DMR systems

[FoeHammer]

Im not too familiar with it , but I am ham licensed & was considering trying out one of the dmr radios such as the TYT MD390 ,.. I am curious If I would also be able to use this radio to monitor some local dmr systems such as DMR Motorola Connect Plus (TRBO) TURBO CONNECT Plus (158) DMR Motorola Capacity Plus (TRBO) Would that be possible with this type of radio ? I used to listen to the kelcom systems back in the day & could hear towing , mourge/body removal , private investigators, security etc ,..so I imagine they are all on the new systems now,.. TYT Tytera TYT MD-380 DMR Handheld Digital Radio with LCD compatible with Motorola Digital Radio Brand of Radio TYT

 

[RayAir]

Im not too familiar with it , but I am ham licensed & was considering trying out one of the dmr radios such as the TYT MD390 ,.. I am curious If I would also be able to use this radio to monitor some local dmr systems such as DMR Motorola Connect Plus (TRBO) TURBO CONNECT Plus (158) DMR Motorola Capacity Plus (TRBO) Would that be possible with this type of radio ? I used to listen to the kelcom systems back in the day & could hear towing , mourge/body removal , private investigators, security etc ,..so I imagine they are all on the new systems now,.. TYT Tytera TYT MD-380 DMR Handheld Digital Radio with LCD compatible with Motorola Digital Radio Brand of Radio TYT

Yes, you can (in most cases) use your own DMR radio to monitor commercial or public safety systems using DMR technology.

You'll need to know the system frequencies, color code, time slots and group codes. You really need something like DSD+ to look at a system and get you the info you need to program your radio.

The data base on here might have some DMR systems in your area, but its better to be able to watch a system yourself so you can verify info and find things like new talk groups, how often they're used, is encryption being used, etc. DSD+ DSDPlus – Digital Decoder

DMR conventional repeater is the simplest to monitor.

Capacity Plus: you can conventionally scan one, or if you have a MotoTRBO radio and CPS and if you have the system info, you can follow groups as if you're a legit system user unless RAS or Enc are being used. Just set your radio to receive only.

Connect Plus: You have to passively scan a site with a radio because Con+ requires authentication to the system, or more advanced set ups of DSD+ can track groups across a Con+ TRS.

 

[RayAir]

Also, once you're at it for a while you'll discover a lot of tricks and workarounds to make DMR scanning easier.

 

[FoeHammer]

I dont have anything I can tap ,..The systems info is both in the database & I think some here locally have more knowledge on the systems ,.. I see this looks interesting , But I'm not sure why you would have to do it ,..If you can find the system info ,.. Jailbreak firmware now available for cheap digital walkie-talkie allowing DMR scanning: phasenoise

 

[FoeHammer]

"You'll need to know the system frequencies, color code, time slots and group codes. You really need something like DSD+ to look at a system and get you the info you need to program your radio."

Ok well here are 2 systems I would be interested in ,..I think I see everything there except timeslots ?
& does this also mean I can only monitor known programmed talkgroups ids? Is there a way to scan or search for new ones or does that just mean it will show a number hex rather than a name ? Im pretty sure there are more IDs on these systems than what is listed ,.. TURBO CONNECT Plus (158) Trunking System, Multiple Locations, Ontario - Scanner Frequencies Devonshire Mall Trunking System, Windsor, Ontario - Scanner Frequencies

 

[RayAir]

Devonshire Mall will be easiest to scan with an MD-380.

The Connect Plus system for the Windsor site is pretty large. You can still passively scan it with a 380, but you will only be able to program 16 channels per zone and are limited to 32 talk groups in your receive list. I didn't look exactly, but the Windsor site may be a 15 repeater site (29 talk paths). As stated above, you'll only be able to fit 16 talk paths in a zone using a 380.

So, the mall's one repeater (if db is correct) Capacity Plus system will be no issue, but the Con+ is a bit of a PITA using equipment like the 380. However, the 380 is better than a Motorola for passively scanning large Con+ sites.

If you get the radio and need programming help feel free to ask.

 

[FoeHammer]

Ok thanks so much RayAir It looks like dmr can be something to renew my interest in radio again then ,,,Got some house renovations to do ,& then figure out why my abs brake light is on ,..& then maybe a DMR radio is in my future

 

[RayAir]

Ok thanks so much RayAir It looks like dmr can be something to renew my interest in radio again then ,,,Got some house renovations to do ,& then figure out why my abs brake light is on ,..& then maybe a DMR radio is in my future

DMR renewed my interest. I started trying to decode EMS on a local Con+ last May. A year ago I knew very little about it. I now have 9 DMR radios being used mostly as scanners covering VHF/UHF and 800/900.

I would like to get into NXDN but unfortunately it's just not used much around here.

 

[mmisk]

To Foe Hammer: I sent you a private message about your ABS light being on.
It is about Ford "tone ring" failure.

Mike

 

[FoeHammer]

DMR renewed my interest. I started trying to decode EMS on a local Con+ last May. A year ago I knew very little about it. I now have 9 DMR radios being used mostly as scanners covering VHF/UHF and 800/900.

I would like to get into NXDN but unfortunately it's just not used much around here.

9 DMR radios Wow ,.. you jumped right in

 

[Forts]

Ray's comments about large Capacity Plus systems is definitely an issue. The majority of the DMR radios out there are limited to 16 channels in a scan list so you are immediately losing a bunch of talk paths when it comes to scanning these systems. If you are determined to listen in via a 'real' radio (and not DSD+ etc) then consider a Hytera radio as they allow 32 channels per scan list.

You shouldn't have any issues with the mall. That info was originally submitted by me a couple years back and as far as I know is still valid.

 

[RayAir]

I'm using a Hytera PD782 for Connect Plus scanning.
If you go the Hytera route, you can program in the voice frequencies as pseudo trunk channels. That way you just enter them in once (not twice, once for each slot)and you can fit that Windsor site in one zone. You'll want to leave out the control data channel though and just program TS:2 of the CC.

The Hytera will also allow more than 32 groups to scan in your receive list. I think I have about 45 groups I scan on a stateside Con+.

I took a listen and the Windsor site, 158-1 is coming in from my location. I'll program that site in my Hytera and take a listen. I'm just watching the CC with DSD+ right now.
Lakeshore FD (43011) and a few unid ones popped up so far.

Also I'm getting a Capacity Plus repeater on 420.785 1CC and TG-110 came up. This must be a Canadian system too.

 

[mciupa]

Also I'm getting a Capacity Plus repeater on 420.785 1CC and TG-110 came up. This must be a Canadian system too.

We have SysID 158-3 in Chatham using 420.775 here in Canada that you may be picking up.

I hope you can help us populate the database. Thanks for showing interest here.

 

[RayAir]

We have SysID 158-3 in Chatham using 420.775 here in Canada that you may be picking up.

I hope you can help us populate the database. Thanks for showing interest here.

No problem, a few groups that have popped up so far on the Windsor site are:
Unid's:
21079
21284
21380
21055

I'll see what I can do to try and ID some of these. Probably will take a while. It would be nice if TRBO had OTA alias like some NXDN systems use.

My Windsor days pretty much ended when I turned 21.

 

[FoeHammer]

I also wonder If instead of another radio with a tap , I could try one of those cheap sdr sticks & the appropriate software to analyze the system & get the info ,..something like this https://www.nooelec.com/store/sdr/sdr-receivers/nesdr-mini-rtl2832-r820t.html

 

[Forts]

Dongles are a great way to explore the other digital modes. I have several from dirt cheap eBay ones to the $200 AirSpy. My recommendation for someone starting out would be something like the Nooelec one you mentioned or one from rtl-sdr.com. I have one of theirs and it works great with next to no frequency drift.

 

[FoeHammer]

So with the tyt I would assume if the system to monitor is large with zones & tg's ,.there must be a trick to break it up into multiple zones or something to get around some of the limits ?

 

[FoeHammer]

Dongles are a great way to explore the other digital modes. I have several from dirt cheap eBay ones to the $200 AirSpy. My recommendation for someone starting out would be something like the Nooelec one you mentioned or one from rtl-sdr.com. I have one of theirs and it works great with next to no frequency drift.

Awesome Thx Forts From what I gather it's best to run 2 , one for control channel & the other as a tuner ...

Between thinking about getting a dmr radio & sdr dongle ,...I think I have a lot to learn ,..hopefully I'm not too old to learn new tricks ,...

I used to listen to the old kelcom systems probably 20 years ago now ,..they were chock full of tons of stuff ,..private investigators , security , tow trucks , taxi business ,..all sorts of things ,.. I dont see these things listed anywhere anymore ,but Im betting alot of them did migrate to the newer systems ,.. when our public safety went ENC & everything else switched to dmr ,...you can put ur scanner in search & just not come up with anything for hours now ,...

 

[Schumi1978]

Awesome Thx Forts From what I gather it's best to run 2 , one for control channel & the other as a tuner ...

Between thinking about getting a dmr radio & sdr dongle ,...I think I have a lot to learn ,..hopefully I'm not too old to learn new tricks ,...

I used to listen to the old kelcom systems probably 20 years ago now ,..they were chock full of tons of stuff ,..private investigators , security , tow trucks , taxi business ,..all sorts of things ,.. I dont see these things listed anywhere anymore ,but Im betting alot of them did migrate to the newer systems ,.. when our public safety went ENC & everything else switched to dmr ,...you can put ur scanner in search & just not come up with anything for hours now ,...

I too am new to DMR and in the learning stage like you. In my case, I invested in two of these Amazon.com: NooElec NESDR Mini 2 SDR & DVB-T USB Stick (RTL2832 + R820T2) with Antenna and Remote Control: Electronics as well as an unlimited subscription to the DSDPlus Fast Lane release to take the plunge in to the DMR world.

One dongle is driving an instance of FMP acting as the control channel monitor feeding an instance of DSDPlus that is decoding Control Channel activity. The second dongle drives a second instance of FMP acting as the trunk voice channel monitor and feeding a second instance of DSDPlus that is decoding the voice transmissions.

Great way to learn how Con+ and Cap+ systems work (as well as NEXEDGE). I've mapped out a handful of systems in my area and had them added to the DB to give back to the community here.

I'll soon take my next leap and purchase a DMR radio so I can go mobile (not very convenient lugging a laptop and other hardware around with you if want to hit the road but a cheap way to dive in and get your feet wet ).

I'm still in the very early stages of my DMR radio research and this site has been extremely helpful. I'll sure I'll be reaching out to the folks on here down the road when I'm ready to pull the trigger on a DMR radio purchase to get their experiences and advice.

Happy scanning!

 

[Forts]

You could break it into zones, yes... But it would be a pain flipping zones trying to follow a conversation. Doable, but certainly not ideal.

Hard to say who many of the users on these larger systems are. Honestly I don't think many people around here are paying any attention to them to much of a degree. I know I don't listen to the London site nearly as much as I could be.