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Desperately Need a Solution

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#1
I co-own a small security company; we have just a few employees. We are currently using the Kenwood TK-373G-2 470-490 MHz 4W handheld radios and for our mobile radios we are using the Kenwood TK-863G units 450-490 MHz 25W. We are using a radio service provider for our Trunked repeater frequencies, which are TX 474-475 RX 471-472 and the repeater is located somewhere in a mountain called “Pleasant Peek” located somewhere in south Orange County, CA . That’s all the info. I have on the repeater system.

Now here’s my dilemma… Some of our accounts are spread-out over a distance of 20 to 30 miles. For those of you who are familiar with Southern Calif, we’re servicing properties between Chino Hills, Long Beach, to Montebello. When communicating over the radios whether through the mobile or portable radios, 90% of the time it is pure static, and the other person simply cannot hear what is being said, then we resort to using our cell phones (Which defeats the purpose of even having a radio service!) Another problem that we are experiencing is: On a pretty regular basis when one person keys-up on the radio, the radio beeps which indicates the radio is “Connected” to the repeater and that he or she can at that point speak into the radio. However, the transmission is not being received on any other radio. No one else hears or even knows that there is radio traffic. It’s just lost in space.

I have brought these issues up with the radio service provider; he is completely baffled by the problem, and cannot figure out why we’re having these issues. So, here I am, desperately seeking an answer and a resolution to the problem before one of my employees ends up being hurt because he or she cannot call for help.

I have a couple questions:
1) What is the most cost-effective solution for this problem?
2) Would mobile repeaters, antenna extenders, or a combination of the two solve our problem, if not, what will?

Please keep in mind that I am not a radio savvy individual, and if you speak in technical radio terms, I promise that I will have absolutely no clue what you’re talking about. So, please keep it as simple as possible, dumb-it-down if you will. Thanks.
 
Joined
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#2
Have you tryed to contact any other users on the system and see if they are also having problems?

If you have been working with this provider and they do not have answer, then I would say you need to look at another provider
 
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New Orleans region
#3
I am not a strong supporter of a radio shop that seems to be turning a deaf ear on coverage problems a customer is having. Maybe it's time to look at another service provider.

Another choice would be to consider using cell phones. Your probably able to get service for about the same price your paying the radio shop for use of their repeater trunking system.

Look around and see what your options are and what it will cost.
 
Joined
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#4
I am pretty familiar with the coverage area of Pleasants Peak. If you look at the top of the Santa Ana mountains at the big "golf ball" weather radar, that's Pleasants Peak.

For the most part, you should have good mobile coverage in most of the areas you mentioned. In Long Beach, I can see where you might have difficulty with portables. Being surrounded by buildings and trees, then being 30 miles away from the repeater site is not conducive to good communications. Coverage is also dependent on which specific building the trunked system is in, and it's antennas.

Chino Hills should be rock solid reliable. If not, there are either problems with the system, your radios, or both. If you can see the site and still not talk, then something is seriously wrong somewhere.

Beyond that, it's impossible to say what the problem might be. We don't have sufficient information. I'd start with having the service provider give you a demonstration that the radios actually work and all talk to each other. If that happens at your office, or the service providers office, it doesn't matter. Start with verifying that the radios are even capable of working half decently in controlled conditions, within line of site to the mountain top.

Then, see if you can determine specifically what the circumstances are that they don't work, and how poorly - is it just static in some areas, or maybe the other radios are completely unaware someone is trying to talk. These problems are easy to diagnose if a competent tech can actually observe it happening.

Once the specific problems are identified, then you can discuss cost effective solutions.
 
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#5
Have you tryed to contact any other users on the system and see if they are also having problems?

If you have been working with this provider and they do not have answer, then I would say you need to look at another provider
No, I have no idea who we share the system with or if they're experiencing the same issues as we are.

I have tried looking up other radio service providers, but haven't had any luck finding any. The search results either come back with radio stations for commercial ads/marketing slots, cell phone providers, or sites that sell commercial radios.
 
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#6
I am not a strong supporter of a radio shop that seems to be turning a deaf ear on coverage problems a customer is having. Maybe it's time to look at another service provider.

Another choice would be to consider using cell phones. Your probably able to get service for about the same price your paying the radio shop for use of their repeater trunking system.

Look around and see what your options are and what it will cost.
Neither am I. As you can imagine, my level of frustration is on the rise. Especially with a "service Provider" that appears to not care about customer service whatsoever.

As far as using cell phones, that would be fine, but when someone needs quick access to some sort of communication, or when he or she is in a dangerous or potentially dangerous position, it isn't that easy to call a time-out and dial a number. Simply pushing a button and speaking to relay a message is easier when in a tough spot.
 
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#7
I am pretty familiar with the coverage area of Pleasants Peak. If you look at the top of the Santa Ana mountains at the big "golf ball" weather radar, that's Pleasants Peak.

For the most part, you should have good mobile coverage in most of the areas you mentioned. In Long Beach, I can see where you might have difficulty with portables. Being surrounded by buildings and trees, then being 30 miles away from the repeater site is not conducive to good communications. Coverage is also dependent on which specific building the trunked system is in, and it's antennas.

Chino Hills should be rock solid reliable. If not, there are either problems with the system, your radios, or both. If you can see the site and still not talk, then something is seriously wrong somewhere.

Beyond that, it's impossible to say what the problem might be. We don't have sufficient information. I'd start with having the service provider give you a demonstration that the radios actually work and all talk to each other. If that happens at your office, or the service providers office, it doesn't matter. Start with verifying that the radios are even capable of working half decently in controlled conditions, within line of site to the mountain top.

Then, see if you can determine specifically what the circumstances are that they don't work, and how poorly - is it just static in some areas, or maybe the other radios are completely unaware someone is trying to talk. These problems are easy to diagnose if a competent tech can actually observe it happening.

Once the specific problems are identified, then you can discuss cost effective solutions.
That is what our service provider said. Our chino hills area does have the best coverage so far. He have had minimal issues there. We have had our radios looked at and they say they're working properly, and the service provider has sent a technician to check out the repeater and said there are no issues there as well. I'm thinking it's merely the distance and buildings that are creating the problems which is made me think about mobile repeaters and/or antenna extenders. I've even though about putting up a tower in a weak area just to boost coverage.
 
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#8
...We have had our radios looked at and they say they're working properly...
And you've personally observed that the radios actually operate ok in a known good coverage area?

I'm thinking it's merely the distance and buildings that are creating the problems which is made me think about mobile repeaters and/or antenna extenders.
You shouldn't have to do that. What you need to do is find a service provider that offers multi-site service with coverage where you need it. They're out there.

I've even though about putting up a tower in a weak area just to boost coverage.
You shouldn't have to do that, either. You'll also find out just how expensive that idea is. You mentioned "cost effective". That's not it.

Talk top your service provider about multi-site coverage. If they can't offer it, ask who does. If they don't know, start looking elsewhere. A Google search will pull up a dozen local companies offering repeater service. At least one of them can help you.
 

CraigBassett

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#9
Craig Bassett

There are a number of Kenwood SMR Operators in the LA Area. Some are using LTR and some are using Nexedge. As the Factory Represetative I am responsible for servicing these Dealers. You should not be experiencing this problem and I invite you to contact me.
 

SB-Wi

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#10
No, I have no idea who we share the system with or if they're experiencing the same issues as we are.

I have tried looking up other radio service providers, but haven't had any luck finding any. The search results either come back with radio stations for commercial ads/marketing slots, cell phone providers, or sites that sell commercial radios.
Did you try looking in the database? Trunking systems are at the bottom of the page and you can click on the map at the top for surrounding counties. Orange County, California (CA) Scanner Frequencies and Radio Frequency Reference
 
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#11
No, I did not. Again, as I had mentioned before; I am NOT a radio savvy individual. Even though you were not speaking in technical radio terms - a non-radio Intellect person would not have thought to look there. But, thank you. I am sure that will be useful.
 
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#12
No, I did not. Again, as I had mentioned before; I am NOT a radio savvy individual. Even though you were not speaking in technical radio terms - a non-radio Intellect person would not have thought to look there. But, thank you. I am sure that will be useful.
Look up a couple of posts. The individual who services the Kenwood deals is a known reputable dealer in Southern California. He would be a good resource to look into.
 
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#13
There are a number of Kenwood SMR Operators in the LA Area. Some are using LTR and some are using Nexedge. As the Factory Represetative I am responsible for servicing these Dealers. You should not be experiencing this problem and I invite you to contact me.
As Mr. Bassett does not have enough post's for you to either PM or email him thru here, post your email here and maybe he will see it and contact you.

As said in the last post, he is a very good resource.
 

03msc

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#17
Remember to keep us posted on what you find out and what, if anything, is done to correct the problem. Even if you don't want to give details (like who you use, or who else you call, by name) the basic information will let everyone know your problem was resolved. Hopefully you can get it corrected soon and maybe it will be a simple fix.
 
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#18
Without saying which business, but... I have already been in contact with one of the service providers that you posted a link to. I asked to merely test a frequency to make sure it will work for what we need, and was told "No, trust me, just sign a 2 year contract." (Wait a minute; I'm the customer here, you want me to sign a contract which make me legally obligated to continue to pay you for 24 months no matter and what without first testing the frequency, are you kidding me???) If you want our business, we're going to test the frequency FIRST or forget it. If not, we'll find someone else. With the current issue that we’re experiencing, I just cannot bring myself to blindly sign a 2 year contract with a mere promise that it will work and suffice our needs and/or requirements. That just reminds me of a cheesy car salesman with a shady grin saying "Trust me, you do not need to test-drive this beauty, let’s just sign the papers, and I'll have you on the road in no time!" Yeah........No thanks!
 

03msc

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#19
Without saying which business, but... I have already been in contact with one of the service providers that you posted a link to. I asked to merely test a frequency to make sure it will work for what we need, and was told "No, trust me, just sign a 2 year contract." (Wait a minute; I'm the customer here, you want me to sign a contract which make me legally obligated to continue to pay you for 24 months no matter and what without first testing the frequency, are you kidding me???) If you want our business, we're going to test the frequency FIRST or forget it. If not, we'll find someone else. With the current issue that we’re experiencing, I just cannot bring myself to blindly sign a 2 year contract with a mere promise that it will work and suffice our needs and/or requirements. That just reminds me of a cheesy car salesman with a shady grin saying "Trust me, you do not need to test-drive this beauty, let’s just sign the papers, and I'll have you on the road in no time!" Yeah........No thanks!
Reminds me of the "show me the carfax" carfox commercials...with the cheesy used car salesman ignoring the request. Yeah, I wouldn't be comfortable with that, either.
 
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#20
Reminds me of the "show me the carfax" carfox commercials...with the cheesy used car salesman ignoring the request. Yeah, I wouldn't be comfortable with that, either.
Yeah, no kidding. They act like we're going to steal their frequency. I own a business, I'm not in the habit of telling my customers no. Asking to test their service for a few days is not asking a lot and is more than reasonable. If their radio system is as good as they claim, then what's the problem? in my company, we require a 1 year contract for service, some clients aren't comfortable with that. So, I'm confident with the quality of our service to provide a month or two without the contract being signed; by the end of the "trial period" they are more than willing to sign. We're an excellent company, we provide a great service, and not afraid to let a client test us before committing. What are they hiding that they're so afraid to let us test their frequency? If it's as good as they say, I'll sign their contract with absolutely no hesitation. Until then my answer is no. Sorry, but I have to see for myself. And that is more than fair.
 
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