on that specific site (Owasso). Didn't find one with a quick search.
 

N737AA

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Messages
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OK didn't realize I had to enter the data for band plan 1 and band plan 2. Will do that.

The Owasso site isn't one of the more popular sites in the system so not sure it has hit anyone's radar screen yet. These frequencies were just added recently so again probably not on anyone's radar yet.

Thanks for the prompt help,
N737AA
 
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