Byonics RTG & Trimble Placer 450 -- Info Wanted

[kc8mln]

I am looking for info about the use of the Byonics RTG unit for APRS with the Trimble Placer 450.

If anyone else has ALREADY done a setup using both of these, then please email
me info about hookup of the units together and about programming of each, the
RTG and of the Placer 450.

I need to know which ports on the Placer 450 to use to obtain my GPS output for
the RTG (more specifically, is the hookup wiring straight through or in what
configuration do I need to wire/make a cable to connect them together) because I
dont want to damage either unit.

I am using a Trimble Placer 450 GPS received because I want to also have a
second GPS output available to feed into my laptop for software mapping
purposes, so that's why I selected (and have already obtained) the Placer 450's and I already have the RTG units also, just need the wiring/hookup info

So, if anyone has direct info about how to hookup/wire the RTG and Placer 450,
please let me know.....Also, I need to know what programming I need to do within
the Placer 450 (I recall that I was told that I need to configure the 450 for it's output format and such) and also program the RTG unit too

~Thanks!

 

[kc8mln]

really?,...no responses yet.....lol, I find it hard to believe that I'm the only one that uses this setup! So, if anyone does have the info I'm looking for, please let me know. ~Thanks!

 

[N5TWB]

Slow your roll, we'll get here eventually...

OK, I have an RTG and I'm still trying to wrap my head around why you want to add the Trimble unit. The name, Ready To Go, is why I bought the Byonics unit -- a straightforward package APRS solution without overhead. It has a GPS antenna puck/receiver, a 144.39 transmitter, and an antenna. In your case, I'd say your Trimble unit then takes care of GPS for your computer software.

I know I've got to be missing something because that just seems too easy-peazy...

 

[kc8mln]

What you're missing is that I am NOT using a GPS receiver that "came" with the RTG.......I have the "basic" RTG units, where I didn't purchase the combo pack that included a GPS receiver because I already had one,...my Trimble Placer 450

The Byonics RTG is a lil black box with a 2-meter transmitter tuned to the USA APRS Frequency and a TinyTrak chip to convert the NEMA GPS data into sendit to the 10-watt APRS transmitter.....The RTG itself does NOT have an "onboard" GPS receiver, you have to supply your own GPS receiver and then pump the gps data INTO the RTG...That's because the ACTUAL unit of the RTG is ONLY a 10-watt APRS transmitter and a TinyTrak

I selected the RTG because I wanted a APRS transmitter and TinkTrak combined in a small little package and the RTG fit the bill of what I wanted, so I don't have to tie up a seperate mobile radio as my APRS transmitter, when I didn't need to have a receiver, so I saw no need (in MY application) to use a mobile radio, but instead the RTG since it only had the transmitter...

I use the Trimble Placer 450 GPS receiver to output the NEMA GPS data into the RTG, which then beacons my position data out on the APRS network......

As I said previously, I already had the Trimble Placer 450 units, and they have dual outputs, so I can send one set of gps position data to the RTG for my APRS and the other output is fed into my laptop, so I can use my mapping and overlay my current position in my mapping software that I use....

This is the application and setup I am going to use, but I am looking to find out from others that have already done this exact setup......Is there any special wiring/programming I need to do with the Placer to the RTG. Also, just wondered if I needed to use a specific output port of ther 450 for the RTG or does it not matter and I can use either output port on the 450

Hope this helps to explain my application

 

[N5TWB]

What you're missing is that I am NOT using a GPS receiver that "came" with the RTG.......I have the "basic" RTG units, where I didn't purchase the combo pack that included a GPS receiver because I already had one,...my Trimble Placer 450

The Byonics RTG is a lil black box with a 2-meter transmitter tuned to the USA APRS Frequency and a TinyTrak chip to convert the NEMA GPS data into sendit to the 10-watt APRS transmitter.....The RTG itself does NOT have an "onboard" GPS receiver, you have to supply your own GPS receiver and then pump the gps data INTO the RTG...That's because the ACTUAL unit of the RTG is ONLY a 10-watt APRS transmitter and a TinyTrak

I selected the RTG because I wanted a APRS transmitter and TinkTrak combined in a small little package and the RTG fit the bill of what I wanted, so I don't have to tie up a seperate mobile radio as my APRS transmitter, when I didn't need to have a receiver, so I saw no need (in MY application) to use a mobile radio, but instead the RTG since it only had the transmitter...

I use the Trimble Placer 450 GPS receiver to output the NEMA GPS data into the RTG, which then beacons my position data out on the APRS network......

As I said previously, I already had the Trimble Placer 450 units, and they have dual outputs, so I can send one set of gps position data to the RTG for my APRS and the other output is fed into my laptop, so I can use my mapping and overlay my current position in my mapping software that I use....

This is the application and setup I am going to use, but I am looking to find out from others that have already done this exact setup......Is there any special wiring/programming I need to do with the Placer to the RTG. Also, just wondered if I needed to use a specific output port of ther 450 for the RTG or does it not matter and I can use either output port on the 450

Hope this helps to explain my application

I am not doing what you are but I wanted you to know somebody was seeing what you've posted and was interested. You're doing something I've thought about. However, I don't have a Trimble or its documentation/software. As you likely know, the website is lacking this, too.

BTW, I now understand about the RTG after referring to the web site. My error was thinking it was all about the full package like I purchased 18 months ago.

I'm sorry that it seems I've wasted your time but I wish you well in finding a resource to get the Trimble documentation and software you need to ensure the NEMA output and the pin data info.

 

[kc8mln]

Didn't waste my time at all...

I already have the documentation and software for the Trimble Placer 450.....I contacted the manufacture and surprisingly they were VERY willing to be helpful and provided all of it to me free of charge via email.

I'm just not too familiar yet (I havent really had too much time to try play around with the Placer 450 software) with the programming and I havent actually looked at the documentation for the pinouts for the Placer and the RTG......I just figured that if someone else had already done this setup, that they could share a little info with me and it would be faster than me trying to go through all of the documentation and figure it out myself, but I guess that's what I'll have to do.

I do look forward to getting this setup hooked up and on the air here soon. I picked up the RTG units at Dayton Hamvention and I've had the Placer 450's since my local surplus state auction in October of last year. I've been planniing this setup for some time and now that I have all the equipment I need, I look forward to getting it hookedup and on air in my vehicles here sometime soon.

 

[LtDoc]

Not having a Trimble Placer 450 but having a Byonic 'RTG', I honestly don't see the point. That RTG requires a GPS receiver, an antenna and a power source. Byonic has an affordable GPS receiver, and any 2 meter antenna with the appropriate connector (SMA) will work just fine.
I know nothing about that Trimble Placer 450 so tell me why you want to use it?
- 'Doc

 

[jparks29]

Very few Trimble 450's put out NMEA, and those that did, were 9600.

Most were a proprietary protocol.

I ended up bricking mine when I tried to change the f/w to an nmea unit...

 

[kc8mln]

That's not correct, the NMEA output is a "standard" output for the Placer 450 and is verified by all the documentation I have for it and when I spoke with the technician directly at Trimble about this application. The NMEA output protocal was a standard for being sent to radio modems and MDT terminals....

I just checked the Trimble Placer 450 maunal and have verified that NMEA output is available and selectable by selecting the output mode via TAIP programming. This NMEA output is specified on the following pages of the manual: 2-2; 3-5; A-31

I may setup my own Yagoo Group or webpage for this setup and application for use of the Byonics RTG (less the GPS receiver) and the Trimble Placer 450 if (for some reason) I am the first to use this setup for APRS applications

 

[jparks29]

That's not correct, the NMEA output is a "standard" output for the Placer 450 and is verified by all the documentation I have for it and when I spoke with the technician directly at Trimble about this application. The NMEA output protocal was a standard for being sent to radio modems and MDT terminals....

I just checked the Trimble Placer 450 maunal and have verified that NMEA output is available and selectable by selecting the output mode via TAIP programming. This NMEA output is specified on the following pages of the manual: 2-2; 3-5; A-31

I may setup my own Yagoo Group or webpage for this setup and application for use of the Byonics RTG (less the GPS receiver) and the Trimble Placer 450 if (for some reason) I am the first to use this setup for APRS applications

...and every time the unit resets, it goes back to the proprietary protocol.

You don't have to believe me or anything, not like I spent a ton of time on the phone or sent emails back and forth with Trimble..

If you got an NMEA only 450/455, good.

So, unless 2 different Trimble techs were lying to me.......

 

[kc8mln]

I checked the documentation that I have for my Placer 450 and it states that it supports NMEA format in $GPGGA sentences ( which is one of the format/sequences that the RTG & TinyTrak units accept for data input) and the Placer 450 is capable of Baud Rates of 300, 600, 1200, 2400, 4800, 9600, 19200, & 38400

The available data output formats are user selectable via programming are are: TAIP, TSIP, NMEA, RTCM, CDPD, MAP27, and (455) Transparent

I also really like the option to add a user supplied switch to manually trigger a position/location GPS fix that can be pushed out to the TinyTrak, thus allowing me to manually trigger a capture of my current location via pushing a user bupplied pushbutton switch. This is controlled via the Placer 450's Digital I/O and allows a max of 2-seperate "events" that can be configured as an "alarm event capture" to beacon the units current GPS position manually.

....More info to come regarding my progress with this setup!

The Placer 450 IS equiped with an onboard lithium battery to preserve critical memory data and settinigs. If your Placer unit is loosing it's memory configuration, then I would strongly suggest to check the on-board lithium memory battery to ensure that it is still properly functional, because if the on-board lithium memory battery were to be bad, then that would directly cause loss of memory settings and thus reverting back to the original factory programmed protocols.

In addition, to help prevent memory loss as saved in the Placer 450 memory, it is suggested to use the "Ignition Sense" and "Memory Keep Alive" power hookups, where one wire is constant 12VDC+ from the battery for the "Memory Keep Alive" and then the "Ignition Sense" is a switched 12VDC+ fed from the vehicle's ignition switched system, so that upon powering the vehicle off, it does a "Soft-Shutdown" of the Placer 450, which the memory is preserved using the constant fed power on the "Memory Keep Alive"...Upon powering the vehicle back up, the Placer will then begin a "Soft-Boot" sequence and also acquire GPS satellite signals to compute position in less than 50 seconds (typical), when used with the "Memory Keep Alive" and "soft-boot" sequence.

So, according to the documentation that I have for my Placer 450, it is fully capable of the desired operations and that it will not loose it's memory settings if the on-board memory battery is properly functioning.

 

[LtDoc]

The 'RTG' can be programmed to transmit a position on demand. That's a built-in function not only of the 'RTG' but of most of the APRS transmitters Byonic sells (I think, I don't own all of them).
I'm still not sure why you are using that Placer 450 for only a GPS receiver. If it's because you happen to have it and not a GPS receiver, then that's certainly a legitimate reason. But if that Placer 450 was purchased solely for use of it's GPS receiver then I think you may be over-doing it a bit. If it has other uses for you, that's a different story. (Or most likely, I just don't understand why you're doing it that way.)
- 'Doc

 

[kc8mln]

***UPDATE***

After spending some time reading over the manual for the RTG and the Trimble Placer 450, and also having spoken to the lead Tech at Trimble who deals with the Placer 450's I WAS able to get them up and running....

I had to "reFlash" the Placer 450's with the newest version of firmware (Ver 2.50) and then do some programming of the Placer 450 to the settings that I needed, then I programmed the RTG and connected the units together, and then I was ON AIR! beaconing my APRS, so YES, this setup WILL easily work and is very effectivy for MY needs......

So, I think that I may setup a webpage to halp others who want to use this same setup, since The Trimble Placer 450's can be readily had from Ebay for around approx $20/each......Plus, the Placer 450's are commercially built for super accurate and demanding applications, from aircraft to public safety...

I will get the webpage up with the info and then report back here with a link, but it will be a lil while before I get to the webpage creation, because I gotta finish up a few more demanding projects and get a couple of these 450's "on-air" in my vehicles...

Again, I HAVE been able to get the Trimble Placer 450 to work for APRS along with a Byonics RTG FA 10-wall transmitter with the TinyTrak3 chip....So, ne need to go buy a seperate GPS receiver, when the Placer 450's are readily available for around $20/each, so if you would want to use a Trimble Placer 450 for your APRS station, then check Ebay!............plus, it helped that I happened to have a box of them just laying around that I had gotten from a local government surplus equipment auction.

 

[kc8mln]

I have created a Yahoo Group covering this topic about how to setup and configure a Trimble Placer 450 GPS receiver for use with APRS.

Link to my yahoo group:-> APRS_Trimble_Placer_450 : APRS & Trimble Placer 450