DMR Signal - No Voice Heard on DSD+

[rkillins]

I am trying to listen in to a local utility company (WNH) who use a single DMR frequncy.

Using DSD+ fastlane, I've programmed the frequency into CC and I can see the green line become active when I assume there is a transmission. This coincides with a line popping up on the white line where the vertical frequncy placeholder is. DSD+ is run through a 1R.bat configuration. and the role is set as passive monitor. Raw Source audio monitoring is set to 0 (never monitor); Output is to my speakers with all digital voice synthesized; all protocols decoded; normal handling of group and private voice calls.

We I see the activity in the scope, I assume there's a transmission, but I get nothing.

I also have an SDS100 with DMR upgrade with the same frequencies copied over into a favourites list. I never hear anything, but I see when the talkgroup ID locks on with the text id, the slot #1 appears and I have full signal strength indicated. Utilities services is ON.

Is there something about the system I'm missing? Or have I the wrong settings in both monitors?

 

[sonm10]

I too am a fairly new DSD+ FL user. It maybe the signal gain is too high or too low. Use 'j' to decrease or shift 'j' to increase and watch the spectrum analyzer.

 

[cg]

If it isn't trunked, you don't need to run it as such. You can use -r1 but since it is the default, you don't need to have it in the batch file. If you use the menu, check the combined option You should see the protocol show up at the bottom and activity at the top of the Event Log window and see S1 and/or S2 in the Channel activity window.

Gain is g/G but isn't likely the issue.

 

[Kazzaw]

Is it possible for you to post a screenshot of your windows when decoding?

 

[rkillins]

Hi folks, my apologies for not acknowledging your contributions. Got caught up in life ...
Here's a screenie of my DSD+ FL working on WNH 169.4850. I can honestly say I'm not sure if I have this set up right.
Control is set as Combined CC/VC Monitor andoutput is set to synthesize all digital voice.

I've been watching my SDS100 when it stops on this frequency. It holds on the frequency, the signal bars illuminate, and there is a rapid flickering between DMR and CAP+.

It should be a strong signal as it's a utility with a large service area.

 

[Forts]

Well.... your volume in DSD+ is cranked way down, but other than that everything looks ok. Would need to see what's happening with a signal present, or, ideally... make a recording of the raw signal (press r in the DSD+ window to start/stop recording). Then we could take a closer look and see what's up.

 

[rkillins]

Thanks Forts, I'll see what I can do. I haven't seen a signal presence in a long time which has led me to believe I had configured something wrong. And then how I can't pick up anything on my radio using the RR database has me fearing that the database is off or there is something unique about the service.

 

[u2brent]

Is it encrypted or primarily data with little to no voice traffic

Waterloo County, Ontario (ON) Scanner Frequencies and Radio Frequency Reference

Scanner Frequencies and Radio Frequency Reference for Waterloo County, Ontario (ON)

www.radioreference.com

 

[rkillins]

Hi U2Brent ... I suppose anything is possible. But I do recall at one time having heard voice traffic on these freqs with DSD+, but that was a while ago. They could have changed things since then. I've only recently returned to DSD+ to monitor this after failing to do so with my radio. I thought I could pick up on something different than what RR was showing. I'm assuming DSD+ would show a transmission being encrypted?

 

[u2brent]

Yes, there would be an indication of encryption if there was voice traffic occurring.
It looks like the system on the RRDB page (which indicates conventional DMR signals) may be incorrect or has changed since the submission.
Your screenshot shows a DMR Tier 3 system which is a type of trunking. There is a good chance there are other frequencies involved that have not been discovered yet, So your puzzle may need more pieces added in order for DSD+FL to follow it properly. Of course; If there is little to no traffic to observe on the system, It could take a while to figure out what pieces are missing from the equation and how they fit together. That second frequency listed on the DB page may be a piece of that puzzle.

 

[bravo14]

If the system shows RAS is that where it don't show much info or don't hear no voice?

 

[rkillins]

u2Brent, how are you determining its a DMR TIII system from my screenshot? Just curious.
I did a TAFL search for Waterloo North Hydro, and this is what came up ...
Search Results
Not really sure what to do with this information.

 

[u2brent]

It's what is displayed on the bottom of the event window in your screenshot.

RadioReference.com - Scanner Frequencies and Radio Frequency Reference

www.radioreference.com

7K60FXD	2-slot DMR (Motorola MOTOTRBO) TDMA data
7K60FXE	2-slot DMR (Motorola MOTOTRBO) TDMA voice
7K60FXW	2-slot DMR (Motorola MOTOTRBO) TDMA data + voice

11K0F3E

Narrowband analog voice, considered by the FCC to be identical to 11K2F3E

Emission Designator - The RadioReference Wiki

wiki.radioreference.com

 

[rkillins]

Ohh ... OK. So now it's all starting to add up. It's not as simple as just a conventionl DMR system. Tier 3 systems can pretty tough to figure out right?

 

[u2brent]

Yes, Exactly..
There are generally more frequencies and variables (LSN/LCN) involved with a trunking system.. As opposed to a single conventional DMR frequency.. There needs to be proper data in the DSD frequencies file, as well as the translation to programming the scanner..

I'd concentrate some effort on the third frequency down on your list.

Waterloo North Hydro Inc.	WATERLOO, ERB ST. WEST REPEATER	169.485		7K60FXEXT	12.83	296	18		43.44222222	-80.58361111
Waterloo North Hydro Inc.	WOOLWICH TWP & WATERLOO	170.895	169.485	7K60FXEXT	17.65	341	0	5	43.54166667	-80.51083333
Waterloo North Hydro Inc.	WATERLOO, ERB ST. WEST REPEATER	172.56		7K60FXEXT	12.83	296	0	50	43.44222222	-80.58361111

 

[rkillins]

So, I'll go into DSD+ and set up a TIII system, but I still don't think I have enough info to start that.
I know the protocol (TIII), but not the networkID or the arealength for the networks file. I had been monitoring another local Tier 3 system, and it's network line has a value of 5 between the "Network Name" and the arealength value. I don't know what it represents, so I can with all truth claim I don't know what this value would be for this system.

I am certain of only one frequency for the frequency file (169.485), I suspect the siteNumber will be 1.1, don't know what the OTAchannelnumber is.

 

[BM82557]

I have used this utility -- LCN to Frequency calculator for DMR TIII while researching local TIII systems.

 

[rkillins]

Thanks BM ... is the LCN the same as the OTAchannelnumber that is needed in the frequency line?

 

[rkillins]

I'd concentrate some effort on the third frequency down on your list.

Waterloo North Hydro Inc.	WATERLOO, ERB ST. WEST REPEATER	169.485		7K60FXEXT	12.83	296	18		43.44222222	-80.58361111
Waterloo North Hydro Inc.	WOOLWICH TWP & WATERLOO	170.895	169.485	7K60FXEXT	17.65	341	0	5	43.54166667	-80.51083333
Waterloo North Hydro Inc.	WATERLOO, ERB ST. WEST REPEATER	172.56		7K60FXEXT	12.83	296	0	50	43.44222222	-80.58361111

Should I be looking for a control channel? A constant carrier? I know on my other TIII system DSD+ reports quite a bit of info in the Event log including current network, current site, and the system date and time. Should I expect similar with this?

 

[u2brent]

I don't know if a CAP Max system has a constant control channel like CON+ or moves around like CAP+ with a rest channel, I have no experience with that specific type, I've yet to come across and receive one personally.
Hopefully somebody here can answer that for us both, I did a bit of searching but failed to find an answer.